<p>D still hasn’t made an announcement either - from all we can gather from her when she’s not out with the boyfriend we seem to be down to 2 options. Hang in there - it’ll be over soon!</p>
<p>SoCalDad2 it’s hard to start engineering school at the master’s level unless maybe the undergrad is Physics or possibly Math.</p>
<p>Agree to drop Pomona if planning on engineering. My D has Mudd on her final top 3 list (also “not docking”, although maybe drifting toward Mudd?). I think a non-Mudd student would honestly have a hard time keeping up in the Mudd classes because they are so immersed in their program. I doubt he could take enough credits at Mudd to actually get the engineering degree, and I don’t think there are really classes there for those who want to dabble in it beyond the intro class.</p>
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The majority of students who pursue an engineering degree do so at undergrad. The majority of these people stick with engineering when they graduate and work as engineers. Some of them will go to grad school. </p>
<p>Very few people with a liberal arts degree, for example, get an engineering grad degree because they’re not prepared for it and usually would have to take a lot of courses to catch up to be able to handle grad school for engineering.</p>
<p>Students obtaining engineering degrees at the colleges you mention aren’t merely getting ‘vocational training’. They take courses outside of strictly specific engineering courses including in many cases history, writing oriented courses, arts, etc. Also, some of the students will end up with minors in areas like English, History, Philosophy, various sciences, etc.</p>
<p>UCSD, UCB, Columbia all are large colleges offering a plethora of courses and majors/minors.</p>
<p>“Go to Pomona, and get a good rounded education. If he still is interested in engineering four years from now, go to graduate school.” - Not sure that path is even possible. Certainly it would not be easy. But I did love our tour of Pomona (DS liked Mudd better)… so add real life examples if you have them, SoCalDad2. </p>
<p>OP - It sounds like you have great options, hopefully all affordable. That sounds like an ideal situation, even if it does make decisions harder. Good luck!</p>
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<p>Anyone starting to understand why the OP is losing sleep over this?</p>
<p>My question would be what the kid’s options are at UCSD, UCB, and Columbia SEAS if he decides not to do engineering:</p>
<p>[ul][<em>]Which schools would allow him to pursue a different STEM major?[</em>]Which, if any, would allow him to pursue a non-STEM major?[/ul]</p>
<p>And, a related question: are the scholarships at UCSD and UCB contingent on pursuit of an engineering degree?</p>
<p>“Anyone starting to understand why the OP is losing sleep over this?”</p>
<p>No. They are all good choices, and the kid can make it. The only danger is if mom steers him to the “wrong” choice.</p>
<p>Another perspective: does he know what winters are like? I ask because it’s sometimes hard for warm weather students to adjust to long miserable winters.</p>
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<p>Can’t speak for the UCs, but for Columbia SEAS…the only option if one decides not to do engineering is to transfer…whether to Columbia College or more likely to another university as a SEAS transfer applicant to Columbia college won’t be treated any differently than one from outside Columbia University. </p>
<p>If it was the mid-'90s or before, this wouldn’t have been an issue as a SEAS student back then would just need to fill out some pro-forma forms and it would have been treated as an administrative change. They did away with this sometime in the '00s. </p>
<p>One thing to consider with Pomona…check to see if they have a 3-2 liberal arts/engineering program with Harvey Mudd or other engineering schools. This way, he gets the best of both.</p>
<p>cobrat - Does that mean that the ONLY major possible at Columbia SEAS is engineering? Not math or science?</p>
<p>And a 3-2 program may be possible at Pomona - but who pays for that 5th year? For a kid who needs financial aid, the 3-2 programs are often not feasible.</p>
<p>I was going to bring up NYC winters, too. I don’t know much about any of these schools-- they all seem good. But if you’re from California, then thinking about Columbia is a really, really big change. Not only will transportation be hard and expensive, but NYC winters can be awful-- and I live here! But-- all that being said, Columbia is a wonderful school and New York is a fabulous city. As long as those two biggies are not much of an issue, New York would be my choice. Expand the horizons! Columbia!</p>
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<p>Basically, you’re limited to the majors Columbia SEAS offers. If someone wants to change majors outside of what SEAS offers, they’d need to transfer. </p>
<p>From casual perusal of their majors, it seems the only non-engineering heavy majors are Applied Physics or Math and IEOR. Not good if one wants to pursue other STEM majors or non-STEM majors. </p>
<p>Moreover, they’ll still need to take the SEAS core which is heavily engineering-centered from what I’ve heard from dozens of SEAS alums and my own perusal of a friend’s SEAS bulletin. Lots of physics and math.</p>
<p>I live in NYC too, and I don’t think the winters are ‘bad’ at all. We rarely get snow to even stick or the temperature to go under 32 (both of which actually makes me sad). </p>
<p>Other than that though, I think NYC is a very exciting place to live in!</p>
<p>Congratulations! What awesome choices especially since many pplz this year do not seem to feel as positively this year about their choices! You son is likely to be very happy at any of the four colleges! As an engineering major Junior year, I think Columbia & Cal are awesome opportunities that are globally recognized & very robust in every way possible… I have experience w TAs from both & Berkeley has so much swag for West Coast opportunities & research & internships… La Jolla is a dream location for four years & I spent two summers @ tennis camp there so pretty great to live there but only Bio Engineering @ UCSD compares in stature to Cal & Columbia… Well Okay Now Pomona College? As a lifelong resident of the city the 5Cs are in… Pomona College is an excellent LAC especially for English & Art Majors, and parents love the cute village atmosphere… Do not be fooled by the notion of taking classes @ Harvey Mudd easily if you are a Sagehen… Within six months at the latest, students are piling into cars to get the H&6@ out of Claremont to Santa Monica, OC, & Vegas… Sooooo glad to be out of suburbs & at Ucla… Main reasonI posted was to ? The choice of Pomona since your son seems to be such a strong STEM student & Claremont is also succumbing to the crime wave & economic malaise of the Inland Empire currently… Best wishes for much happiness & hours of study in the libraries as an engineering student!</p>
<p>What about the non-academic aspects of the different schools? My son is in UCB engineering and he’s happy, but it’s not a fun, carefree college environment. It’s way different than Pomona, where he was also accepted. I’ve heard that at UCSD it’s a tough place to make friends. I agree that Pomona is not the school for engineers, but it’s a great place to spend 4 years and the students love it. Don’t know about Columbia but is it worth the extra money if the scholarship falls through? The nice thing about UCB is the relatively low cost for a world class education.</p>
<p>And in NYC the sidewalks generally get shoveled promptly. I loved going to grad school in NYC. But I also loved the two years I lived in Pasadena. :)</p>
<p>Hmm … this student is 5 days into the 14 days s/he is given to make a choice … and the problem is what? Given how successful this student has been I’d think the parent has every reason to think a fine decision will be made in plenty of time. In other words relax and give the student space unless asked for help. </p>
<p>(PS - If it gets down to 1/2 day left then jumping in to push some makes sense to me)</p>
<p>I should go hang wallpaper! BUT…on the basis of these comments I think that he:</p>
<p>1) should cross Pomona off the list. He is pretty positive about engineering as an undergrad degree. Pomona has no clear path to a job, seems like one would HAVE to go to grad school no matter what undergrad degree one would receive there. He really liked the kids there and knows he would be happy for 4 years but then what? Their physics dept. seems weak from all accounts and he can’t cross major at Harvey Mudd for engineering. After reading all the comments, can we agree with this assessment?</p>
<p>2)cross off Berkeley-this is SO hard to do because they are so highly ranked in Engineering but the 3.0 gpa is too risky IMHO even for a top student who has Regents. The first semester had the weeder chem and math classes so he could potentially lose Regents right away and we could NOT afford the $20K per year without Regents.</p>
<p>SO now USCD and Columbia?
Columbia is the best price! They are giving him the most money-$225K for 4 years and promise to increase aid when costs rise and it doesn’t depend on his GPA. SEAS is NOT very highly rated for Engineering and the kids seem really STRESSED and unhappy according to so many comments on this forum. It seems to be a hard place to make friends unless you are into sports or greek life and S is not into either of those things. They joke about sleep, work or have a social life-pick 2 and that’s kind of scary! The kids say they rarely even get to go into the city because they are so overworked. </p>
<p>It’s true that one can’t easily switch out of SEAS but this year, they’ve changed some of the rules and it’s easier now so that’s not so much of a worry even though I don’t see S switching into a non tech major. We are in CA so the travel is a concern. It took him more than 12 hours to get there Thursday but they’ve included ~$1200 in the COA for travel so enough for plane tickets. The weather is a concern, too. Again, we live in CA and don’t have cold and snow so he would not be used to that and really has NO idea what it’s like to wear anything more than a sweatshirt. He really likes NY but this is his very first trip there so how much can he really “know” about life the big city? I can’t imagine anything worse than sending a kid 3000 miles away not being sure if he can stand being in the city or make friends in a stressful setting that isn’t so great for his major to begin with!</p>
<p>UCSD-not very highly ranked but it does have aerospace eng that he wants and it does have good connections in the industry he wants. AWFUL to drive there-8 or 9 hours but we can afford to fly him back and forth since it’s free. The 3.6 gpa is VERY risky IMHO but I feel pretty confident he can keep the 3.0 for Regents because the competition isn’t as “stiff” as Berkeley. IF he can keep the higher gpa for at least a year, that’s a big savings, 2 years even more savings but if he does go under 3.0, cost soars to $20K and he won’t be able to continue-scary thought!</p>
<p>Yes, I’m losing sleep! Thank you all SO much for your thoughtful comments and opinions. When S gets home, I’ll give him this to read.</p>
<p>Berkeley is a great school, but it is a CA state school with budget issues. It is a great choice for instate, but not so much for out of state.</p>
<p>UCSD is another CA state school. Even if it is free, is he going to be challenged? There is a good reason why he got a free ride.</p>
<p>Pomona is a small LAC, unknown outside of CA, and I do not believe its career services is that great. Depending what he wants to do after graduation, not sure how well the name will carry.</p>
<p>Why he would pass up a Columbia education for so little difference in cost.</p>
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<p>My understanding from the op is that the GPA dependent scholarships are all with the UC schools…not Pomona or Columbia where the FA/scholarships aren’t conditioned on maintaining a certain GPA.</p>
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<p>SEAS may not rank at the tippy top, but they are still considered within the first-tier schools in the engineering/CS field so that statement’s off. </p>
<p>Calling BS on the part about having to be into sports or greek life to have a good time at Columbia. Most sports team events are poorly attended from what I’ve seen and heard from Columbia alums/students…including athletes and the Greeks aren’t the center of campus life. Far from it. If anything, its the Greeks who tend to be isolated in their niche part of campus life. Most Columbia students are able to find a multitude of ECs and activities to keep their leisure time occupied. Hey…they’re in NYC, after all. </p>
<p>The stress/unhappiness at Columbia SEAS is more due to the high stress/unhappiness which comes from the weeder classes and heavy workloads commonly associated with engineering/CS. </p>
<p>Third part is the exact same applicable joke which could be applied to math-science centered high schools like BxScience, Stuy, or TJSST. Moreover, that’s par for the course for most engineering/CS majors at most places.</p>
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<p>From what I’ve heard from several recent HS grads at UCSD as well as California cousins whose companies recruit from both UCs…there isn’t as much of a difference in academic-level/difficulty between Berkeley and UCSD, especially within the last 10 years. </p>
<p>Both are exceedingly tough and one shouldn’t underestimate the difficulty of UCSD, especially in engineering/STEM fields.</p>
<p>Columbia Engineering is quite prestigious. It has been around a long time.</p>
<p>[History</a> | The Fu Foundation School of Engineering & Applied Science - Columbia University](<a href=“http://engineering.columbia.edu/history]History”>History | Columbia Engineering)</p>