Finding a major for a hands on kid, strong in math and physics

Applying to College
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Make sure you are not projecting your opinions on him. It’s his life. I’m sure you know this, but it can be tricky to not overly influence our kids’ directions. It sounds like Mechanical Engineering could be a great fit for him. Industrial or product design might be worth exploring too, but this is his path to take. For sure he needs to be at a school that has the types of majors that he might be interested in and will need some help from parents in direction on that, but encourage him to explore lots of options when he is at college and he might discover something else he likes too.

He sounds like an amazing kid. Making an electric guitar and welding!!

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Also, a school where declaring or changing between the majors is not too difficult or competitive.

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" And it didn’t help my drop out rate concerns."

As others have mentioned, the main reasons kids drop out of engineering is the amount of work early on, the weed out at some colleges, being in a structured major so you really can’t fall behind, dealing with the independence of college, social things. There’s probably more but that’s the main ones.

I would avoid Tech colleges because the non-stem options are not that good. You stated you wanted to stay close to NY, assuming your son will apply to a SUNY or two as a safety, maybe try Syracuse, U Rochester. In PA, Lehigh and Bucknell maybe good options as well. I don’t know how hands on vs theoretical some of those programs are, so you may have to do some research there.

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All of these colleges offer mechanical engineering as a major, though you would need to verify whether they are ABET-accredited (something that is very important if your son wants to become an engineer). They also offer some other majors which I thought might interest your son based on the comments in this thread. Depending on where in New York you are, these might be closer or further away, but I tried not to go too far away from NY.

• Penn State Erie, The Behrend College: Only about 3500 students but offers 158 majors. Has a 12:1 student/faculty ratio and offers both engineering as well as technology degrees, and so many others. This is a residential campus (not a commuter one).
• Gannon (PA ): Has mechanical engineering but other possibilities like chain supply management, technical theater/theater design & technology or industrial engineering. About 2900 students here.
• New Jersey Institute of Technology: Has a variety of engineering degrees (including manufacturing, materials, biomedical, etc) but also has engineering technologies, engineering/industrial management, architecture… A bit larger with about 8,000 students.
• Roger Williams (RI): Architecture, Building Construction Management, various engineering fields and technology ones (like industrial technology and manufacturing engineering technology), operations management, etc. About 4200 undergrads.
• Hofstra (NY): Has several majors which seem as though they could be of interest such as entrepreneurship, medical physics, jewelry arts, logistics & supply chain management, various engineerings (industrial, manufacturing, etc). 6,000 undergrads with a 13:1 student/faculty ratio.
• Widener (PA ): Has a major in mechatronics, robotics, and automation engineering as well as other engineering fields like architectural, biomedical, etc. About 2900 undergrads with a 13:1 student/faculty ratio.
• Wilkes (PA ): Offers majors in various engineering fields, engineering/industrial management, entrepreneurship, logistics and supply chain management, and technical theater/theater design technology. About 2100 undergrads with a 13:1 student/teacher ratio.
• York (PA ): Offers majors in medical technology, entrepreneurship, commercial and advertising art, logistics & supply chain management, recording arts technology, as well as several engineering fields. About 3700 undergrads.
• U. of New Haven (CT): medical technology, interior architecture, music technology, and various engineering fields. About 5000 undergrads.
• U. of Hartford (CT): various technologies (architectural, electromechanical, etc), architecture, entrepreneurship, various engineerings (including mechatronics, robotics, and automation). There are 4,000 undergrads with an 8:1 studnt/faculty ratio.
• SUNY Polytechnic (NY): If you’re sure your son wouldn’t be interested in the humanities, this state school offers various technology and engineering majors along with entrepreneurship. About 2100 undergrads attend.
• U. of Scranton (PA ): Offers a major in biophysics, engineering/industrial management, logistics & supply chain management, operations management, and pre-engineering (which I presume is a more moderately paced route to a career in engineering). There are about 3600 undergrads with a 12:1 student/faculty ratio.
• U. of Dayton (OH): Offers majors in various engineering fields, technology fields, entrepreneurship, and operations management. A bit larger with around 8400 undergrads.

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I really like your list of schools. Smaller, more nurturing schools. So many kids on CC are gunning for the big, prestigious engineering schools, and I have trouble understanding why sometimes. Graduates get good jobs out of little no-name engineering schools too, and there may be less pressure to “weed out” students. I also like schools that offer 2+2 degrees where you can earn an A.S. in 2 years, with the option of getting a B.S. with 2 more years. That B.S. may be in the same technical area, or something different like Business & Management. Lots of bright “hands on” kids around where I live attend a school like that (Dunwoody) and the job placement rate is outstanding. Usually the employer pays for the completion degree. Don’t know about any of the schools on the East Coast, though.

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I was thinking Packaging too, but he’s not going to crack SLO admissions with a 3.0.
RIT would be a reach but worth a try: Packaging Science BS | RIT
Although, he might have better luck with RIT if he applied to a BFA program where his portfolio would be a bigger part of the admissions process: https://www.rit.edu/study/studio-arts-bfa-sculpture-option

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Does RISD have any programs that might fit the industrial design component being discussed here? With the Brown partnership I wonder whether taking engineering courses (pass/fail?) might be allowed as part of the study. Location would fit your requirements…

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Oops, I misread an earlier post. I thought you were from NY, not realizing that you were in MA and not wanting to go past NY. Sorry!

So going further north, here are some other options to consider. Like the list above, they all have mechanical engineering as a major. Recommendations for universities in NY, CT, and RI were in the list above.

  • Wentworth Institute of Technology (MA): Again, only if your son has nixed off fields in the humanities and social sciences, but there are majors in architectural technology, architecture, building construction technology, building construction management, industrial and product design, operations management, project management, as well as business. There are about 4100 undergrads here.
  • Western New England (MA): Various engineering majors including industrial and biomedical; various business degrees including entrepreneurship. About 2500 undergrads with a 12:1 student/faculty ratio.
  • Southern New Hampshire: Aviation/Airway Management & Operations; various engineering majors including aerospace, construction; and operations management. Has about 3400 undergrads and a 13:1 student/faculty ratio.

If your son decides that mechanical engineering isn’t the path for him, I might take a look at Massachusetts College of Art & Design: Offers majors in architectural design; industrial design; and jewelry & metalsmithing. 1700 undergrads with a 9:1 student/faculty ratio.

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Mechanical Engineering

Not biomedical engineering…that’s a very limited & specific degree with not a whole lot of jobs. M.E. is a degree with a much more diverse set of options for employment post-graduation.

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A few comments on architecture – as a major and as a career.

First, I think you can take that prepscholar article with a handful of salt. It’s true that the studio component of an architecture education requires a major time commitment, but generally speaking, the studio is the epicenter of an architecture major. A student who doesn’t love the studio probably won’t love architecture.

Second, there are two paths to becoming a licensed architect: 1) A Bachelor OF Architecture (BArch) or 2) A Bachelor of Arts or Science IN Architecture, Architectural Studies, Art, environmental design, or, really, whatever is of interest – PLUS a Master of Architecture (MArch).

The BArch is usually a 5 year program which is intensely and narrowly architecture focused, and in my opinion, not a good idea for a student who isn’t 100% sure that architecture is for them. The BArch has a high drop out rate, I think because many high school students don’t understand architecture’s balance of design with structures. The students that thrive on the design aspect are often intimidated by the technical side of architecture. The ones that lean toward construction, physics, engineering may be uncomfortable with the focus on design, creativity, and the articulation thereof. Transferring out of a BArch program can be difficult, as the sequence of courses is architecture specific.

The BS/BA+MArch route is, again my opinion, a better choice for students that want to have the leeway to explore other disciplines. The BS/BA+MArch can take anywhere from 6 to 7.5 years, longer than the BArch and therefore may be more costly. Transferring between BS/BA majors is usually a simple process. I like BA/BS programs that are attached to schools of architecture, but many, many students will choose different universities for their graduate work.

Although all accredited BArch and MArch programs offer curriculums that are standardized by the architecture board, there’s a great deal of variation on the degree of focus from program to program. I would stress that MArch programs admit students from all sorts of educational backgrounds and from a wide range of majors as long as the program’s entrance requirements are fulfilled.

A few schools that offer the BA/BS+MArch that I would suggest researching are as follows. Some require portfolios, some do not.

Northeast: Roger Williams, Northeastern, Boston Architectural College

A little further afield, U of Cincinnati, Clemson, WUSTL, UVA, Tulane

There are DOZENS of others, more and less selective. Spending some time with a few websites will give you an idea of the programs. Summer career exploration programs are also very helpful.

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Manhattan College sounds perfect for him. Small (3000+) but has a full range of engineering majors. Lots of academic support if he needs it. (See their Office of Academic Success.) To your concern about drop out rate, if he changes his mind, they also have Schools of Business, Arts & Science, and Education & Health. They recently opened a new Engineering & Science Center to expand their engineering facilities. They have a summer engineering camp for high school students who want to explore their interest in engineering.

I also wonder if he’d be interested in studying Art. Have you ever been to the Storm King Art Center? It’s an outdoor 500 acre sculpture park in New York’s Hudson Valley with sculpture’s of all shapes and sizes, some up to 80’ high and made if I-beams. It’s a fabulous day trip all by itself even if you didn’t have a kid thinking about college, but it could open him up to a world of possibilities.

The Pratt Institute for Art & Architecture in Brooklyn is interesting to visit if he considers school of that type. The campus itself is the largest outdoor sculpture park in NYC.

The Cooper Union for Art, Architecture, & Engineering in Manhattan is a small (900) but prestigious college which brings together art & engineering under one roof. Every student receives accepted to Cooper Union receives a half tuition scholarship.

Olin College of Engineering on the Needham/Wellesley town line is also very small (400) and has a unique hands on approach to the study of Engineering which sounds like it would be right up his alley. Highly competitive for admissions, but he sounds like the kind of kid they’re looking for. They also provide a half tuition scholarship for all their students. Although it’s an engineering focused college, their approach to learning follows the liberal arts tradition so it is steeped in arts, humanities, social sciences, and entrepreneurship, reflecting their belief that engineering exists for the purpose of improving the lives of people. Olin also has cross registration with Babson College of Babson next door, another college which integrates liberal arts with its primary focus, i.e. business. For more liberal arts, Olin also has cross registration with Wellesley just across town. Olin is worth a visit and tour even if it’s not on your list of schools to consider just because it shows a different approach to what the education of engineers can be.

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Bill- kids in my neck of the woods get in to Cornell and Penn for Engineering but get rejected at Cooper Union. It does not sound like a great choice for a kid with dyslexia and a 3.0 GPA. Ditto for Olin- which is somewhat easier to get into stats wise, but it’s tiny and they “pick who they pick”. And it’s a sub-par choice for a kid who discovers in sophomore year that he’s not interested in engineering…

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Yes. Good points. Hence my first recommendation for Manhattan with support from their student success office.

I was pushing Cooper Union more for the Art & Architecture side of things. But you’re right about it being highly selective,

As I mentioned above, Olin is worth a visit just because it’s approach is so different. It’s a way of looking at the education of engineers to help inform other choices as they go through the college search process. I may be crazy - probably am - but this kid sounds so different in a good way that I think it would be worth having a conversation with them about him. Who knows? Maybe they’d see something in him that they like. When mom said that his social circle is limited not because he’s lacking in social skills but because it’s hard fir him to find peers who share his interests, my eyes lit up. I bet he’d find them at Olin. But sadly you’re right, with a 16% acceptance rate they’re rejecting even top students.

Thanks for bringing things back to reality.

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Cost may also be increased because master’s programs in professional fields are often quite expensive, without the usual kinds of undergraduate financial aid available (but much higher amounts of student loans available).

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There are many more career fields out there than most HS kids are aware of. Some require a college degree, some don’t. I suggest you show him the https://www.bls.gov/ooh/ and have him browse thru it to get ideas of areas he might be interested in looking further into.

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Thank you @Sweetgum . I couldn’t agree with you more about influencing… that’s exactly what I’m afraid the other family members are doing. But then I may over correct - so balance is key.

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I just read through all the comments and first off, I have to say thank you so much for all your really thoughtful insight. There is so much value in these posts and I’m grateful for the insight.

Although we are in MA, I am originally from Long Island and went to school in upstate NY. :slightly_smiling_face:. We looked at Hofstra (a grew up a few miles away and worked as a lifeguard at the Marriott next door in HS so I was thinking no way) it was amazing - from the admissions videos. However, size took that off the list. I appreciate the feedback on Manhattan - something about it we really like.
Roger Williams was on our list. SNHU I know little about, with the exception of their marketing. I didn’t consider Olin bc of size and acceptance rate but you make a great point about visiting. It’s considered one of the top engineering schools as well but you’re right, you never know. The thing about dyslexia, it holds you back on traditional grading systems but you know the specific areas of weakness, and it’s not typically in areas that make you a good engineering candidate. I see it as a gift - just not during grade school with our educational structure . Thanks for the recommendations on the sculpture park we will definitely check that out!! And the Architecture input. As well as considering RIT from the fine arts angle! I wonder if he could do an engineering minor. Univ of either HARTFORD or NEW HAVEN had been recommended as a good hands on program. I can’t remember which one. I’ll also look at Ohio - and Scranton. Thanks a million. I really appreciate the dialogue. It takes a village.

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Dyslexia is not uncommon among architects, including some of the most famous (starchitects :blush:) like Norman Foster, Jorn Utzon, Takando Todo, Richard Rogers.

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It does look as if RIT has a MechE minor for non-engineers Mechanical Engineering Minor | RIT , which could even overlap a little with the sculpture BFA program in the Advanced CAD realm. The only concern about that combination is that BFA programs tend to be pretty packed, so an unrelated minor might require an extra semester. Still, it could be a way for him to pursue his real passion while still getting his feet wet in engineering, at a school that might be too much of a long shot as an engineering applicant. Whereas, with the depth of experience he seemingly has, he might be a pretty strong BFA applicant, and the transcript blemishes could be more likely to be overlooked.

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One last question. My son took Physics freshman year - he’s doing his course selection for next year and planned on taking Physics 2. But he never too Chemistry. Do you think that will be a problem for admissions? Physics is more appropriate for the me h engineer or architecture routes.