Football Recruiting Process

Athletic Recruits
1

<p>Hi, this is my first child going through the recruiting process so I have a couple questions for you veterans out there. My son is currently a junior in high school and the schools weve been looking at primarily the Ivy League, the Patriot League, and the NESCAC. I've had my son fill out the online questionnaires for the schools and we've also visited a handful of them. We've received emails from almost all of the schools back, but its hard to gauge the interest. So basically how do you know if a school is truly interested?</p>

<p>I'm sure I'll think of some more questions so when I do I'll just post them here.</p>

<p>Thanks a ton.</p>

2

<p>Have you sent any tape? If you haven’t your not getting any real interest. If you have and coach are contacting your child you’re getting interest. I wouldn’t look at it any deeper at the moment, because things change. Grades and future grades have a lot to do with the ivy and patriot league recruiting as well.</p>

3

<p>Our son targeted the NESCAC’s . Initially he filled out all the online questionnaires, sent his SAT and ACT scores and then sent his junior highlight film. The film is key. If they look at your film and are interested then you will hear from them. We signed up to attend the prospect days/one day camps that most of the schools run. These are invaluable because each school is similar in their recruiting guidelines but usually have different academic thresholds. These prospect days will also give you a feel for the program/coach/school and may rule out some of the schools for you and your son. Try and find out how many freshmen they plan on recruiting and how many “slots” they will have. The slots are used with admissions to get the best players who may not meet the schools admission criteria. Then how many “tips” they may have. These are players who the coach will support through admissions but who better meet admission criteria.
You can expect to receive a lot of generic emails that go out to all possible recruits. But if your son is an outstanding football player you will of course have coaches after him. If he is a great football player with great grades the NESCAC schools provide an amazing opportunity to continue playing the sport he loves and the opportunity to get a great education.
In our experience, coaches looked at his junior film and his grades and his test scores and those schools/coaches that were still interested in him remained in contact with him as he started his senior year. They were of course looking for senior game film as soon as possible. For us weekly phone calls from the coaches started in September. By end of October, we were down to one school who was making consistent contact although we still received generic emails from some of the other schools. If your son is a slot player you will know, if he is asked to apply Early Decision with support from the coach that means that he will have already been to admissions for an early read and things look good. However, it’s not a guarantee that your son is in. This year was an incredibly competitive year and admissions was not giving anything away, believe me! Our son was asked to go EDI and because his first quarter grade in AP Physics was a little low, they put his application to regular decision. So nothing is a guarantee.</p>

<p>I only wish we had known about the whole process ahead of time. Perhaps it would have made things a little less stressful, although maybe not. Hope this helps a little. Be happy to tell you more if you want to PM me.</p>

4

<p>FootballParent1,</p>

<p>I think you are getting great advice above. Although my son is not a football player, the recruiting process is fairly universal. It is so much better to know this stuff ahead of time than wrestle with it while it is going on. In addition to the advice missswan and cardinal 16 are giving you, I would strongly encourage you to review the Ivy Academic Index if your son is considering an Ivy League school. There are other posts on this site about the AI as well.</p>

<p>[Calculating</a> the Ivy League Academic Index](<a href=“http://home.comcast.net/~charles517/ivyai.html]Calculating”>http://home.comcast.net/~charles517/ivyai.html)</p>

5

<p>With regards to summer camps, are they necessary in order to get recruited? Can they hurt your chances? My son has generated a lot of interest based on his junior highlight film and I’m afraid attending camps may decrease the current interest. </p>

<p>Also, how early do Ivy League recruits typically commit? Is it to early to start asking about where my son is on their respective lists?</p>

6

<p>FB Parent: The camps/prospect days will give the coaching staff an opportunity to see your son, perhaps even speak with him and with you. I think they are invaluable because his attendance shows them he is interested in their school. Some of the bigger camps held at BC for example, will have a lot of players and it may be hard to get a look there but my son went to one day camps at Amherst, Williams, Middlebury, Bowdoin, Bates, Colby, Wesleyan
and Penn and attended their prospect days which include a tour of the school, athletic facilities and a detailed explanation of the football program and the coaching philosophy.</p>

<p>Why do you think they will lose interest in your son if he does attend the camps?
If you think he may truly be interested in certain schools I would make the effort to go.You’ll learn a great deal and most importantly make a connection with the coach. I can’t imagine how we would have gone further along the recruiting process without going.</p>

7

<p>Thanks for the input, Misswan.</p>

8

<p>First off, sending out film to every school is the biggest key. Send out a highlight film to every school that he has interest in. Llater on they will probably want to see a whole game film.</p>

<p>“With regards to summer camps, are they necessary in order to get recruited? Can they hurt your chances? My son has generated a lot of interest based on his junior highlight film and I’m afraid attending camps may decrease the current interest.”

  • I would highly recommend attending. This allows coaches to evaluate players in person, because sometimes it is hard to gauge one recruit against another solely based on film. It can actually hurt to not attend. I have seen people who have received less DI offers than they should have because they attended very few camps.</p>

<p>Another thing is that Ivy League and Patriot League are IAA, therefore performance on the field is the most important thing for them. They will take players with grades and test scores that are lower than the average admitted applicant at these schools, people that would never get admitted, or have a slim chance of being admitted if it weren’t for football.</p>

9

<p>For those who have dealt with the NESCAC schools, does anyone know the academic floors if they have any? Particularly at Williams, Amherst, or Middlebury.</p>

10

<p>fbparent, the way the Amherst coach explained it…a 2100 on the SAT and football you are in…anything else he would need to work with admissions. This was part of his speech at the camp. (I loved him by the way… I think they should film his speech to show to all Parents). The farther you are from the 2100 on SAT, the more he has to give to admissions, so the kid has to be worth it. Also, a lot of the NESCAC schools, look to get the recruits the IVY’s chase but dont ultimately accept, so they may show a lot of interest, then suddenly go cold, as they just got a better recruit. </p>

<p>I agree film is the key to getting notice, but GPA and most importantly SAT’s are the dividing line. You will not be able to really gauge interest until you have a definite SAT score in hand. None of the IVY’s or NESCAC really want to sacrifice their SAT median scores, so the athletes are pretty close to everyone else. Also the IVY’s use something called an academic index which takes into account, postion, skill, gpa and SAT’s.</p>

<p>If you are seriously thinking IVY, please know they only give NEED based aid, as do most of the NESCAC’s. </p>

<p>Lots of coaches show interest based on junior tapes, but most seem to really base their decisions on senior year tapes. Also, for the IVY’s, they seemed to have already know who they wanted even before Junior year, seems they scouted as much as the other D1 schools.</p>

11

<p>“I agree film is the key to getting notice, but GPA and most importantly SAT’s are the dividing line. You will not be able to really gauge interest until you have a definite SAT score in hand. None of the IVY’s or NESCAC really want to sacrifice their SAT median scores, so the athletes are pretty close to everyone else.”
-False…NESCAC’s will not budge on their SAT’s because they are D3. The Ivy’s however, will to an extent. I know someone who was being recruited by Cornell and he only had around 1100-1200 (out of 1600) on his SAT’s, with a solid GPA. If you have the talent, the Ivy’s will lower their standards a little for your academics.</p>

12

<p>fbparent1 Jerseygirl is right. The Amherst coach gave the most definite SAT score of 2100. Williams coach was definitely looking for the strongest players and Middlebury did not give a definite SAT number but did explain that the slot players were the best players who needed the most help in admissions because of lower scores and that the remaining recruits credentials had to be in line with “regular” applicants.</p>

13

<p>ftballswim91</p>

<p>Remember the Ivys have to abide by the IVY Academic Index. So if they go after someone like you describe in post #11, there are specfic rules that must be followed. There is a bottom threshold, and he must meet that number at the very least…no exceptions. Reading between the lines, he must be a stud athlete and/or two way athlete for them to recruit someone at with a perceived lower-than normal Ivy SAT. SAT is a big part of the AI.</p>

14

<p>check out my other thread: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/amherst-college/891177-warning-prospective-athletes.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/amherst-college/891177-warning-prospective-athletes.html&lt;/a&gt; i have just finished the ivy/nescac/MIT recruiting process and have a lot of recent knowledge. biggest advice, dont listen to it until you have a likely letter or acceptance in hand, i got lied to many times. (brown calls, tells me the head coach loves my film, want to bring me down for official, never hear from them again.) Ivys are football first, good sat scores help but they want football players. dont take the nescac lightly either, especially amherst, i just got denied, i suspect they withdrew my support that seemed so solid. I went to 4 ivy league camps, they are great if you are a standout, or want to meet d3 coaches, but they are really just money machines, my QB at MIT said he won mvp at the harvard camp and never heard from them. I got into MIT with help from the football team (yes the team can help now, dont listen to ppl who say it cant) Its a very rough dirty process, have a great senior year.</p>

<p>I was in the 4th academic bracket from the beggining, if your scores are lower it may be a problem, but the 4th bracket is larger than you would think.</p>

<p>one more thing, i met and impressed many d3 coaches at camps, so they may be a good idea, i probably wouldnt have applied to MIT if it wasnt for the harvard camp. they are also torture tho, 7 am to 930 pm of football, no need to stay all 4 days either. pm me if you have questions</p>

15

<p>Is GPA or SAT more important at Nescac schools? Is there a specific floor as with the Ivies? Appreciate all the feedback.</p>

16

<p>GPA and SAT are definetly more import at NESCAC schools because they are division 3. Good academic Division 3 programs will seldom lower standards for athletes for admission. They may lower them, but ever so slightly.
fenwaysouth, if the player that an Ivy League school is recruiting meets the Academic Index of which you speak, they will let him in, remember they are D-IAA. Now, Ivy’s will not let just any dumb a** in because of their football/ sports ability. To meet the index, you still have to be fairly smart.</p>

17

<p>you can play ivy football with a 1200 if you are good enough, 1300’s are middle of the road 1400’s seem to be their 4th bracket. “if you have 3 600’s you are in the ballpark” came out of the mouth of a princeton coach. my 1490 didnt do much for me haha, but its all sats at the ivys as far as academics. i cant say much about the nescacs, i was definetly academically qualified for amherst (i managed to get into MIT) but i got canned with “football support” ive been hearing that you should do ED at NESCACS if you want an easier in</p>

18

<p>ftballswim91 & abstract</p>

<p>“fenwaysouth, if the player that an Ivy League school is recruiting meets the Academic Index of which you speak, they will let him in, remember they are D-IAA.”</p>

<p>“you can play ivy football with a 1200 if you are good enough, 1300’s are middle of the road 1400’s seem to be their 4th bracket. “if you have 3 600’s you are in the ballpark” came out of the mouth of a princeton coach”</p>

<p>abstract - BTW congrats on the MIT acceptance. I thought I had congratulated you before, but I want to make sure. That is a great accomplishment. I’m sure your looking forward to it alot.</p>

<p>My two cents…</p>

<p>First, you have to be an athlete that they want. As I try to simplify it in my mind (I did not go to an Ivy ;-)), the athletic dept has only so much equity that they can use with admissions to get athletes for a recruiting year. This process quantifies that equity for the athletics dept to admissions. SATs are part the overall equation and will vary by each athlete. If your SAT is lower, you better make up for it in other statistical areas such as class rank and SAT IIs.</p>

<p>THe AI is a ranking system that uses a distribution or standard deviation method to rank each recruit. Each AI varies slightly by each school, because the AI is calculated for a specific class. My understanding is that no athlete can be more than one standard deviation from the avg of the class. Please understand that the AI is just a statistical tool – it does not take into account a student’s essays, teacher recommendations, outside achievements or awards. In short, the AI is a formula that combines the averages of student test scores (both SAT I’s and SAT II’s) and high school rank in class. The AI is represented on a scale of 1-240, with 240 being the highest, and 171 being the lowest. The approximate average of Ivy applicants is around 200 while the average AI of accepted students is closer to the 211 range.</p>

<p>THose are the rules they have to play with. I find it incredibly facinating because I haven’t figured out how they do it…how do they recuit really smart football players in mass quantity. College football teams are large, and it really becomes a numbers game for them to fill positions by need at the same time making sure they are covered by the AI numbers. Just like any other recruited sport, you have to have an idea of where you are in the pecking order of recruited athletes for your position…I can’t emphasize this enough. You can fairly easily calculate a number, but it is very difficult to fully understand from the coach where you stand in his pecking order. In that regard, it is a poker game. Many of you have heard me describe it that way, and I stand by that analogy. </p>

<p>So, if you are have an AI of 220, you are a stud athlete, you go to their camps & visits, and you keep positive, regular communication with the coach…I like your chances a real lot. If you have an AI of 180, you MUST be a super stud athlete, and go to their camps and keep regular communication with the coach. The coach is going to have to use some of that “equity” with admissions that I spoke of, and you are going to be COMPETING with more super stud athletes for those lesser AI spots.</p>

<p>This is the way I look at it in my simple world. My son is a baseball player, so I’m not sure if there are slight differences with football. I wouldn’t think so, because AI is basis for athletic recrutiing in all Ivys. In any event, I would absolutely START with the AI to figure out where you stand on the academic side, because that will tell you how much pull the coach will need to have with admissions.</p>

19

<p>“Good academic Division 3 programs will seldom lower standards for athletes for admission. They may lower them, but ever so slightly.”</p>

<p>Simply wrong as a matter of fact. Outside of Cal Tech and a couple of others, recruited athletes have a major advantage in the admissions process at virtually every DIII school.</p>

20

<p>One thing to remember is that Ivy coaches are football first, these guys lose their jobs if they do not do well (Princeton coach was just fired) they exert the pressure on them down to their players (had a very informative interview with a young Brown football alum who regretted playing because of how much work the team was and how they lowered his grades). They are looking to stretch the admissions office as far as they can to get the absolute best players they can; their jobs depend on it. make sure your son is ready for a d1 program with year round 6am workouts.</p>

<p>Also,I think MIT gives more help than people assume, their basketball team has some very big, very good players (I got to watch a game, they made it to the national D3 tournament) and its hard to imagine them getting so many great athletes without helping them out. NESCAC schools have “slots” allowing them to admit players who are not quite academically qualified [Online</a> Extra: Amherst’s “A” List: Affluence, Achievement, Athletics](<a href=“Bloomberg - Are you a robot?”>Bloomberg - Are you a robot?) really good article from the head of amherst admissions about the process. D3 is in my opinion a better option than the ivys for someone who takes school seriously, as ivy football may dominate your life</p>