<p>kafka: Both Exeter and Andover embarrassed Avon in football this year I believe...</p>
<p>Hotchkiss has nowhere near the prestige of either school. if you want a number, look at endowment. it is not a widely recognized school in the world abroad either. you really cannot argue that another school can so closely compare with E/A. that's just a joke. hotchkiss. and your input really cannot be appreciated because you go to that school...</p>
<p>also exeter's goalie this year came from starting at avon last year. he wanted to play for a better school. i spoke with him after the game.</p>
<p>kafka: and what do you mean particularly E...</p>
<p>exeter beat andover in football, hockey, and basketball this year.</p>
<p>exeter beat deerfield in hockey.</p>
<p>andover beat deefield in football and tied them in hockey.</p>
<p>you support nothing of what you have said.</p>
<p>we30: yeah interesting game. kreider scored on the back-up for exeter. kreider is incredible. he didn't score on fenkell though, who has to be one of the best goaltenders in the league at the moment</p>
<p>Kafka:
I said "co-ed" athletic program, which eliminates Avon/Salisbury from the discussion.
Also, I mentioned Hotchkiss in my post, as they had one of the greatest athletic seasons ever this fall. However, is there any doubt that A/E are two "of the" best, as I said? </p>
<p>Let's look at some stats. Andover's fall results against Deerfield:
Cross-Country Boys - Win
Cross-Country Girls - Win
Field Hockey - Win
Football - Win
Soccer Boys - Win
Soccer Girls - Win
Volleyball Girls - Win
Water Polo Boys - Win and a Loss</p>
<p>In total, Andover went 8-1 against Deerfield this fall. They are 7-3-1 against the Big Green this winter. Do you want to explain to me how they could consider themselves a dominant force in New England, but not A or E? Maybe you're just talking about lacrosse?</p>
<p>First of, Among those in the knowingly regarded as A and E. Sure the average person in the street is more likely to recognize A and E but among the people that matter Hotchkiss is defiantly just as just as prestigious as A and E. I could even make the case that among the upper crust of society in certain places such as NY Hotchkiss is even more prestigious than A and E for the simple reason that so many Hotchkiss alums operate in those spheres and the some of the most dominant voices on wall street are from Hotchkiss alums - far more so than Andover or Exeter alums. If you want to look at endowment numbers then sure Exeter and Anvdover have more money .... BUT when you look endowment PER STUDENT which is a more accurate Gage of an institutions financial muscle Hotchkiss has more money than Andover - so according to your logic it is more prestigious. Plus if you look at other numbers like average SAT score Hotchkiss beats out Andover yet again. But anyways this is childish banter. I don't want to lower myself to such arguments. So should I then claim that Hotchkiss is MORE prestigious than Andover ? </p>
<p>I merely did not approve of the way you phrased your claim "(Hotchkiss is probably up there)" which suggested that A and E were better than Hotchkiss which simply is not true .... As I said A and E have decent programs but they play in a weaker league than Hotchkiss among other things so what I was trying to say is that there are other schools in Erickson who are not as well regarded as A and E that would beat them in certain sports. That is a fact. BUT since you did say co-ed then i suppose there may be some truth to what you say but they are certainly not at the top of the league as you seem to imply. </p>
<p>As for deerfield, I just based that on anecdotal evidence. Hotchkiss is the best team sports wise in NE and the sports men here seem to consider deerfield as their closest rival so it is on that basis that I hold deerfield in high regard. As you pointed out since they do well against deerfield then I suppose they must be rather good. </p>
<p>Lastly your statement about Hotchkiss not being known abroad is absolutely false. I know quite a number of people from Eton and members of the British upper class. All of them know Hotchkiss particularly after Lord Jeffery Archer's book "Sons of Fortune" depicted Hotchkiss. Furthermore many of them have business deaings with Hotchkiss alumni far more than with either Andover or Exeter alumni so that plays into it as well. Lastly Etonians and such choose to come over to Hotchkiss for their PG year. Currently i know a few from Harrow studying here. I spend significant amounts of my time with members of the english upper class , to them Hotchkiss is certainly more reputable. They want their sons to make friends with men on wall street to preserve their fortunes and what not. Hotchkiss' presence there is far superior than Exeter's and Andover's combined. It is for that reason that they choose to make connections at Hotchkiss over A and E. According to your logic since what i say about Hotckiss is not valid since i go to the school what you say about A or E is not valid since you go to that school ...</p>
<p>yeh, but there is no school that is the best at any two sports realy... for example, literally the whole Avon hockey team except like 3 seniors were PGs, they had something like 13 Pgs on their hockey team!.. they dominated everyone, they were okay at lacrosse but not much else. all he "all boy" jock schools that bearly require you to take the SSAT's are amazing at one sport, usually hockey or football because thats what they recruit for. this year, the big dominator in hockey is supposed to be Kent or South Kent, Choate was also supposed to be very high up in boys hoockeey, but they have had alot of fluke games.</p>
<p>Kafkareborn, don't be such a ridiculous, pompous pig. What are you, in bed with the queen of England? By the way you talk one would think you perceive the upper classes as the only people of any consequence. Forget sports. This is specifically the reason I decided not to apply to Hotchkiss. Everyone there had an air of I'm-better-and-richer-than-you-ness and during my tour it felt like people were judging my outfit more than they were making an effort to introduce themselves or make Hotchkiss seem welcoming. The number of popped collars and Abercrombie was enough to turn me off of Hotchkiss completely. You are doing nothing to attract anyone to your school and are doing nothing but fueling the extremely common stereotypes that exist (and are growing) about Hotchkiss. If you really love your school, you'd do well to stop perpetuating the idea that all Hotchkissers (or whatever the hell you call yourselves) are the best of the best - the select.</p>
<p>Now whenever I refer to Hotchkiss I always slur my words so it sounds like "Hot Chicks" because, to be honest, that would be a much better, much more fitting name for your institution.</p>
<p>yeh, Hotchkiss isnt even the best statiscally, educationally they are behind exeter and andover and groton and st pauls and some others... and sports wise they are way behind alot of schools. there not really number one in much besides percentage of people who wear abercrombie.</p>
<p>they are pretty good at 4 sports, but there not number 1 in anything i know of... they arent in hockey or football i know that... in all the contact sports, the all boys schools dominate... like kent and avon</p>
<p>i know, thats why i sed the all boys schoollss usualllyy dominate in contact sports in most years, they dont win the football title every yearrr.. and they havent won hockey in a while the last time i checked... im a hockey guy, so im a little iffy on my football statistics, i just havent heard of the amazing hotchkiss football history .. i know their hockey is usually somewhere in the top 10, but so is choate and exeter and andover. and kent and south kent and canterbury and salisbury and avon usually dominate the hockey, usually 2 out of those 5 are in the championship.</p>
<p>Well you simply said hotchkiss isn't better at football and hockey especially compared to all-boys schools. You have to be kidding me if you don't look at those scores and not laugh at what you said at first. I don't know about hockey, but there not coming close in football. Whe nyou lose 35-0...they probably lost the yr before and the year before that too. You don't just get THAT much better in one yr. Especially in football. And trust me I know</p>
<p>eh, well the whole team could have been good but a horrible quarter back... you can have the best receivers and no quarterback, if you bring in a senior qauterback, things can change... and im just saying i havent heard of their amazing football program in past years... just like Avon hockey.. they didnt do to great a few years ago, but decided to take hockey more seriously, they added something like 13PGs in one year!.. they domindated everyone... all those PGs graduated and now they're not sooo good haha.</p>
<p>Quarterback means nothing...you can run the whole game in highschool if you really want to. The yr before they tied kent and avon...The yr before they beat kent and almost beat avon. The yr before they beat avon and barely lost to kent.</p>
<p>Its obvious that the programs have been equal and now hotchkiss is better. They'vfe never been worse.</p>
<p>you cant put up 35 points liek that without a good QB... running 5 touchdowns a game isnt that easy.... and the past 3 years dont make the "history"... and every year is different.. there is always superstars and good years and rebuilding years... its just like when Groton got that 6'8 kid... hes a superstar, when he graduated, the team changes. choate will go through a rebuilding year when their superstar play Gogland graduates... and Exeter will suffer because they have 2 or 3 senior goalies graduating and their allstar goalie Finks will be out after next year.. thats when i hope to play Varsity goalie =) haha.</p>
<p>The fact of the matter is Hotchkiss is good at sports....you can cristisize all you want. But there kicking butt, which will make more people want to go there and continue their reign. 4 NE championships and their not good at sports?</p>
<p>Don't talk about history I mean its all about now. No one cares what happened last yr lets face it. Number 1 in New England for football isn't easy. I don't know much about hockey..but sounds like you want to be varsity goalie as a sophomore. Im all for young players on varsity (I made 3)..but NE hockey seems pretty big on makin sure they have a senior or PG in important spots.</p>
<p>Ringtingting .. did you not see my qualifying statement???</p>
<p>"But anyways this is childish banter. I don't want to lower myself to such arguments. So should I then claim that Hotchkiss is MORE prestigious than Andover ?" I said I was reducing myself to his level by using those arguments, I do not believe prestige should even be a factor in choosing a school nor do I believe that having the upper crust of society know your school name makes your school great either. I just made those arguments because I knew that they would get through to WE30 who seems to be a prestige hooked person - the type of person who would gobble up such arguments. And secondly i highly doubt you even went to Hotchkiss if you think that about the people. I hardly see any popped collars here, and people do wear nice clothes but hardly any abercrombie as you stated leading me to believe you are just pumping things you HEARD about Hotchkiss but never SAW yourself. The kids at Hotchkiss are very modest in my opinion and a significant number come from very poor backgrounds indeed - Hotchkiss pays for a few of their plane tickets even etc. So you are unfairly criticizing a school that I highly doubt you know much about. I understand why I may have come off as arrogant etc. but if you had read my qualifying statement you would have realized that that is not what i believe - and that is not what the vast majority of Hotchkiss students believe. Furthermore even if i mean every word i said you should not allow a single individual to ruin the perspective of an entire population. By your logic all muslims are evil killers because of what a select group (the 19 terrorist highjackers) did on 9/11. That is an absolutely false statement and should never be used as a benchmark to judge a population. </p>
<p>Now as for you WE30 you claim that Hotchkiss is academically lacking in comparison with AE ec... do you have any evidence for this ? Hotchkiss' SAT results like i said are higher than Andovers and Deerfields. So does that mean that both of thoes schools are lacking academically ? The Minjock academy (sorry if i miss spelled that) in Korea has a higher sat score than all of these schools does that make it superior ? </p>
<p>Hotchkiss has a higher SSAT score than all of these schools bar andover .. does that make it superior to the rest ? Does Andover's 1% ssat edge over Hotchkiss make it better academically ?</p>
<p>6 alums of the Bronx High School of science have won the Noble prize, one alum from Hotchkiss has, and no exonian alum ever has. Does that make Bronx science the best ? Or Exeter inferior ? </p>
<p>I think not. You clearly do not know what you are talking about. Hotchkiss has always been an academic powerhouse on par with A/E and superior to them (and vice versa) in certain areas. That is a fact and all the people who have a long tradition in the boarding school sphere can corroborate that for you. A and E are not doubt great schools but they are not better than Hotchkiss nor is Hotchkiss better than them.</p>
<p>In certain areas however of course some schools excel more than others. For instance in most sports Hotchkiss is superior to A and E, in Math (I have heard but have not seen any statistics backing this up but i believe it) Exeter is the perennial powerhouse. In debate Hotchkiss bests all of these schools. In LAX Lawrenceville stands alone at the top. All of these schools have their specialty and excel in certain things. It is ignorant however to claim that one school is superior to another across the board when that is clearly not the case. Its like saying that Princeton is inferior to Harvard....</p>
<p>As for PGs and sport, the Erickson league that Hotchkiss plays in is the most restrictive when it comes to using PGs so your argument falls on its head. Furthermore some of the best players on the Hotchkiss team are sophomores and juniors not seniors and PGs. In fact I cannot think of a PG who plays brilliantly on the team of the top of my head. Hotchkiss is a great team because they have a great coach (who was even featured in Sports Illustrated), they work hard at their game, and they have great team work. That's what makes them the best not any of the other rubbish stories you were spouting without a SHRED of evidence to back it up. If Exeter was doing as well at sports as Hotchkiss is you would certainly not be saying hat its due to PGs ! Or Weak Admission Policies ! or whatever other strange fantasies you concoct. If may not like the facts but son you are going to have to deal with them someday. Anyways I have had enough. Good day to you :)</p>
<p>haha i do not go by prestige, i just notice the higher SAT scores, boat loads of more money, large population, and incredible matriculation... there are alot of "BS rankings overall" and i have not seen Hotchkiss ever on top. Also, theres nothing wrong with PGs, its not cheating just because the better and bigger players decided to play for your school. Also, it seemed to mthat Hotchkiss is a bunch of arrogant rich kids, who are "the best of the best?"... it seems to me that half of the kids are from large family ties.... my friend had 96% overall but his family fights with the dean of admissions family or someone who is of high authority in the Admissions, and they told him to not bother applying. Thats just dispicable. </p>
<p>-mpicz- i will be about 6'0 190lbs and im one of the top goaltenders in the country for my age group, i think i might qualify for varsity as a sophmore. I think coach Barbin puts who deserves the spot. the other schools im applying to unfortunately hhve man goalies lined up.</p>
<p>i said that Exeter had more money once to a hotckiss kid, he replyed with hotchiss is has more money per student... so pretty much hotchkiss is smaller with less money? haha, so things that you think are a good arguement make you look foolish... you brag about not having any talented PGs? thats a good thing. you said our league doesnt allow you to have too many PGs.. thats basically saying were smaller and not as strong. thats kind of a weird arguement, i think PGs are good. thats how Avon won Varsity hockey last year.</p>