An anal rape, according to her. @momofthreeboys, you don’t believe her, but it’s a mystery to me how you are able to make the determination that she is not telling the truth, based on no evidence.
Oh, my error.
@Hanna, there have been so many high-profile cases lately, both cases where rapists have been convicted and cases where accused rapists are not found guilty. It’s hard to keep all the details straight.
@Hanna From the Columbia Spectator on why they published Nungesser’s name:
“In the interest of transparency, we want to explain our thinking. We made the decision to publish his name for a combination of reasons. First, and most importantly, because Sulkowicz filed a police report this week, the information in that report—including the name of the suspect—is publicly available. Furthermore, Sulkowicz and other students have said that she and two other women filed separate complaints against Nungesser through the University. Although these students have said that he was found “not responsible” in each case, the fact remains that three women have now accused Nungesser of sexual assault through the University’s adjudication process. Finally, Nungesser’s name was one of four listed on flyers and bathroom stalls this week, putting him at the center of the campus controversy surrounding sexual assault. When we considered these three factors together, we decided it would be irresponsible for Spectator to keep his name hidden.”
More importantly the advocates that Emma associated with had painted the names of the men on a bathroom wall in May - a good reason and probably on advice of an attorney to COA with a police report in May and then retract support for the charge - but it got the name public in a way that protected her from slander or defamation charges.
And Fang I happen to believe all Emma’s sexual encounters with the young man were consensual…what they did in bed is of really no interest to me, that is between the two of them. Apparently the college felt the same way.
You made a conclusion that the sex was consensual, based on no evidence at all either way.
Columbia did not “feel the same way.” That is, Columbia did not conclude the sex was consensual; you are misrepresenting what their conclusion means. They refused to find Nungesser responsible because there wasn’t evidence either way. That’s not the same as concluding the sex was consensual, and you are lying in saying that your conclusion and Columbia’s conclusion are the same.
alh - is that the lady who tried to extort money from the football player if he went to the NFL to “keep silent?” If so, her credibility went down the toilet. But I admit I don’t follow football so don’t know much other than some basic headlines.
The problem I have with most of your posts @momofthreeeboys is that you are willing to draw conclusions when all the facts have not yet been established. And I think that shows a real bias that affects your thinking. You are so, so sure in all these cases.
In this thread, dealing with the women in the Columbia case, you throw around terms like “wacky woman” and “silly girl”, and suggest Emma might just be “vicious” or even “mentally disturbed.” Even when information of a new allegation by “Adam” comes to light , you exhibit no effort to even consider that there just might be more to this story. Especially since it seems very likely that his reporting to ADP was prior to the assault on Emma. I think most posters here who have exhibited a willingness to value the truth above personal biases have all said this is a very difficult case to figure out. Yet you are so sure.
There is also the thread on the Vanderbilt case where with the exception of your one post commenting on bystanders not taking any action, you go silent. A clear cut case with video proof of the attack and yet you, as a self proclaimed “second wave feminist”, have not one word of support for this woman or one word of reproach for these men. Nada, nothing, zilch, zero. Why is that? Is she somehow responsible as well? While you aggressively comment where you perceive transgressions by a female, you go silent when there is video proof of a pretty vicious attack by a group of men??? Second wave feminist? What am I missing here?
In the old UVA thread you were pretty clear on your opinion of jackie and have no problem continuing to malign her. Yet as of yesterday the updated statement coming from Virginia police, who certainly have more facts than you do, hasn’t changed much and is still as follows:
" it’s investigation has found no evidence that the brutal gang rape happened at Phi Kappa Psi fraternity, as the Rolling Stone story alleged. However, the police have not ruled out that Jackie was raped – possibly even gang raped, somewhere else, perhaps on a different day. The investigation is ongoing, and police aren’t releasing any other details of what they’ve found."
I will accept whatever that investigation concludes, but I just don’t see how a reasonable, rational person can draw such definitive conclusions without waiting to hear what facts have been established by the appropriate authorities.
The type of rigid thinking you exhibit on these threads is a little bit frustrating and responding feels like “administering medicine to the dead”; yet dialogue is so important in arriving at solutions.
347
The repeated name calling of Emma, on two or three threads, has really disturbed me.
pittsburghscribe, I love your post. I love HarvestMoon1’s post.
Alh, thanks for the links.
@bearpanther, thanks for posting that story from the BDH. It’s heartening to see steps in the right direction.
You are correct Harvest. I have no comments on the Vanderbilt case because it went how it should, evidence --, trial – conviction. What should i say - Yippee this proves that all men are rapists? Every month people are found guilty of criminal sexual assault or rape in this county and that is a good thing. They are presumed innocent until found guilty by a court of law and if found guilty they deserve their punishment. I’ve never said anything different. I absolutely have opinions on cases that people are re-trying in the court of the media and public opinion that have already been tried by universities and/or investigated by the police and found to not have cause. Why do you feel the intense need to change my mind “with medicine?” my opinions are held by more than me and it would be a pretty one-sided discussion if everyone nodded their head and agreed that all accusers are telling the truth and all accused are guilty until they prove themselves innocence.
The UVa thread is dead because there is nothing more to say until the police release a report on their investigation. Somewhere and I’m sure i could find it if I cared, I said that something might have happened to Jackie but it wasn’t what she claimed and reported in RS.
It is splitting hairs to say that because a university found a defendant “not-guilty” and the police and prosecutors determine a case is not able to be tried that the person is “still guilty” because heck we have to believe all accusers. I can’t go there sorry and I absolutely believe that people are innocent until PROVEN guilty. You are of course also entitled to your opinion.
Emma put herself out there for scrutiny. Sorry if you are offended that I find her to be a bully. I don’t think I’ve ever called her vicious in a post, silly yes, vicious no.
Momofthreeboys, you are entitled to your opinions.
You don’t know Emma. You don’t know Erica. Where did this comment about the FSU girl being an extortionist come from? Who would make a comment like that without knowing the facts? So where did this comment come from?
I’ve already said I don’t know much of anything about the Florida case. The only thing I recall was something being discussed during a football game on TV. and thought maybe that was that case and asked. I said in another post that I don’t know Emma…I even said maybe I’d like her if I knew her on record. I’m done with the attacks - go find my posts if someone wants to quote me. My conscience is clear. You all can have a nice big hug fest.
People who are thoughtful, and understand that there is nuance in the world, know that if a dean, or a police officer, or a prosecutor, or a juror is faced with deciding a rape case, they might have one of three beliefs.
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He did it! There’s video, or witnesses, or physical evidence, or his own admission of his activities. I’m confident (to the level of certainty I need) that this guy raped her.
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He’s innocent! He was in Antigua, or what she says he did wasn’t rape, or there were her five friends were right there and say she was dead sober and it was consensual, or her friends say she told them she was making up a false accusation. He didn’t do it.
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I don’t know! He says one thing, she says another, I know that many accusations are true but I can’t tell about this one. Even though I think he might be guilty, I don’t know he’s guilty, so I must let him off.
People who say that a failure to convict means they know the accused person is innocent are conflating I know he didn’t do it with I don’t know if he did it. That’s sloppy thinking. Not being convicted doesn’t mean OJ was innocent.
From the first two pages and then I stopped reading and copying:
8 * the mattress dragger*
13 *spoiled little rich girl*
17 *She may be right or mentally ill, or just vicious*
I stand corrected, I did use the word vicious. I don’t recall that but would retract that and use vindictive for a “v” word.
Momofthreeboys, I am reading your posts. Post 346.
My opinion… Let’s not judge too much when we don’t know 
I look at FSU… 55 women go to the police. 2 arrests. I don’t know how many arrests there should be out of 55. I can’t compute an exact number but 2 looks a little light.
bearpanther: Thank you for that link. Education is how we will get ourselves out of this situation.
336 [quote] Women can charge assaulters with crimes, but statistically most sexual assaults against women go unreported so whether women "can" is perhaps not the right question. What can we do as a society to make it so that: 1) women are less frequently the subject of sexual assault; and 2) if a woman is assaulted, she feels comfortable coming forward.
[/quote]
I really like this. Maybe we should concentrate on these points, particularly #1.