<p>Link should work now…</p>
<p>Thanks. That is a beautiful ship!</p>
<p>MidWestFather - comparing Swarthmore to any of the other high quality small engineering schools that you mentioned is an “apples and oranges” comparison, in my opinion. My son had a lot of interest in Swarthmore engineering and in the end didn’t apply because it lacks the techy environment that the others offer. Swarthmore is an incredible intellectual environment. I think that their engineering program is far more theoretical in its approach. They will teach more about how to “think” as an engineer, rather than how to “do” as an engineer. Olin and Rose-Hulman are MUCH more hands on than Swarthmore. If your daughter would enjoy the more liberal arts environment or has interest in double majoring/minoring in a humanities area than Swarthmore is an excellent choice. Rice is exceptional and offers a nice balance to these two options - very rigorous engineering, but broader than engineering in the sciences/humanities than Olin/RHIT. If your daughter has an interest in working as an engineer immediately after school, I think other options are better than Swarthmore. If she has an interest in going on for PhD - Swarthmore is tops.</p>
<p>Swarthmore’s engineering program is tiny - about 20 students/year. The faculty are good but it’s a subscale program. They are renovating one building but still it’s small. I think many students go for further schooling because they are not fully ready for an engineering job without more in-depth studies. Do you really want to be committed to another 5-6 years in school!</p>
<p>Olin is a very small school but you get half-tuition and it has strong job placement stats.</p>
<p>If you’re interested in a LAC with engineering consider Harvey Mudd (highly competitive) or Lafayette (very competitive). Both have sizable engineering programs and strong liberal arts components.</p>
<p>LakeClouds: The program is subscale but not sub-standard? The placement statistics (2004-2012 student outcomes) show a number of engineering graduates taking jobs in industry and consulting, but, supporting one of your points, the graduate school attendees appear to be more numerous and more impressive.</p>
<p>Engineering is frequently listed among the top desired majors for incoming students. My alumni interviewer said in his freshman year (he graduated in 2010), 75 students out of ~370-400 wanted to be engineering majors, ~26 graduated with a BS in engineering. Many students come to Swat wanting to do engineering, and either figure it’s not for them, or find something new that is more interesting to them (a lot end up doing CS). It’s subscale in the sense that not many seniors end up as engineering majors, but it’s not subpar in the sense that Swat engineers are still highly regarded - many end up in finance, consulting, or grad school, though if you want to go straight into industry it is probably more difficult coming out of Swat.</p>
<p>A lot depends upon what kind of engineering program fits you. Swarthmore engineering has far fewer opportunities for research than larger research universities. While academically well connected, I don’t think Swarthmore can come close to their co-op opportunities either. For many people those are extremely important. My impression of Swarthmore Engineering is that it is outstanding for what it offers. It is highly theoretical, teaches engineers how to be well rounded, and offers a fundamental study of the field - but many limitations as well.</p>
<p>To the OP, another alternative for your D is to consider a combined program. Columbia, Cal Tech, WashU, Dartmouth, and RPI are among the engineering programs that offer combined degree programs with various LAC. While in theory this commits the students to 5 years of study, many can do it in less. My S will be attending one of those programs and it will end up being a 2.5-2 because of AP credits etc. Swarthmore was one of the schools he originally considered, but the engineering was not hands on enough for him although when he sat in on classes he found them fascinating and the profs very engaging. He wanted the more traditional labs with machinery etc. One thing he also considered was Swat and supplementing some courses at UPenn which also has a “traditional” engineering program, but he decided that probably wasn’t really a practical solution. GL to your D!</p>
<p>Just one addition to KarateDad’s comment. If your D is eligible for financial aid, it is my understanding that the aid does not transfer to the other institution.</p>
<p>I’m sure experience is different at different colleges, but several of the colleges we visited with D1 and S1, when questioned about 2-3 or 3-2 programs, admitted that almost no one ever really does the programs, even though they are advertised prominently in the colleges’ brochures. The reason being - hardly anyone wants to leave the college with all the friends they’ve made in the past 3 years to spend their 4th and 5th year someplace new, and miss out on their senior year at their first alma mater. So for anyone seriously interested in 3-2 or 2-3 programs, as detailed questions about not only the programs themselves, but how many students in recent years have completed those programs.</p>
<p>^ I have heard that as well dadx3, however, I know that at my son’s LAC there are at least 2 others besides him starting next year in the Dartmouth 2-1-1-1 program and at least another from his year that plans on doing the Columbia program the year after as a 3-2. For my S, it was just a matter of deciding which program he wanted more. Columbia’s is a guaranteed admission program, but he had to apply and be accepted to the Dartmouth program. As for GVA mom’s comment, I’m really not sure, but I remember reading that at the Dartmouth program, the first year students get FA from their home college as a visiting student (at Middlebury this begain in 2012), then on the 5th year they are eligible like any other Dartmouth student for need based aid. For Columbia, I believe students are eligible for need based aid for both years. Not sure about the other programs because my S never really considered them.</p>
<p>The engineering is good but very general. There is some specialization that you can do in, say, computer engineering or environmental engineering, but not as much as you could do at a larger or more specifically technical school. Swat’s engineering program is really intended for those who want to double major (it requires 12 engineering courses, or 20 courses if you include the other required sciences and math, so you can add on even a humanities or social science if you are committed to doing so) or are dead set on going to grad school.</p>
<p>I think the 2-1-1-1 option is much more viable than the 3-2. Since many students are already away at study abroad programs in their junior year, it’s less of a problem. that is when the 2-1-1-1 engineering students study their first “masters” year at the engineering school (Dartmouth, etc.). Then students return with everyone else for their senior year and complete their second “masters” year at the engineering school after LAC graduation. Allows them to stay connected with their undergrad peers.</p>