<p>here are some questions:</p>
<p>1) do I have to follow the First-Second Year requirement table on the Engineering Bulletin to be eligible to apply for the program?
2) FE requires separate courses in Probability and statistics, and other programs in the same department want SIEO 3600 (combined prob and stat). Should I take the 3600 and would it satisfy one of the FE requirement?
3) If I jumped track in math, am i automatically disqualified?</p>
<ol>
<li><p>no you need to complete the tech elective shown in the table and listed on IEOR's site</p></li>
<li><p>no alot of sophomores on FE track where told to retake probablity after they've done 4150 (equivalent to 3600) FE explicitly require you to take them separately. however the 6 credit course STAT4109 will probably be ok since its a combination of 4105 and 4107 (probability + statistical inference for MA STATs .. hence 6 credits)</p></li>
</ol>
<p>3.no and I don't know anyone in SEAS that actually started at calc 1 -.-'' (doesn't mean there arn't but definitely are rare population)</p>
<p>Dear Lynda, are you taking probability w4105?? I'm taking it next semester. and if you are, can you please tell me how hard is it or the workload is like briefly??</p>
<p>both stat and prob courses required by FE has a prerequisite. If I have not taken the AP equivalence in hight school, is it recommended that I take an basic stat/or prob course to satisfy the prerequisite? thanks for the help.</p>
<p>does anyone know what Honors Math A,B translates to in terms of 1,2,3,4.
is A combination of 1 and 2?</p>
<p>I was taking 4109 then the workload drove me crazy so I dropped it and picked up the regular 3658 an another 3 credit class. its not the material is hard.. just didn't have the time to be doing double problem sets every week with all my other classes.</p>
<p>4105 i heard isn't too hard same material as 3658, but you will be in a class with MA students (they are not all that tough^.~ but very intimidating..)</p>
<p>and honors is calc 1-4 + linear algebra all in 1 year. most people go in with calc bc so I doubt they spend much time on 1 & 2</p>
<p>col021
you need to know how to integrate for 3658's second half (calc II'll surfice) highschool stats is not required since this is an intro class. stats class requires the probability class (you need to either take them in sequence or take 4109 one from stats)</p>
<p>so what does a graduate of FE (bachelor degree) does? analyst? quants? what exactly is the difference between analyst, quants?</p>
<p>think of it this way, analyst is like saying you are the freshmen in a company. quant is like saying you are a math major. analyst are what most entry level position in banks are called FE quants are a special title given for the quantitive strategists . however the typical analyst position in a bank refers to either sales and trading analyst or an investment banking analyst, the traditional analyst role for those two things involve very little quantitative skills, and the definition of "quantitative skill" varies when you are talking about a quant job Vs when you are talking about a traditional street job.</p>
<p>FE undergrad grads however can pursue both routes, like other OR undergrades. you will have sufficient econ (actually just intro to accounting and finance... maybe the banking class too if you want to take it) classes to answer the interview questions for traditional roles (not that those answers can't be crammed) and you will have enough quantitative skills to answer more technical questions that quant groups usually ask (ok those are a little harder to cram).</p>
<p>since this year will be the first graduating class for FE, and right now is a horrible job market on the street (come on.. read the news, 2CEOs just got sacked) many banks that are interviewing on campus aren't even looking for new hires I'd say it be a while before the question for "what FE undergrads do after graduation" can be answered with valid statistic backings at Columbia..</p>
<p>you can go ask around the princeton board for that one though, their program is more well established (been there longer, but in my opinion we have the better faculty =p)</p>
<p>anyways thats all I can come up with off the top of my head.</p>
<p>cool thanks for the info</p>
<p>Just to clear up:</p>
<p>I am an alum. When I graduated in 06, I spent a year in management consulting, quit my job, and took some finance courses to try and get my foot in the door with something more challenging. It was this past summer where I discovered that, if you weren't a college junior/senior, basically bulge bracket firms didn't want to talk to you because you were considered a lateral hire, and they couldn't quite fit me into the same picture as the pool of about-to-be-newly-minted graduates.</p>
<p>With that in mind,
[quote]
I am really surprised that Denzera cannot get a foot in the door, his posts have always impressed me. I have been told that early focus helps, hence FE over art history or mech engineering (to avoid the question, why do you want to go into finance), hence denzera's point about class selection. I didn't know they looked so closely at your transcript. Also the why finance question: a headhunter in this field told me they don't want those who want to make money etc, they are looking for what Jim Simons is looking for, those who like the intellectual challenge of continually creating models.
[/quote]
Right. They may ask you about class choices you made when in a first-round interview, to get a sense of how long and how deeply you've been thinking about finance.</p>
<p>
[quote]
So, denzera, do you really then think APAM (other things being equal) is less advantageous to FE jobs than FE?
[/quote]
I think it's about the same - but all else isn't equal, because those who want FE jobs as quants will likely have a lot of other indicators on their profile (like internships) to show that they are seriously committed to finance. I think you can do the same with an AM major, or an OR major, (although OR is a less rigorous curriculum than AM or FE), it all depends on the totality of your profile.</p>
<p>Denzera, what is the dept looking for in choosing FE candidates? Also, if you don't get in, can you not major in OR but take additional FE courses and graduate so that you have nearly the same curriculum as FE without the title, FE? </p>
<p>It seems to me that at places like Pton where there is no FE major you will just take courses in FE but basic degree will be OR. Finally: do you know of OR grads who get recruited into finance jobs? Thanks.</p>
<p>I can't answer any of those questions except the last one, to which my answer is "yes, definitely". the OR department is full of pre-finance kids who don't take their classes very seriously and want the easy walk to wall street. (it also has plenty of people who are legitimately interested in operations research, like one of my current housemates, and want to get a PhD in it or at least work in industry)</p>
<p>Thanks, as usual, you are helpful.</p>
<p>I was just reading monkey business over the thxgiving break, and it seems like these analysts and associate are nothing more than a paper pusher ,and it seems that there is not much intelligence involved in their work. Is that all true or the book is exaggerating somewhat? with F.E. I'm hoping I can work as a quant? (supposedly more mathematical modeling and fun??)</p>
<p>unfortunately no, that statement is not much of an exaggeration. banks need perfectionists, people who can work 100+ hrs a week an still catch the mistake in the graph title within a 50page pitch book. you need you basic understanding of financial statements and valuations, but its nothing that a reasonably smart student can't learn on the job.
even if modeling (the traditional IB kind) is fun at first, you'll get bored of it if you are doing it 3 am in the morning after 4 hr of sleep the day before.... multiple times a month. Its a reality check for people going into this industry. The upside is the unlimited potential of this position. in 5-6 years you'll move into a more managerial client facing position and thats where you career really begins. or so I'm told by countless senior/alums.
anyways most interesting "quant" positions are held by PHD holders (the real modelers) as an undergraduate.. I seriously doubt the job'll qualify as "fun" .. espcially most OR students I talked to that worked in strategies/quanty groups last summer were all doing programming (.. more software engineering jobs than mathy)</p>