<p>I want to take Calculus III (V1201), Accelerated Physics I (C2801), and Intensive Organic Chemistry (C3045) together for next semester (Fall 2009, First Year), along with the other required classes.</p>
<p>Will I be able to cope with the work load, or is this a death wish?</p>
<p>(?_?)</p>
<p>That sounds tough. You might want to drop to a lower level in either physics or chemistry, depending on which one seems more interesting to you.</p>
<p>I’m definitely in the same boat.
I WAS hoping to take on Chem 3045, Phys 2801, Calc IV, and Arabic I, but I think I might have made an error in calculating the points: including Lit.Hum. and whatnot, everything came out to 15? :T
Arakeshm, it may prove impossible to choose between chemistry and physics ;]</p>
<p>Cartelle, I did your calculation, and it turns out to be 20 credits, not including Frontiers/UW (24/23 credits, respectively). If you go with that, you’re definitely taking on more than you can chew. I think it’s challenging even with Arabic and either freshmen orgo or accelerated physics. I’ve heard that Arabic is incredibly challenging and time-consuming.</p>
<p>Yeah, if I had to drop one Physics is going to go bye-bye. I’m aiming for chemical engineering, so it’s pretty clear that chemistry has priority over physics in my case.</p>
<p>wow. Both of you are extremely ambitious. I think that any combo of more than 4 “levels” in chem+physics combined is suicide. (level 1-1400, level 2-1600, level 3-batshi t crazyness)</p>
<p>Keep in mind that this is freshman year… your BEST chance to network and get to know people who will eventually be your closest friends/support circles/drinking buddies. If you look at the tracks, everyone pretty much ends up in the same place more or less. </p>
<p>I can see the value in intensive chem (1 semester instead of 2) but besides that, honors level classes I see as overkill/stuff meant for physics/chem superstars. The extra credits really aren’t worth much (you’re probably the type that will have enough to graduate anyway if you’re even THINKING about doing honors in both)…</p>
<p>I’d take the easier route on at least 1 subject (1400+honors) or just doing the intermediates for both. Your social development time is much more valuable.</p>
<p>Argh, yeahh I thought something was wrong when it seemed possible to take that many classes :T
The problem is that I have no idea what science to pick…but currently I’m looking at bio-/chemical physics, so if I jettison anything, it would be Arabic (plus a lot of the classes are full, and that gets rid of 5 points right there). On the other hand, they say it’s a good idea to start languages early?
Bleh back to the drawing board…
Thanks for all the help :] (and saving me from myself haha)</p>
<p>LitHum<br>
FoS<br>
Chem 3045
Phys 2801
Calc IV or Hnrs Math A
(Bio Seminar)</p>
<p>Bear in mind that I’m looking to be a chemical physics or biophysics major.</p>
<p>Again, thanks for all the help :]</p>
<p>I’m SEAS, Chemical Engineering Major</p>
<p>For me its looking like…</p>
<p>Calc II V1102
Physics C1601, or Physics C2801 ( I dunno which, probably the C1601)
Chem C3045
Univ. Writing/Gateway
PE…</p>
<p>This amounts to 14 credits first semester…
then i’ll have</p>
<p>Calc III
Physics C1602
Chem C3045 + lab 2507
Chen 1040
Univ. Writing/Gateway
PE</p>
<p>This amounts to 21 credits in the second…***.</p>
<p>How will they balance this?</p>
<p>Kiwi: </p>
<p>You probably won’t take PE/won’t want to take PE 'till senior year. </p>
<p>For chemE there really isn’t a point to taking the 3000 course. EVERYONE… including people who did 1400/1400 end up in CHEM3443 third semester. </p>
<p>If you want to be pushing the envelope, I think it’s much wiser to take courses ahead of schedule as opposed to doing the honors track. </p>
<p>Calc2/phys1600/chem1600/UW/?</p>
<p>calc3/phys1600/chem1600/uw/chem pre-pro/lab</p>
<p>If you’re looking at a minor I’d advise you fill the ? with an intro course. It’ll give you a breather in your schedule. </p>
<p>Have you also thought of starting in calc 3 and taking no math 2nd semester?</p>
<p>Cartelle:</p>
<p>I still think you’re overdoing it. For one, 3 honors level courses is complete insanity. Lithum and FoS are MUCH more work than you think. This isn’t like high school-- there isn’t a practical payoff to taking honors courses. </p>
<p>You can try it out and register for all 3 and test out the workload… and… well… if problemsets in physics,chem and math are “fun” in a Sawyer-esque way to you, power to you.</p>
<p>I know…it looks like total insanity to me, but I don’t see a way around it! >:| I could try an easier chem or phys course, but then it becomes a matter of which one to demote…the other option is to postpone FoS b/c I’m taking two insane science classes. What would you recommend?</p>
<p>Bob, I took freshman orgo and I wouldn’t recommend doing both accelerated physics and orgo at the same time. Orgo was a painful experience for me and I’ve heard that 2800 physics is equally, if not more, painful. You will literally spend every second of your life studying for both of those classes, although I’ve met people who did that combination and they seemed to turn out ok. </p>
<p>Another point of consideration is the curve. While the teachers in advanced tracks do compensate slightly for the difficulty of the class, it is in no way enough to completely offset the amount you lose from being with such a strong group of students. As freshmen coming to college, I think we all like to believe that we will strive for an intellectual level beyond the petty concerns of gpa, but it seriously sucks to see all of your friends breeze through gen chem while you struggle to maintain a B+ in orgo and are no better off in the end.</p>
<p>For chemical engineering, physics is more important than many people expect so I wouldn’t discount physics for chemistry right away if I were you. However, orgo will get you farther than 2800 physics in terms of requirements.</p>
<p>For people sure about doing ChemE, orgo is probably a better choice than intensive because you will end up being two classes ahead of everyone else by your sophomore year. Not only do you fulfill the first semester requirement for orgo, but second semester also counts for one of the advanced natural science requirements later on. It also makes it possible to pick up a materials science minor with no additional classes beyond the ChemE requirements. I don’t think it helps as much for a BME minor, but it may also benefit people looking for one in EEE.</p>
<p>Cartelle:
FoS is a joke btw, so as a science person you will be banging your head against the wall every day due to your frustration with the lack of substance in that course.</p>
<p>If you care about your GPA at all, don’t go accelerated. As someone who took Orgo with Breslow, I did it for the intellectual curiosity, not the pre-med grade ********. I could have easily had 2 As in chemistry freshman year than a B+ and then a dropped orgo 2. With 1400 physics, I easily got the As I wanted. Enjoy college, not ruin your life trying to take the hardest possible schedule. This isn’t high school anymore, and there is no reason to do this. You will not be rewarded when you struggle in these classes when you have kids from Korea who are physics savants and kids who have done orgo research before freshman year, destroying the curves in these tests. </p>
<p>On a side note, Breslow is probably the best professor I’ve had at Columbia. I found him wildly entertaining and am very please I took the course, of which I’ve learn more than any other course at Columbia. </p>
<p>A note on placement tests, I didn’t even place into Orgo, and still decided to take it. If you really want to take the class, go for it. </p>
<p>Physics 2800 makes no sense for anyone in SEAS to take, unless you are exceedingly confident that you want to be an Applied Physics major. Some of the smartest kids I know would get a B in 2800, when they could have A+ed the 1400. Do yourself a favor and take the general classes. Your gpa will probably .3 points high in the long run because of it. </p>
<p>Regarding 1600 versus 1400 physics, 1600 has harder problems but is generally open calculators and open book to compensate. 1400 has simpler more conceptual problems. </p>
<p>Don’t take intensive general chemistry. It’s harder than orgo and everyone who I knew took it hated it. </p>
<p>Calc 3 is really easy, easier than calc 2. If you can place into it by AP classes or what not you should take it. It hard to place into calc 4 or higher, you need to get special permission in the Math department. I know kids who have done that or gone straight into diffeq. Also don’t take the Matsci pre professional course. It’s the worst course I’ve taken at Columbia, bar none.</p>
<p>Mike, any input on taking honors math for an IEOR major? Same deal as acclerated physics with the math/science savants?</p>
<p>For Phys 1600, if you have friends in the right places, you can get the answers to the problemsets (and the whole book), thus making the class not time consuming at all (the book is just as good as going to lecture IMO) with a high chance to do well on ONE of the midterms. (the other is dropped).</p>
<p>I’ll chime in on Honors Math (a good friend took it). It ate up her time like no other. It was a ton of proofs, a ton of theory stuff and most of the kids were math majors. Not anything that you’d need or that would give you an edge in IEOR. If you’re doing OR:FE, you’d be better off taking calc III or even jumping right into Linear (ODE if you’re REALLY brave) to get ahead course-wise. OR:FE is a TON of requirements (woohoo EMS!)</p>
<p>thanks shockwave! another qn, intro to econ with gulati is at 196/201 and freshman registration hasn’t even started…does this mean we first years have no hope of getting in, or is he flexible with the enrollment limit?</p>
<p>The best advice I can give any engineering major is stay out of the Math Department as much as possible, unless you have a training in proof based mathematics. You can get out of linear algebra by taking applied math 3101, a much better course, one that has less proofs, concentrates on the computational aspects that you will actually use, and covers more mathematical topics that your class in the Math department. </p>
<p>In addition, talk to the individual department to see if you can get the Linear/ODE applied math course to count for ODE. I know in applied math this is the case. The ODE taught in the math department is taught by faculty who have little capacity to teach. You will be better prepared for your upcoming classes if you take the applied math versions if possible.</p>
<p>Honors math is academically rewarding, but fantastically difficult, especially if you haven’t participated in USAMO or been taught calculus in a proof based manner, as opposed to test based i.e. AP calculus. </p>
<p>If you really want to get into a class, show up the first day and keep checking ssol.columbia.edu. A lot of upperclassmen will eventually drop leaving space open for you. The same thing with Art and Music Hum.</p>
<p>What subjects are there placement tests for?
Chem, duh; but not Physics? What about Math?<br>
I’ve seen the sentence, “there will be a special meeting during Orientation for those interested in taking higher mathematics and science classes,” in the booklet, and I know chem has a test but physics doesn’t…
Also, after freshman year, what is an average course load in terms of number of classes and points?</p>
<p>PS I am definitely not considering Hnrs Math anymore (soul-sucking proofs - ick). What is the point of accelerated classes if they’re just there to ruin your GPA? Do they really not pay off at all when it comes time for grad school?</p>
<p>And now… I have actually decided to drop either 2800’s Physics, or both 2800’s Physics and Intensive Orgo. Apparently it’s true: the intensity of the classes does not outweigh the lower grade when it comes to graduate school admissions.</p>
<p>Oh, for those of you out there, when it doubt just take the class. A friend told me that you’ll be able to drop the class up until after (or was it before) the first midterm. That and he told me that another way to see if you’re up for the class is to look at the first homework assignment. If you struggle with it, don’t take the class.</p>
<p>Yes, you can drop the class several weeks into the semester if you decide it’s too difficult, but keep in mind that if you want to transfer to a lower level, you’ll have to have attended all those lectures as well. Otherwise you’ll be incredibly behind on all the material in that class. Also, adding the lower level class will require the professor’s permission, which isn’t always a given. </p>
<p>While it’s true that the homework assignments may give you a good idea of how hard the class is, they’re not always reflective of what’s on the exams. For example, when I took intensive gen chem freshman year, we had book problems as well as challenge problems that the professor created. The challenge problems were much, much harder and required derivations that I barely understood, but the midterms were actually closer to the book problems. </p>
<p>Also, I have to disagree about intensive gen chem. I took it with Berne (not Flynn), and even though it appeared incredibly difficult (the lectures were very theoretical and had a lot of difficult equations), the exams were all about memorizing formulas and knowing how to use them. It won’t make you love chemistry, but it’ll say you a lot of time in the long run. In retrospect, I’m glad I took it as a freshman because it taught me how to study for a college class.</p>