Expensive name school v. Good scholarship at lesser known school

College Majors Music Major
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<p>Someone brought this issue up on the acceptances thread. I think this is something many of us are struggling with, my DS included. </p>

<p>He got into Berklee (his first choice) and Hartt(2nd choice), but with the offers he got he would have what I feel us an unacceptable amount of student debt. </p>

<p>He got a very generous offer from St Rose. We are going up there next week for an accepted student overnight and some sample lessons to see if he can generate som enthusiasm for the financially prudent, but less well known option.</p>

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<p>As I’m sure you’ve read, student debt is never good for a music major, especially if music education is the goal. Something to consider if your son really has talent and just hasn’t hit his full stride yet is to start out at St. Rose or Hartt and then re-apply to Berklee as a transfer student. My D was majoring in pre-med at another school thinking her music thing could be filled by a cappella music groups and side gigs, but in the end, music kept calling. She re-applied to Berklee the summer after her freshman year. She was very committed and worked hard leading up to the August audition and it must have showed as they accepted her and also gave her a scholarship, which made the costs much better. She started in January and hasn’t looked back since.</p>

<p>The only worrisome about being a transfer is that some music specific classes don’t transfer into conservatories, but if you know music theory and ear training and other topics well, you test out of the 1st and 2nd year classes and catch up to same-age peers. Classes like music history, science, English and others do transfer in as Berklee still have many base education requirements beyond music. </p>

<p>Good luck deciding this month … and safe travels.</p>

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<p>I’ll put a plug in for ST Rose. I think I remember reading your son is interested in music business not performance. If I am wrong, then for performance either Berklee or Hartt would be a better option. St Rose has been the beneficiary of significant donations and are upgrading their music facilities especially music industry and hiring lots of young talented faculty. Son did 3 summers of jazz and 2 summers of their music camp during high school and always loved the faculty and students. In addition, a good friend’s son is a junior music business student who had an internship last summer arranged by the school and continued working through out the school year with an offer for a full time job after graduation. In addition the capital region does have many opportunities for playing gigs (not as many as Boston) but friend’s son is in two bands that play regularly in the area.</p>

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<p>Yes, you are right, he is interested in music business. I was impressed by the level of investment the school has made in the music department at St. Rose. Thanks for the input, momofbassist.</p>

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<p>What it boils down to is will the school that gives the better scholarship do what the student needs (yeah, I know, easy question to answer <em>lol</em>). It depends on a lot of factors, about what the student plans to do, what they are in (it might be a different answer for vocal performance then instrumental), and the kind of music (could be different for Jazz or contemporary music then classical). Here is my summary of what I have read on here and seen with music students in past years, just my thoughts:</p>

<p>-The key is going to be the teacher, a program that gives a full ride scholarship but the teachers in the department don’t seem to be a fit/aren’t good/don’t show success with students may be a waste of time. On the other hand, if the program has teachers who seem to be a fit, seem to have turned out successful students in the past, then it might be really, really wise to go for the better money and not go for the ‘name’ program. </p>

<p>-Name programs do tend to have advantages that need to be factored into the decision, but a no name program could have similar ones, depends on the faculty and such. A no name program in a relatively culturally dense area (NY, Chicago, etc) might have performance opportunities and networking opportunities that a ‘name’ school in a less dense region might have…needs to be looked at as a weighting factor.</p>

<p>-It also depends on the student. If the student is strongly self motivated, if they drive from within rather then from without, the ‘less name’ program might work as well as the name program for them. On the other hand, one of the advantages of the name program for some students is seeing the average high level of students usually at such places (whereas a no name school prob has a wider range of abilities and the average is much lower then the name school, if simply because name school gets a lot of top level applicants and are much more choosy), they can be driven ‘upward’ in their drive to becoming a top player by seeing kids better then them. One of the reasons ‘no name’ or ‘rising’ programs offer those kinds of deals is they are seeking a way to attract top level music students to their program, to bring it up, to compete with the name schools mystique and so forth. </p>

<p>My take on it is similar to others, that if the teaching and such seems top notch, fit the students needs, I would lean towards the lesser known school with the better financial package. Even going to a Berklee, or to an NEC, Juilliard, etc is tough, tough sledding for graduates in terms of making it, and coming out with 6 figures of debt, for example, or breaking the family finances to pay for it, doesn’t make sense to me if the future is tenuous there and i think if the lesser name program has decent teachers and the like, you could have overall the same chances of ‘making it’ without being burdened by the debt, gives you more flexibility in the future.</p>

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<p>thanks for starting this post electricbassmom. There are a few posts of this nature on CC forums. I think the fact that you are going to visit St Rose will help. We are still processing the situation. I think a few campus visits will help also. In the situation of classical composition, it is critical to have the collaborative environment and strong instrumental performers to play pieces, opportunity to have scores performed and plenty of other composition students to progress with. Lucky some of these kids that have been offered 25-40 K merit at some of these pricey conservatories. I keep seeing numerous awards to the same kids, so maybe by the end of April more money will be out there, since each of those students will have to only accept one of the offers.</p>

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<p>I am not a musician myself but I do have some experience with students leaving Berklee because of the expense. I teach at a community college and, in the case of both of these students, they had amazing local reputations and were quite bright. One had used a number of students from our flagship’s orchestra (while a teen) in a public performance of one of his compositions and it was simply wonderful. Both of these students loved Berklee but the cost to be there was driving them into deep debt. In the case of both, they came home, worked, made music and finished their general education requirements while living at home at the CC before transferring to the state flagship. A third case involved a student who graduated with D and is still at Berklee. He loves it too and has really taken off. However, he was an only child of very well-paid professional parents! </p>

<p>My son, is a transfer music major soon be at an LAC with strong music program (who gave him a great scholarship). He is transferring out of an LAC that he feels he has “outgrown”. He did not apply to conservatories (H and I said no as we knew the $$ would be an issue even if he did get in). The general education courses transferred with no issue. We are waiting to hear the outcome for the four semesters of theory, lessons and history that he took. So, as another poster indicated, transfer is a possibility.</p>

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<p>My twins were both accepted to Berklee with some funds but not enough to allow even one of them to go without everyone piling on lots of debt. They both found it disappointing to have to say no as Berklee is a great school. However, the cost of it and other expensive private schools is prohibitive. The twins are attending other schools where we hopefully will not end up carrying debt at graduation, a much more reasonable approach attending college. Transferring to Berklee is always a possibility if they still have the burning desire and can figure out a way to fund the time there.</p>

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<p>My D (at Berklee) called this week to update us on her music life. Yes, it is expensive, for sure. However, she is taking advantage of everything there and is really getting some momentum now (started Jan. 2011) that she wouldn’t get if she were at any other school: bigger gig opportunities with really talented musicians in Boston, selective vocal ensembles that perform with guest artists, paid on-campus jobs (music theory tutoring) and personal mentoring from several professors, and she continues to develop her songwriting and recording as part of her major. She will be doing a cool music internship after the semester ends, but alas, it does not pay. </p>

<p>Does it still cost a lot to live in Boston? Yes, it does. She also babysits twice a week for a local family and they are very flexible with her schedule when gig opportunities come up. (Boston pays well for nanny services.) By next semester she will be making more money gigging and the babysitting job may not fit into her schedule, but she never complains about being tired or overworked because she is overwhelmingly happy and appreciative of the opportunities she has right now.</p>

<p>I understand with twins the finances are super hard, but if any of your students are not thriving at their eventual chosen place, and they are willing to work their hineys off in music, then Berklee will open up opportunities and learning that they may be able to take advantage of even as a transfer.</p>

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<p>Snowflake VT my D is deferring for a year at Berklee, leaving that door open. She currently plans to audition again to see if she can gain more from another year of experience. She may love where she is going and take Berklee off the table at some point. The numbers were simply too huge to allow the kids to go. We can’t financially ruin the family to send them to school. S feels really good about going to North Texas. We are quite familiar with Berklee and the Boston area, have lots of family not too far from the city and all of us really wanted it to happen. But other opportunities are available and things will work out.</p>

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<p>Sounds like you have talented kids … I’m sure they will take advantage of the opportunities they will have.</p>

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<p>Musictwins, do you have to pay the tuition deposit to defer? It was unclear to me from the literature in the acceptance package.</p>

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<p>electricbassmom, I spoke directly with an admissions advisor about that. If you want defer to a different semester, as late as Fall 2013, you can guarantee the spot by leaving the tuition deposit with them and it is still refundable before the next deadline. If you don’t want them holding your money, you can ask for the refund and the student is still accepted on deferral, but their spot is not guaranteed until a new deposit is sent. And, fyi, housing deposits are nonrefundable and cannot be deferred, so if you made a housing deposit this year, it is gone.</p>

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<p>I had paid the enrollment deposit for both kids when they were accepted early just to hold a place while waiting for the Fin Aid decisions. Berklee will hang on to D’s deposit until she makes up her mind and S has requested a refund as he chose not to defer. We were not willing to lose the housing deposit and did not do that part.</p>

<p>I was not aware of what Jazzpianomom1 has mentioned. I just thought you paid the deposit and then could defer.</p>

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<p>Excuse my ignorance, but I never realized you could actually do that, accept at one school but still defer at another, holding a spot. I always assumed a deferral meant doing a gap year and not commmitting to ANY school. If this is OK then why don’t more people do that who are having difficulty making a decision or who are torn between 2 schools in case the one doesn’t work out?</p>

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<p>Berklee’s “deposit” is unique. It does not mean you are committing, but “holds your spot” and gives you a chance to get in line first for housing while you’re still waiting to hear from other schools (we did this, and got the refund when S committed elsewhere, but you do NOT get the housing deposit back). </p>

<p>Once past May 1, as far as I know, Berklee is the only school that will “hold a spot” for a year or two (maybe more?) if you let them hold the deposit.</p>

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<p>Westminster Choir told DD that if she changed her mind any time in the next year she could accept their offer with scholarship in tact. This was after she had let them know she had chosen elsewhere. They were the only ones that offered that option though.</p>

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<p>Baldwin Wallace last year also offered that option. It’s worth checking with the schools to see what options are available if things don’t work out in the Fall. It’s so tough making the big decision.</p>