<p>I would like to apply for FA since boarding school IS very expensive and my family is upper middle class. </p>
<p>Tuition will NOT be easy since my brother is also in college and we had help from our Grandmother for his tuition. </p>
<p>My mother says not to apply for FA because if I do, then I will probably not get accepted.</p>
<p>What do you think? I'm applying to Andover and Lawrenceville for boarding and I might apply to Hotchkiss also (hopefully! I've heard many good things about Hotchkiss from camp friends.)</p>
<p>If you need FA, you absolutely must apply for it going in. If you don’t apply for it your first year, you will not be eligible for it in successive years unless there is some drastic change in circumstances (both parents lose jobs, etc.). If you apply as full-pay and are accepted, the school assumes you will be full-pay each year you attend.</p>
<p>If your mother says not to apply for FA then you must assume that she can pay the tuition and related fees. This is a big bonus for you since FP applicants are accepted at nearly twice the rate as FA applicants, primarily because the ratio of FA:FP applicants is about 2:1 at most schools, yet the ratio of the student body is generally 1:2.</p>
<p>Leave the finances to your mother, but do make sure she realizes what ChoatieMom says is true. If your grandmother is willing to pay your tuition, for instance, you will be in a much better position to gain a spot because you won’t have to go through the FA vetting. </p>
<p>All that said, admission to Lville, Andover and Hotchkiss is very difficult even for FP kids. While your mother is not exactly correct to say that you will “probably not get accepted,” she does seem to realize that it’s a steeper hill to climb when you need FA.</p>
<p>FWIW, most of the schools that waitlisted my daughter over the years sited FA as the reason. I was either told outright, or it was implied that had I been able to pay, she would have been accepted rather than waitlisted. The Choate waitlist letter went so far as to state that if we could pay (and could prove it), then we should call them ASAP. </p>
<p>So, to answer your question, does it lower your chances? Yes.</p>
<p>neato, your assumptions would make FA admissions 4 times more competitive than FP, not twice. And I think, realistically, it’s even more competitive than that, assuming lower yields for FP students than for FA students.</p>
<p>Does this logic hold true for selective colleges with above average endowments and about 35-50% on FA? The needle for the FA:FP of 2:1 (at prep level) might move upward (at college level) for FA to 3 or 4 or 5:1, might it not? (Might be true for some of the acronym preps too . . . ?)</p>
<p>Hmm… Then I guess I will have to not pay FA. Boarding school tuition is a very tight stretch for my family but I assume that my mother will handle all the finances well.</p>
<p>If you think the household budget is tight now, throwing in a full pay BS tuition may push it beyond the limit. We are talking $50k a year here, which is not chopped liver to most “upper middle class” families that I know.</p>
<p>While your mother is right that applying for FA puts you in a more competitive pool, let’s say you get in as a full pay but on April 9th your parents think there isn’t enough $$ to go round…that might leave you out in the cold regardless.</p>
<p>If you were my kid and I was stressed about affording the full tuition as a parent, I would most certainly encourage you to apply as an FA candidate.</p>
<p>I know that you may not want to hear it, but I would definitely consider a few “second tier” schools that are known to be generous with FA…if going to BS is that important to you.</p>
<p>I must have worded it incorrectly. House budget is not “tight” as in we’re scrapping for food, we are fine actually but I just feel bad pulling in all of that money with boarding school tuition. </p>
<p>I just asked my mother if I could apply and she said we can’t because my dad is a doctor and that they will not allow that for FA. </p>
<p>I just wanted to save my parents some money.</p>
<p>Your father’s occupation does not determine your eligibity for FA; your household income, assets, debt, discretionary income, number of kids in school and the like are the factors the schools consider.</p>
<p>In practical terms, you can make a VERY ROUGH estimate of the impact of FA on admit rate, for need-aware schools:</p>
<p>0.67 x Admit Rate = approximate FA admit rate
1.33 x Admit Rate = approximate fullpay admit rate</p>
<p>So for Hotchkiss School which has an 18% admit rate:</p>
<p>0.67 x 18% = 12% FA admit rate
1.33 x 18% = 24% fullpay admit rate </p>
<p>These ARE REALLY ROUGH estimates, so:
do NOT treat them as accurate numbers, and
do NOT get too excited about 18% vs. 24%</p>
<p>As I described it on another thread: jumping out of a plane using a parachute w a 1-in-5 chance of opening, is pretty much the same thing as jumping out of a plane using a parachute w a 1-in-4 chance of opening Bonzai!!!</p>
<p>
Keep in mind, too, that fullpay at $50k a year, is really $75k in GROSS income for higher tax bracket income. And dont expect your brothers college to grant him FA because of the added family expenditure for your BS tuition.</p>
<p>And… the 50k a year isn’t all-inclusive. Aside from the annual tuition increases, there are additional expenses your parents will need to consider. </p>
<p>While it’s true that most colleges won’t consider a sibling’s h.s. tuition when granting FA, most boarding schools will factor a sibling’s college tuition in.</p>
<p>There are schools who make FA and admit. decisions separately; that is, they will admit a student who applied for FA and deny financial aid. In that case, a family might try for FA. However, the schools you’ve listed so far do not make decisions that way, and you almost certainly be in a much more selective pool if you applied as an FA candidate.</p>
<p>OTOH, I agree with neato that you should let your parents make the call here and trust that they wouldn’t offer to send you to school FP if they didn’t think they (and your grandmother) could swing it. We parents get to choose how we frivol away our money, and many of us on this board would rather see it go to a great boarding school than a schmanzy resort or car manufacturer.</p>
<p>And yes, I know that Andover says it’s need blind. I just don’t really believe that they don’t have other, more subtle ways of assessing need, though their overall admit. rate suggests that it is harder for a full pay student to get into Andover than to get into, say, Exeter.</p>
<p>To add to what classicalmama said two posts ago, Choate is need blind until the very final round, I believe. So you may technically be admitted until the final round, when you may be denied financial aid.</p>
<p>Right. That’s how it is in most schools. FA kids have an extra hurdle. But Choate will actually tell you in the wait list letter if it’s the case. I think most schools use their FA budget to get the kids that they can’t necessarily get from the FP pool or that they feel they really must have. They also tend to divvy it up in a way that keeps their percent on FA on target, which is why the EFC matters so much. They can either admit one full need kid or three kids who need 33%. </p>
<p>If the OPs family can pay over half tuition, it may not be as steep of a hill to climb.</p>
<p>@neato:
“I think most schools use their FA budget to get the kids that they can’t necessarily get from the FP pool or that they feel they really must have.”</p>
<p>Does that mean the schools will evaluate ALL the full pay applicants first until the number of admissions reaches 60-70% of the intended overall acceptances, then move on the the FA candidates to “fill the slots”?</p>
<p>"They can either admit one full need kid or three kids who need 33%. "</p>
<p>From my impression, the average financial aid grant at most top schools are at 70% of the total tuition, whereas at the hidden gems it is around 45%, which is impressive of the top schools because that means for every 40% FA admit, there is someone else offered a full ride.</p>
<p>No, I don’t think they are evaluated separately. I think the sort of culling happens at the end when they are trying get all their numbers right. They’ve got two harpists and one needs aid and the other doesn’t, etc.</p>
<p>Of course this is purely conjecture on my part, based on speaking to many AOs about my D’s many wait lists and FA.</p>