<p>I do look at the bill rates…and you’re wrong. You worked at two big 4 firms? Only the worst of the worst go from a big 4 to another big 4. </p>
<p>Don’t listen to this clown. I just finished the GMAT and got a 740. I passed all four CPA exam parts on the first try. All but REG on 5 days of studying. GMAT scores are not indicative of talent NOR are they automatically indicative of supreme intelligence. Hard work and a willingness to learn is what will help you succeed. And because the Big 4 are some of the most prestigious places to work right out of school than I would say you’re angry or bitter like all the other 3 rated associates or people who have to leave one big 4 to go to another. </p>
<p>You’re naive and clueless. I don’t drink the kool-aid and pretend like the work doesn’t blow or that I should “stay until senior manager” but Big 4 is an awesome place to launch a career. I’ve met CFOs of fortune 25 companies, gone to Europe, etc. </p>
<p>So…if the Big 4 is so below this guy…what do you suggest he/she do?</p>
Don’t know what to say here. You are either lying or you just see the ridiculous standard bill rates before discount (which end up being 60% on some of the accounting engagements). I work on the firm’s actual billing data, and I can only assume you’re going off what you’ve heard through the grapevine.</p>
<p>
I shouldn’t even respond to this, but I’ll just say I was good enough to make senior in 2 years, and good enough as a senior to be transferred to an specialty group where my compensation is significantly better.</p>
<p>This is all I’ll say about me and my reliability as a source of information. As you can see above, there are some people that are happy as Big 4 accountants. Just take my perspective into consideration.</p>
<p>
If he has the business school opportunities he says he does, he should go to business school. Are you seriously suggesting this Big 4 plan is a good idea?</p>
<p>And what if you don’t want to work in a more “selective” business profession? Lots of people really are there because they didn’t want to work in consulting or investment banking. I, along with a bunch of other people I know, decided to go this way because we didn’t like consulting and didn’t want to spend 100 hours a week working in investment banking. (yes I know, busy season, 80 hour work weeks, etc. etc. it’s not a constant stream of work overload, though.)</p>
<p>And yes, while those four schools are definitely not Ivies, they are very prestigious and hard to get into. Go look at their pages on this forum and see how many people are dying to get in. At the Big 4 where I interned last summer, 20% of the interns were from Cal, another 20% were from either USC, UCLA or BYU. About 10-15% were from CSUs. Also keep in mind that not all of the top prestigious schools have accounting majors/minors because they target different fields. That doesn’t mean that accounting isn’t worth the school’s effort, it just means that the school has a different plan. </p>
<p>The reason there are more people from less prestigious universities in the accounting field as opposed to consulting or ibanking is because of the volume of people they hire and need to hire. Compare the size of consulting’s Big 3 to accounting’s Big 4. </p>
<p>And you really just compared McDonald’s CEO to accounting firm partners? Way to compare apples to oranges. </p>
<p>And I agree that the specialty practices in the Big 4 are where the big money and the most interesting work are, but a 22 year old right out of college being paid a good $52-$55K to get some great professional expertise could be much worse off.</p>
<p>Just curious, what do people think about CSUS MSAcct program? It is AACSB accredited but it’s completely online. Tuition is roughly around $17,000 and it’s a 18 month pogram. I know being online is looked down upon but on the plus side it does give you the option of working so that you don’t have to take out student loans</p>
<p>i’ve worked with some pretty bright people but i believe big 4 holds you back in terms of being able to think outside of the box. nothing that we do really hasn’t been done before. we are just followers instead of being innovators. i guess that’s why many of the truly talented leave.</p>
<p>anyways i leave you with this awesome dog video:</p>
<p>What I’m getting from this conversation is that unless i drop 40k for USC I’ll have a hard time getting an interview? :\ </p>
<p>I am pretty competitive in classes, and could see myself doing reasonably well at CSUF. My biggest concern is just that I was not a business major in undergrad. How bad will this hurt me on the interviews, which you guys are making it seem impossible to get? I believe I have a strong CV otherwise. If there is a small chance of getting hired out of CSUF, I’d rather go there than go 30k more in debt for USC.</p>
<p>A main reason I want to work at Big4 besides my fondness of accounting is that it will expose me to a bunch of different companies (I want to do audits), and hopefully I get to do some travel. I have a family business that is doing pretty well, but my father doesn’t want to give me any executive positions until I “prove myself” by getting experience at major corporation and get my CPA. It’s a confusing time in my life, and any guidance is really appreciated. If you guys have any suggestions for my educational career that will help lead me to Big4, I welcome any feedback.</p>
<p>that’s not true at all. I go to the University of Northern Iowa and all of the Big 4 firms recruit here yearly, and give out plenty of interviews. just go to the best school for the money that big 4 recruits at, get good grades, get involved, and just work hard.</p>
<p>Not at all. UCLA is also very heavily recruited in the LA area. Tons of people that I have classes with interned at the Big 4 this past summer. In terms of interviews, it won’t hurt you at all, but you do need to have accounting classes. If you have a strong CV and a high GPA, network and meet some professionals and apply through your career center.</p>
<p>What I was saying in my post is that while it is much easier to get a job at a Big 4 if you are at a prestigious university, they do hire from CSUs and other less prestigious universities. The difference is you need to stand out more and they hire less people. As long as there is a presence on your campus, you have a good shot.</p>
<p>I wouldn’t go as far as to say you won’t get an interview if you went to CSUF, but I think you have to be pretty spectacular since there are so many strong schools that feed the SoCal region. The schools I’ve seen the most are: Cal, UCLA, USC, UCSB, CPSLO, Chapman, UCI, USD and every so often I see a CSUF/CSULB/CSULA/CSUN resume. Definitely don’t see as much CSU representation though and I’m not exactly sure why that is. Maybe you should look into some of the other programs I mentioned. I definitely think UCSB Biz/Econ + accounting is very strong and is an “affordable” alternative as opposed to USC.</p>
<p>^
Typically, there are two kinds of people pursue master of accounting. 1) Those whose under degree is non accounting, they need the acct/busi course in the MAcc program to be CPA eligible. 2) Those who are rejected by big-4 and want to have a second chance since big-4 entry level only recruit thru campus. </p>
<p>The MAcc for non-acct major covers similar materials that BAcc covers in terms of acct curriculum, I don’t see why a master should look better than a bachelor’s who are ready to sit for CPA.</p>
<p>daveclass: In practice, its hard to differentiate candidates on paper since all the resumes I’ve seen have been pretty “cookie cutter” resumes. Let’s say a recruiter hands me these resumes, a fairly typical stack of strong candidates:</p>
<p>Candidate A - CSUF MAAc, 3.65 GPA
Candidate B - USC undergrad, 3.55 GPA
Candidate C - UCLA undergrad, 3.50 GPA
Candidate D - UCSB undergrad, 3.60 GPA
Candidate E - CSUN undergrad, 3.70 GPA</p>
<p>I honestly wouldn’t be able to tell them apart on paper, all things being equal. Sure, the CSU students have overall stronger GPAs and one has a MAAc, but being a USC alum, I know a 3.55 GPA undergrad at USC is no slacker. Equal playing ground for me from that perspective. This is where 2nd round interviews come into play. How well does each student come off? What is the general consensus from all their interviews? Do they carry themselves well?</p>
<p>If they interview well, then they’ll have a shot regardless, provided they have strong academic records to begin with.</p>
<p>I’m currently a sophomore accounting student with a 3.0 GPA. Currently I am taking Financial Accounting and have a 0.6. I took accounting in high school and have been studying like crazy for the class and still managed to fail this class with a tutor. Should I transfer and complete my accounting major at a smaller school? Or is this a red flag and I should change my major? (I don’t know what else I can major in and find a stable job so that’s why I chose accounting)</p>
<p>Starstruck, you might want to take it again and see how you do. However, it isn’t a good omen. You might want to consider changing majors. You will find that accounting is the same at all schools. They use the same books and teach the same stuff. Yes, you might have a better teacher,but it is risky to assume this will be the case.</p>
<p>Moss, candidate E would look best overall. You might get lucky and have some partners who are USC/UCLA grads. They tend to be both plentiful in California and supportive of alumni. If that is the case, you could get hired.</p>
<p>Frankly, I think all of the choices given would be good candidates for big 4.</p>
<p>The first page says that in most cases it doesn’t matter which college you go to as long as it is accredited. However, if I plan on having a good chance for employment nationwide and not just regionally, would it be a good idea to go to a national University instead of a regional one? for example going to Ole Miss vs. Georgia College and State. Or does that not even matter? Thanks so much!</p>
<p>taxguy: All look good (on paper). Interviewing skills will get them the offer. Although you never know… I’ve seen 3.7+ UCLA grads get fired for poor performance. It’s always a hit or miss. You just do the best you can to identify the best individuals - then you hope you made the right choice once they start the job.</p>
<p>I agree, all are great candidates and should be interviewed. My roommate from freshman year graduated in three years with almost a 4.0. However he was an awkward kid and even though he had interviews with all 4 Big 4 and some midtiers, he didn’t get past the first round with the Big 4 and had to settle on working for a midtier in Tax. GPA is simply a way to get your foot in the door, it’s definitely the personality that has to stand out.</p>