Food for thought on possible admitting stats

Colleges and Universities A-Z Fordham University
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<p>I've been following this board for the past 2 yrs now, and it's amazing to see how much its traffic has increased. That definitely reflects positively on Fordham. I'm also surprised by some of the early action info coming in on another thread - surprised in the sense that I would have guessed that some who were accepted would have been offered a scholarship, but weren't, and also surprised by who is being deferred instead of accepted. It just goes to show everyone exactly what Peter Farrell said in a recent thread, that the caliber of students applying to Fordham in this year's pool is extremely high.</p>

<p>But, back to the topic of this thread. I was wasting time thinking what the numbers may be looking like for the Regular Decision pool as next March comes around. This is what my estimates are coming to...now don't "scream" at me if my numbers are a bit off. These are just estimates and also by memory.</p>

<p>Last year's yield rate for Fordham (% of students who were offered acceptances who did accept) was about 20%. No one has ever mentioned what the individual early action/regular decision breakdown was, so I can only assume for it to be equal. If you apply this % to this year's early action numbers, you can guess that Fordham can count on filling about 700 of their 1600 undergrad slots (again not taking into account the differences between Lincoln Center and Rose Hill's acceptance rates, nor between dorming/commuter rates). I got this number from taking about 7000 EA applicants and 50% acceptance (rounding Mr. Farrell's numbers).</p>

<p>Let's assume Fordham's application numbers don't increase but stays the same as last year (22,000). Take away 7000 EA applicants which leaves 15,000 applications to go, plus it would be fare to guess that Fordham probably deferred most of the 3500 EA candidates that they didn't accept right now, so let's bring this number up to 18,000 applicants for the remaining 900 slots available.</p>

<p>If Fordham is betting that their yield is remaining the same as last year (20%), they can only offer 4500 acceptances in the regular decision pool (20% of 4500 is 900).</p>

<p>Now, if you look at the Regular Decision potential numbers, I think, conservatively, only about 25% of these kids will be offered an acceptance (25% of 18,000 is 4500). If there's a higher number of applicants or if Fordham is guessing the yield will be higher, then the March Regular Decision acceptance rate can be as low as 20%.</p>

<p>As a very proud alum of Fordham (just read my past threads), I'm amazed with how these numbers look like their going to predict out.</p>

<p>So, why am I wasting anyone's time even typing this? 2 reasons: first, to get it into the minds of some of the kids out there that Fordham is not a "slam dunk" for anyone -- not with these statistics. And, second, for those who were deferred or applying regular decision, you still have time to add to your application if you think it will be beneficial.</p>

<p>Fordham really does want students that truly want to attend the school -- and you need to somehow earnestly convey this if you want to attend. The applicant pool is just too strong to smugly think that Fordham can be used as a "safety". That would be a poor bet to make for anyone.</p>

<p>My son is at Fordham now and loves it, even currently going through his first finals week as a freshman. Fordham seems to be everything he was looking for, both academically and socially, and he has no regrets turning down his other acceptances, including Brown University.</p>

<p>Fordham is very special with what it has to offer. (a cheap plug for those accepted through early action and not sure what to do).</p>

<p>--jack</p>

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<p>What a post. Great numbers. You sound a little to interested for your age. Lol. By any chance is your son, Will?</p>

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<p>Nope, not Will. I pm'd you.</p>

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<p>LOL......well.....I dont know what the numbers of applications will yield, pardon the pun, and how many will be given a green light and how many will be unfortunately told they did not make the cut or get put into that awful status of "wait listed" where you simply don't know....last year, I heard it was HUGE! And very few got in off the wait list as they had a RECORD high yield from their acceptance letters.</p>

<p>Yes, Jack, its a great school with a great experience! Its not perfect or Nirvana...no school is. I know things about some pretty lofty ranked schools that would curdle your blood. It happens. But I am not about slamming anyone. For many kids, the experience of being in New York and being in college is a rude awakening to reality....how other people behave and what some people get away with. There are always going to be rule breakers. And no school has 100% satisfaction with professors and classes. Sometimes, you get a dud. But that happens just as often at some of the Ivy's and elites as it does at Fordham. </p>

<p>Overall, my D's experience has been extraordinary and wonderful. We are proud Fordham Family members. If the world was perfect, we could make all our own rules and have everyone else follow them! LOL. But its not.</p>

<p>And if it was perfect there would be enough room for Fordham to admit all the WONDERFUL kids who really do have the stats and character to survive and thrive at Fordham. Sadly, that is not the case and too many have to be given sad news of deferral and maybe rejection later. Its a tough market out there. But there are LOTS of kids in their shoes all over the country. The Director of Admissions at the University of Virginia told us during a tour of the campus that they could EASILY fill their ranks every year with perfect 4.0 gpa and perfect 1600 SAT kids. But they dont and wont. So they pick kids from all kinds of backgrounds and stats...and that means that some kids who are highly qualified get the bad news. And some kids with a questionable stat...or ones that are lower than many.....get lucky and get in.</p>

<p>Its the nature of the beast. Scholarships are really no different. I have no crystal ball to determine who does and who doesnt get the Dean's Scholarship and full ride. We didnt, that is for sure. Was my D qualified? We certainly think so. But we didnt have 22,000 applications staring us in the face either. And there are MORE scholarships available to upper classmen in various programs, so its not over by a long shot.</p>

<p>The point is, if Fordham is made affordable, and if you get in, and comparing it to other schools and their offers and their location etc, then I believe we made the right choice because the proof is in the pudding: My D is happy and thriving academically. Does that mean there are not periodical issues? Of course not. You should hear all the chatter in town we are picking up from various kids at various colleges around the country who are home for the holidays. It is amazing. </p>

<p>I just wish for all the kids who REALLY REALLY want to attend Fordham, and truly do have the stats....not kids who are reaching a bit far for their britches at present (not a put down...we all have gifts from God..and for some kids, its not the SAT) that they could get admitted. Nothing worse than seeing a broken hearted kid who is qualified and who WANTS to attend Fordham...not the ones who are simply using it as a safety or collecting ego letters....to brag about, who is denied admission. But that is life.</p>

<p>So for all of those who have been admitted this past week, Congratulations Welcome to the Fordham Family....hope to see you on Edward's Parade at some point! For those who got deferred, I am truly sorry for you and wish I could do something to help you....but all I can offer is my sincere condolences and perhaps a glimmer of hope for RD, and if not that, then maybe I can give you some SAGE advice on your other choices. God Bless!</p>

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<p>Srry to be the idiot on this thread..I got accepted to Fordham for Spring '08 transfer and I really loved the Rose Hill Campus, If I didn't get into NYU, I would have been quite happy attending Fordham but seriously anyone who gets accepted to Brown and turns it down for Fordham should have their head examined,lol... Again, nothing against Fordham but Brown's social scene is outstanding, diverse and exciting, the campus is beautiful and the academic enviroment far surpasses Fordham...Yes, I know people who attend both and yes I have spent more than a few weekends at Brown... </p>

<p>If you chose Fordham and are very happy, more power to you but turning down Brown should never be viewed as a good decision, unless of course you went to Princeton instead,lol...</p>

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<p>Brown is not for everyone. It is extremely liberal and very "loose." There is no core requirement. Fordham is moderate to conservative and not as politically charged. Fordham has a strict core requirement. Brown is in Providence, Rhode Island. Fordham is in the Bronx and Manhattan, New York City.</p>

<p>Two very different schools.</p>

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<p>For Track87, I tried holding my urge back from commenting on your post, but I am too weak.</p>

<p>Starting your thread with "Srry to be the idiot..." is very appropriate, I must agree. And I would like to do a copy/paste of what you posted in another thread:</p>

<p>"Well, I don't know about anyone else, but you sound like a real pompous ass to me,lol...Ever consider applying to a music conservatory somewhere in Europe, you would fit right in with all the other elitist "white male" admissions officer's wet dreams,lol..."</p>

<p>Now, can you find irony in the following proverb: People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.</p>

<p>OK, now that I got that out of my system, more to the point. When one is in their late teens to early 20's as far as age, the outlook on life and what is important tends to be very different than as one ages and matures. I am proud of my son's maturity (in respect to most things), and he showed great maturity with his college selection. As I found out not that long ago, in the end it came down to either Brown or Fordham to attend, and there were 3 attributes to Fordham that convinced him.</p>

<p>First, he was admitted to Rose Hill's Honors Program, which is a superb program to say the least. It is small, with seminar style lectures (for the most part), and the students are well taken care of by the program director. They also have experiences that are unique, such as Father McShane, Fordham's president, giving an interactive discussion during each semester, the first just to meet the students, and the second to go over a particular literary work.</p>

<p>Second, he looked closely at his intended major, attending lectures at both Fordham and Brown, and speaking to multiple professors at both schools. He concluded that he would get a more personal experience at Fordham than at Brown. As far as the quality of the education in his major at the undergraduate level, it is top notch and I'm sure will prepare him well for graduate school (where "name" seems to matter more).</p>

<p>Third, he liked the studentbody better at Fordham than at Brown. And, judging by the friends that he has made thus far, I can't disagree with him.</p>

<p>From this parent's viewpoint, and with probably more life experience than you have Track87, I would say that the maturity my son showed in his final college choice was exceptionally good, as was his decision, and as was his judgement. Good luck at NYU.</p>

<p>--jack</p>

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<p>Like I said...if he's happy, more power to him...I stilll maintain that the difference in academics and the advantage of a Brown education far exceeds Fordham..and no, I'm hardly pompous, I have nothing against Fordham, I applied there....</p>

<p>But hey, it's just MY OPINION, obviously he's happy and you're comfortable that he made the right choice, that's fine..I wish him nothing but luck...and in the end, if he's going to graduate school, that's the thing employers really look at anyway, no disagreement there.....when you get an MBA or Masters, where you went to Graduate school far outweighs where you went to undergrad so in the end it won't really matter I guess...</p>

<p>Thks about NYU...Happy Xmas to everyone and HAppy New Year.</p>

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<p>nyu washingtion sq > any school.</p>

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<p>Willy:
"First, he was admitted to Rose Hill's Honors Program, which is a superb program to say the least. It is small, with seminar style lectures (for the most part), and the students are well taken care of by the program director. They also have experiences that are unique, such as Father McShane, Fordham's president, giving an interactive discussion during each semester, the first just to meet the students, and the second to go over a particular literary work.</p>

<p>"Second, he looked closely at his intended major, attending lectures at both Fordham and Brown, and speaking to multiple professors at both schools. He concluded that he would get a more personal experience at Fordham than at Brown. As far as the quality of the education in his major at the undergraduate level, it is top notch and I'm sure will prepare him well for graduate school (where "name" seems to matter more)."</p>

<p>Just on an argument level, and even on the level influenced by personal experience, the educational quality of Fordham and the educational quality of the honors program are two entirely different things; they're leagues apart—and I think it's important to draw this distinction. </p>

<p>Willy, judging the intellectual experience of Fordham by your son's experience in the honors program is flat-out misleading. Students in honors dine with their professors in Manhattan; students not in honors (95-98% of the student body) will never experience that, or symposiums, or 6-7 students per class or registering for classes early or a personal upperclass mentor. Maybe 25 freshman are in honors—the idea that "he would get a more personal experience at Fordham than at Brown" is just so misleading; it is very much based on the fact that your son is in honors.</p>

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<p>Students who live in Queens Court dine with professors, have various functions and contests, including Disputatio, and otherwise interact with each other, faculty and administrators. Moreover, my D has had great relationships with several of her professors, though not all of them. </p>

<p>Some schools emphasize the warm and fuzzy relationships with professors and others dont. But I also heard at some schools (not in New York and not Ivy League) that those "dine in your professor's homes" thing can be overrated.....it doesnt change their grade and their expectations. It works for some and others dont seem to care one way or another.</p>

<p>There is no such thing as a "singular college experience." They are unique at almost every campus in the United States. Which is why picking the right college is important for Freshmen. But whatever that experience may be, whether a large state school, or small private or LAC, their job is to prepare you for the working world and adult life.</p>

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<p>i agree w. WillyWankaWannaB. Although I am not in the Honors Program, I feel I am getting a much more personalized education. The professors strongly encourage the students to come to them during their office hours. In addition, the class lectures are very interactive. I cannot say if the same is not true for Brown, because I have never visited it nor did I apply to it. Track, I understand your argument about turning down Brown for Fordham, but as it turns out, it is a very common occurrence. Many of those in the Honors Program have been accepted to Ivy League colleges, but chose to enroll in Fordham. Perhaps they want a student body that is more down to earth, or politically centrist, or they do not want to be lumped into the "elitist" group. Who knows? But they must have seen something in Fordham in order to turn down such prestigious offerings from other great universities.</p>

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<p>seafoodlover:
"Students who live in Queens Court dine with professors, have various functions and contests, including Disputatio, and otherwise interact with each other, faculty and administrators. Moreover, my D has had great relationships with several of her professors, though not all of them."</p>

<p>Not exactly. I live in Queens Court, and it's great—but it's not honors-esque in that way. Residents don't dine with professors, and Disputatio occurs twice a year. There's a lot—too much, at times—of overlap between Queens Court and honors. At times it feels like the honors dorm (it also being the wellness dorm) plus other people. But in regards to the professors: absolutely.</p>

<p>"There is no such thing as a "singular college experience." They are unique at almost every campus in the United States. Which is why picking the right college is important for Freshmen. But whatever that experience may be, whether a large state school, or small private or LAC, their job is to prepare you for the working world and adult life."</p>

<p>Okay? My point, to reiterate, is that WillyWanka's son is experiencing something that is incredibly specific, and should not be viewed, even if one is accepted to Fordham, as an accessible experience. It's not, and that's sort of the point.</p>

<p>"Although I am not in the Honors Program, I feel I am getting a much more personalized education. The professors strongly encourage the students to come to them during their office hours. In addition, the class lectures are very interactive"</p>

<p>Completely agree. Even if you're not in honors (I'm not) Fordham really does offer accessible professors, especially in the humanities. As a freshman, I had a wonderful history course taught by a US delegate—or something along those lines—to Germany. Amazing professor.</p>

<p>"Track, I understand your argument about turning down Brown for Fordham, but as it turns out, it is a very common occurrence. Many of those in the Honors Program have been accepted to Ivy League colleges, but chose to enroll in Fordham."</p>

<p>This is very true, almost to an annoyance. By the end of the first week, you'll know who the honors people are, and exactly which colleges they got into. It's ridiculous—do I really need to know that?</p>