<p>Looking for some info about Early Decision and "Financial Need". Last fall my junior daughter and I visited a private school that pushed ED. The Financial Aid person said that ED meant that my daughter would agree to turn down offers from all other schools. The only way to get out of the ED contract would be if "financial need" was not met. Does anyone know if "financial need" means anything above our EFC? My husband is a teacher who will retire at 60 after my daughter's 4th year at college. He makes a high salary now but we started teaching at very low salaries and it took us many, many years to pay off our BS/BA and then MS at Northwestern. They we had kids and bought a house, etc. etc. We are now in our third year of paying for our son's college. He has maximized unsubsidized loans and we are taking Parent Plus Loans which we are paying off each year so far. We have a $230,000 loan on our house which has dropped in value to $305,000 and NO savings account. We are relying on teacher's pension to retire - and the state will soon be increasing our contribution as well as the town increasing our insurance contribution. Our EFC is $35000 but our actual ability to pay is $17000. Should we avoid ED like the plague because of our EFC Gap? She has a 32 ACT and 4.5 GPA with lots of EC and leadership, but should I tell her not to bother applying to anything other than our state school? She is white and not a 1st generation college student, so no brownie points there.</p>
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<p>Yes. :)</p>
<p>If financial aid is an issue, then you want your daughter to apply to several schools and be able to compare offers. The offers she receives could vary dramatically (really, really dramatically!), and you want to be able to see them ALL in order to pick the best one.</p>
<p>But your financial situation doesn’t mean that she’s limited to your state university. Run the net price calculators for several schools, including your state school, and see what results you get.</p>
<p>Your daughter can also look at schools that offer merit awards, both automatic and competitive, that are completely unrelated to financial need. Look at these, for starters:</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1348012-automatic-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships-7.html#post15895768[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1348012-automatic-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships-7.html#post15895768</a>
<a href=“Competitive Full Tuition / Full Ride Scholarships - Financial Aid and Scholarships - College Confidential Forums”>Competitive Full Tuition / Full Ride Scholarships - Financial Aid and Scholarships - College Confidential Forums;
<p>And there are plenty of other smaller awards available, as well. Your daughter has lots of options . . . but ED probably isn’t one of them.</p>
<p>* Does anyone know if “financial need” means anything above our EFC? *</p>
<p>since the school determines what your “family contribution” will be (if this is a CSS school, then it’s anyone’s guess what that might be.</p>
<p>Our EFC is $35000 but our actual ability to pay is $17000. Should we avoid ED like the plague because of our EFC Gap? She has a 32 ACT and 4.5 GPA with lots of EC and leadership</p>
<p>If your EFC is unaffordable, then applying ED is NOT a good idea. </p>
<p>another problem with applying ED is this: When kids apply ED, many don’t bother submitting their other school apps until they see the results and FA offers from their ED schools. BIG MISTAKE. Those who find that they have unaffordable EFCs have now just missed most other schools’ deadlines for merit scholarship consideration. Many schools have Nov or Dec 1 deadlines for merit consideration - which is well before ED results come out. So, these kids are stuck. Very frustrating. </p>
<p>Since your D has an ACT 32 and a high GPA, she should submit a couple of early apps to schools that have rolling admissions and will FOR SURE award her large merit for her stats. </p>
<p>Look at is this way, if you can afford about $15k-17k per year, then that amount covers room, board, books, fees, and misc expenses. If she gets a full tuition merit scholarship, then your contribution covers the rest. :)</p>
<p>Sigh. ED can work, if you really know what you want, where you will certainly draw the affordability line, and understand how it works. The “you” goes for both parents and students. </p>
<p>ED can be wonderful If a student has a clear cut first choice school or knows s/he will have no regrets, be on cloud nine at a given school, and the parents feell the same way, it’s a great way to get the whole danged process over early and with one shot. I so envy those I know who did this.</p>
<p>For those who have financial need, it’s an issue. Though, yes, you can turn down an ED acceptance if you can’t afford it, “can’t afford” is a fuzzy term If you can truly draw a line at what the package has to be and stick to it, that’s one thing, but few of us can do that. The other thing, if your are of the mind that you don’t want to pay more than you have to for a college that’s acceptable, you are going to want to see what the market will bear. You get the ED offer in a vacuum. You have no idea whether any other comparable school will offer you more, or if that’s the best you are going to do. Again, if you are in absolute mode, it’s not an issue, but if every dollar makes a difference and you would take U Michigan for $35K a year, vs Now for $45k, or Grinnell over either for $25K, maybe ED is not for you. Do remember you will be dealing with those puppy dog eyes looking at you beg, begging that you say it’s a go, and it’s a long time until April and the RD offers if you say, it’s not doable and gotta throw it out and see how the other schools do. Hard to say no, if it is at all doable.</p>
<p>I don’t think ED carries nearly the overall advantage it used to, except for the student with truly top-notch stats, like near-perfect test scores and straight A’s. The ONLY way ED would be beneficial in your case is if you knew the out-the-door costs upfront with an acceptance, and it was a workable figure for you. And I don’t know if many ED colleges play ball that way.</p>
<p>Lot of moving parts with this specific situation. A sizable EFC gap, other kid’s PLUS loans to pay off, can’t really tap into home equity (not a good idea anyway BTW), and very good but not stellar stats.</p>
<p>I would firstly have ‘the talk’, maybe a series of talks with junior D (from my experience it takes multiple efforts to sink into skull 
). Say we’re all in this together, but we’re going to play the field here, and we have a year to do it. </p>
<p>If your moniker is an indication, she hopefully would have UIUC as pretty much a given with her stats, although even in-state the COA is approaching $30K. If that’s acceptable to both of you, get admitted at Champaign, meanwhile look at other options that D would potentially accept that would be less expensive. Ain’t going to be easy, either. Examine some smaller privates, in the Midwest and outside, that are looking for someone like your D. I assume that Northwestern is off your radar–you might get a little something there with your EFC, but not nearly enough, unless you consider $45-$50K/year a good value for N’Western.</p>
<p>Everyone has a saga. Is your husband REQUIRED to retire at 60? Could he find other jobs at 60? I do not think need based aid should be there to subsidize people retiring at 60.</p>
<p>Kayf, need based aid does subsidize those who retire at 60, quit work at any age for any reason. Anyone can go for it. Reduce income drastically and if there are not the assets to offset it, absolutely, any student is eligible for financial aid if the family income is not up there for ANY REASON. They don’t care what the reason is. It’s the hard number. For mid year reconsiderations things like death, illness, abrupt job loss are taken into to consideration to revise given awards, but when the new award year arises, it’s that AGI that largely determines what the aid package is Even if the person decided to quite ONLY to get more financial aid. THe motive isn’t at issue. If someone chooses to live at a lower income level and take the chances with financial aid if college is involved, let the person so do.</p>
<p>Cpt, yes FEDERAL aid will subsidize 60 YO retirees. As we all know, federal aid is limited. Are you telling me that in general institutional aid will subsidize early retirees, stay at home moms (other than with preschool age or SN kids), etc? I certainly hope not.</p>
<p>Sure does. In fact, I don’t know any college that goes into the reasons as to why someone is not working or earning so little. It’s just the bottom line income figure that counts. A couple with an PROFILE income that is $60K will get the same financial aid regardless of whether it is generated from one parent or the other. The why is not an issue at all. Some private K-12 schools are getting snitty about this, so I know some moms who just take a part time job making nominal income and say they are looking for a job and maybe even apply at the school for work, and that takes care of that. So really, it doesn’t matter if both parents are sitting there on the dole. I know families here whose kids are on some very nice financial aid from top schools, and neither parent works much at all. They live off of loans from family members. ,My neighbor across the street does not work, and her DH makes no where nearly enough to live the way they do. Pappa built their house, and slapped a mortgage on it and they pay what they can, and borrow each year off of their inheritance. Girls go to Colgate, Leigh and one graduated from Gettysburg, and they got over $40K in institutional aid, mostly grants. Happens all of the time. My brother is an early retiree,and I am a SAHM. My mother never worked outside the home either and did not earn a cent after marriage. All of us got generous financial aid from top 25 institutions.</p>
<p>Where PROFILE schools usually crack down is when there are divorced parents and one won’t pay but has the income. Where FAFSA will give such a student a zero EFC even, if the custodial parent has a very low income, which means full PELL $5600, full Staffords even subsidized, and the kid is eligible for work study (and in this case state money was granted too since it was based on the FAFSA), PROFILE schools refused to give a NCP waiver and with the huge income that the father had, there was no award from any privates.</p>
<p>But the kids went to state schools and got close to full rides from them through financial aid. The parents made an agreement to milk the schools of the aid and make it up later in terms of settlements. And it worked spectacularly, to the tune of about $200K between two kids. It does happen. All done legally too.</p>
<p>But SAHM parents and those who early retire or just quit for no reason, no, there are no penalties from any college I know, other than the inherent risks of the fin aid/ merit aid lottery, and of course having to live on a lower income.</p>
<p>Good reason to stop contributing to my college, thanks for the input. Why should I work past 60 to support people who want to stay home. Thanks!!</p>
<p>If you suspect that your expected contribution in $30,000+ and you can only afford $17,000 then you have probably answered your own question. That said if there is a competitive scholarship that is not contingent on need and your D is competitive for that scholarship you could possibly proceed with caution. Those types of scholarships are generally prominently displayed on the college website. Another option might be this summer to ask if the financial aid office would do an early read on your situation and give some guidance. The timing of ED acceptance release is problematical since many of the EA colleges have scholarship deadlines that are right around the time of the ED acceptances and generally the ED acceptance and deposits are due very quickly after the acceptance. It takes a well organized plan of rolling, acceptable EA colleges simultaneous to the ED application if financial aid is a strong consideration. Also for some but not all colleges is it not quite as simply as ‘Thanks but no thanks’ as the purpose of ED is for kids to enroll if accepted. Read the fine print on the actual college website regarding ED do not simply check the boxes on the common app.</p>
<p>If you suspect that your expected contribution in $30,000+ and you can only afford $17,000 then you have probably answered your own question</p>
<p>^^^
This</p>
<p>In my opinion, the only people who should apply ED are those that either are poor, have no “special circumstances,” and will get a free ride or those who are well set to pay whatever a school asks them to pay. </p>
<p>I can’t think of any reason to apply ED to a school that will likely expect the family to pay nearly twice the amount that the family can afford to pay. </p>
<p>Anyone with an unaffordable EFC should consider:</p>
<p>1) Applying to schools where the merit is so big that the remaining costs are what you can afford to pay. (as a back up, a couple of these schools should give ASSURED large merit so you have some financial safeties in your back pocket)</p>
<p>2) (if stats are good enough): Applying to the super aid schools (HYPS) who will likely only expect you to pay about 10% of your income unless you have special circumstances (lots of assets, NCP income, business income, etc).</p>
<p>3) Applying to schools that can be commuted to if the costs are affordable.</p>
<p>Keep in mind that merit gets applied to NEED first. If the school costs $50k and you have a $30k EFC, and you get a $15k merit scholarship, then that does NOT reduce your contribution at all.</p>
<p>Kayf, I know very few programs that MAKE a person work to get aid. They do not go into the circumstances that thoroughly. One our biggest drains right now on our social system is disability claims. No one wants to give it up. And yet, there are often those with the same disabilities out there working. Just a tip of that dangerous iceberg.</p>
<p>But it’s been said in many posts when people are resentful that this family or other should be getting large financial aid because they have such low income, that ANYONE can do the same. Just stop working. Do so a couple of years before your kid applies to colleges, and then your kid can enter the same financial aid lottery that others with the same family income level do, as long as you don’t have a lot of assets. Those whose kids get accepted to those schools with the money, guarantees and awards, yup, could make out. Has always been that way. </p>
<p>You want to start going that way, what about the guy with a Wharton degree, who prefers to work for a pittance at a parochial school and so his family income is low? It could be said he is underemployed, yes. Garland’s husband gave up his medical practice to teach (she’s an active board member). So what? You want the process to assess why each family makes or does not make the income one proports it should? The process would cost more than it gives out doing that. It goes on the hard numbers, and it’s been enough of a pain and cost to verify them.</p>
<p>Cpt, OP said her husband was going to retire. Not go work for a public service place, not go work for parochial school, but retire. How hard is it to ask where someone worked for the last 5 years? I do not think I should work and contribute so people can sit on the beach. Sorry we disagree.</p>
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<p>This is important also and something I did not totally understand in 2006 when I went through this the first time. The same applies at most colleges and unis with outside scholarships. My oldest got $1000 from a local organization and I thought “oh good that is a $1000 I don’t need to pay” but the reality was his school took away $1000 from their scholarship to him.</p>
<p>OP states
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<p>It looks like he is planning on working until his Daughter finishes college.</p>
<p>Sybbie, if OP expects not to take loans because her DH is retired, my response, is, he should plan on working longer. Or kid may have to look for merit aid.</p>
<p>Kayf, there may be good reason for someone to early retire, Like being forced to do so by the company, and recognizing that employment prospects in the field are not so good at age 60, or perhaps there is some health issue in the picture. </p>
<p>Really, the schools could care less what the reasons are when it comes to the bottom line. It’s the income that pretty much drives the financial aid process, and schools really don’t care an iota about why you don’t want loans. Heck, they expect EFC zero families to take out loans. So the OP is thinking out loud. </p>
<p>I had a old friend (and I had no idea how old he was) who took out over a quarter million in PLUS loans, knowing his days were numbered due to dire cancer diagnosis and he died two years ago, not repaying a dime. His girls got a free ride to their very expensive LAC, all on Uncle Sam and Aunt Sallie Mae who get their funding from us.</p>
<p>I think retiring at 60 or being a SAHM is the same thing as having a bank account you don’t want to use for college. OPs fact are that her DH is a teacher and retiring.</p>