For computer engineering: USC versus Berkeley

Colleges and Universities A-Z University of Southern California
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<p>I've kind of cross-posted this. Nobody replied in the "College Admissions" forum so I figured I might as well post it here and hope for some replies. Thanks enormously in advance.</p>

<p>This is my dilemma. I'm a resident of Virginia, but I'd really love to get the heck out of this state. The colleges that I actually got into were: George Mason University, Virginia Tech, UVA, Drexel, USC, and Berkeley. I'd really prefer not going to Tech. The place doesn't interest me at all. Out of all these colleges, my parents and I have narrowed it down to UVA, USC, and Berkeley. We're heavily considering UVA due to its proximiy to where we are right now (DC suburbs) and its prestige. I, personally, want to go to California, so my choice there is between Berkeley and USC.</p>

<p>That's the background. Financially, we can afford UVA because it's in-state: Tuition is approximately $25,000 a year. USC gave me quite a bit of financial aid, bringing my approximate cost of attendance down to around $35,000 a year. That's about $10,000 more than UVA a year. Berkeley gave me close to no financial aid; as a result, we'd be paying around $52,000 a year at Berkeley.</p>

<p>We can't really afford the California colleges on our own. However, my grandparents, who are quite wealthy, have offered to pay for my entire college education, regardless of where I go. My dad wants me to go to Berkeley, but I think I'd prefer USC. I'm not 100% sure on these, but the social life seems better at USC, it's still very highly ranked for engineering, and it's in Los Angeles. Additionally, it's private and has all the perks of a private college. In contrast, Berkeley is a public college. I've heard horror stories of students having to stay at Berkeley for five years instead of four, overcrowded classes, etc. I mean, if I were to attend Berkeley, I'd be paying nearly full tuition for the exact same education California residents are paying in-state tuition for.</p>

<p>Overall, I'm not really sure what I'm talking about, which is why I must ask you guys to advise me here! What are the pros and cons of USC and Berkeley? Which would be better for me?</p>

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<p>In the long run private schools are better, and of course as USC is rising rapidly ( I doubt well stop this year after the 200 million) come to USC lol</p>

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<p>I’m very familiar with both schools…having attended Berkeley and numerous family members and friends attending USC.</p>

<p>IMO, the whole “USC being better because it’s private” is kinda overblown. Fact is USC is still a very large private university. Don’t go there expecting tiny classes and a coddled liberal arts college environment. The benefit of USC is that it has good financial aid that is attracting smart students…no problems there. USC’s campus is very nice and Trojan pride exudes. The one thing lacking about USC in my opinion, is its location. Yes, L.A. can be an exciting destination…however 'SCs campus is not in the greatest, student friendly area. The campus is bodered by wide boulevards, strip malls, massive parking structures, two freeways, some mediocre museums, an aging Los Angeles landmark and a decrepit old basketball arena…although I admit the new Galen Center is very nice. USC’s reputation is strongest in Southern California. Do you intend to relocate to Socal permanently?</p>

<p>Berkeley is expensive for you…that is a drawback. Berkeley, like USC, is located in a sort of griitty urban environment. However, the difference between Berkeley and USC’s environment are that Berkeley is a much more student-oriented college city. Lots of independent cafes, shops and restaurants in the “Gourmet Ghetto”. Public transportation in the Bay Area far exceeds LA as well. You will not need a car to get around…you can directly acess campus, airports and Bay Area attractions via BART trains. Berkeley also seems to be the more lively, intellectual environment compared to USC, which has a more sterilized, pre-professional feel.</p>

<p>Also, since you’re wanting to study computer engineering, Berkeley’s program is among the top in the nation. The name will carry you very far, if you choose to go back to Virginia, or use your degree for all the great opportunities in Silicon Valley.</p>

<p>I would highly suggest you visit both, if possible, before deciding. Both Berkeley and USC have their benefits and will provide a great education, but they aren’t for everyone.</p>

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<p>

I wouldn’t worry about this as a computer engineering major. The College of Engineering has seen negligible impact due to budget cuts and actually requires you graduate in four years.
[Freshman</a> Admission FAQ — UC Berkeley College of Engineering](<a href=“Prospective freshman FAQs - Berkeley Engineering”>Prospective freshman FAQs - Berkeley Engineering)</p>

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And if you attend USC, you’ll be receiving the exact same education some kids are getting for free… this happens at all colleges.</p>

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<p>ishanz,</p>

<p>I’m currently a senior at USC majoring in civil engineering. First of all congratulations, you have some great schools to choose from! To address the public vs. private question…in talking with friends at public universities, the main difference seems to be the personal attention devoted to students at SC. I’ve never had an issue getting into a class I need, the semester I need to take it. Also, you’ll never have a class taught by a TA. TA’s hold discussion sections outside of regular class time as well as office hours, and professors also have office hours you can go to if you have questions. Most of my professors encourage me to attend office hours weekly to better understand the material we learn in class, and answer any questions I have about homework.</p>

<p>In terms of class size, my physics lectures were the largest classes I’ve had with around 150 students. But my specific engineering courses usually have 30-40 students (obviously this can fluctuate depending on your major).</p>

<p>I think Berkeley and LA are both great cities to live in, but LA has been a great place to live over the past four years. With LA Live just recently built downtown, I’ve had the opportunity to go to some really fun events and concerts only a few minutes from campus.</p>

<p>I’m one of a group of Viterbi Student Ambassadors and we just recently blogged about why we chose USC, and I think it might help you with your own decision. Check them out here: [Viterbi</a> Voices](<a href=“http://viterbivoices.usc.edu/]Viterbi”>http://viterbivoices.usc.edu/) but if you still have questions feel free to email me at <a href=“mailto:vstudent@usc.edu”>vstudent@usc.edu</a></p>

<p>Good luck!
Lisa V.</p>

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<p>I was talking to an admissions counselor for Viterbi on Friday and he explained it like this, at USC you’ve already competed to earn your spot so after being admitted, there’s no more competition unlike most of the public schools. They also do not weed out the students but create group environments where the only way to succeed is to work in teams. I don’t know if he was charismatic but I really felt this program over the UC’s.</p>

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<p>

This was my experience as well at Berkeley.</p>

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<p>@UCBChemEGrad this has also been my experience at UCLA. </p>

<p>while it is true that the vast majority of USC students stay in southern california (what can you say? socal is awesome! haha) there are many trojan alumni everywhere. Your degree may not mean as much outside of graduation in terms of rep, but from what i’ve heard this matters very little in the long run (career-wise).</p>

<p>An intuition leads me to suggest to you to chose USC. You should note what type of environment you’ll be in. While both berkeley and USC will have a vast amount of intelligent people on their campus, their norms are different, and so are their people to some degree. I agree with visiting both campuses to see which one you like more.</p>

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<p>Well, inherently, I’m kind of a party kinda student. I understand that USC and Berkeley attract different kinds of students, but it also seems evident that both are somewhat party colleges. My main question is: How is the social life different between USC and Berkeley? What about the types of people?</p>

<p>Obviously, Berkeley’s computer engineering program is better than USC’s. Is it marginally better or are the two programs worlds and universes apart? Would I be settling for a whole lot less if I decided on USC instead of Berkeley for computer engineering? And would such a choice of USC over Berkeley significantly affect my job prospects right out of college? I feel like USC would be a really bad choice if Berkeley’s degree can carry me much, much farther than the USC degree.</p>

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<p>no one would be able to definitively tell you whether you’d get better job prospects coming out from berkeley than USC.</p>

<p>objectively here are the facts:</p>

<p>berkeley is regarded world-class in engineering, along the same lines as stanford and caltech. USC is not. </p>

<p>in this ranking, berkeley is ranked 5th for engineering; USC is ranked 41st.</p>

<p>[Top</a> Universities for Engineering & Technology 2010-2011](<a href=“http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2010-2011/engineering-and-IT.html]Top”>World University Rankings 2010-11 | Times Higher Education (THE))</p>

<p>while no one would be able to say definitively, a berkeley degree would probably carry more job prospects out of college than a USC one would. That said, there are many factors to take into consideration when you go to college, and take note that this is just one ranking (in which UCLA isn’t even ranked!)</p>

<p>i can’t tell you about the people at Cal since i don’t go there, but when i went there for my bro’s graduation, it seemed like it was filled with a bunch of hippie-types; and since i’m making stereotypes, everytime i’ve been to USC i’ve come into contact with some ‘bro’ type frat students which you might either like or find annoying.</p>

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<p>But those kids aren’t Engineering students! And there are nerdy hippies at USC, just like there are frat bros at UCB!</p>

<p>Contrary to what the UCB alum here is saying, the budget cuts are affecting ALL campuses and all majors across the UC system. My close friend from HS was an engineering major at Berkley and she had to stay an extra two semesters to get all her required classes in. She said this wasn’t the case her freshman and sophomore years and was a recent development when the UC system started to get chopped by the state funding board.</p>

<p>Is UCB worth having your grandparents shed out $52,000 a year? No. Absolutely not.</p>

<p>If USC gave you no aid and the costs were equal, I would say the decision is more difficult. But this isn’t the case.</p>

<p>USC is only rising in prestige and selectivity; the UC system is rapidly declining because California can’t fund it anymore. I bet in 10 years, a USC degree will be worth more compared to a UCLA or UCB degree. Watch.</p>

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<p>perceptions change very slowly in academia. i wouldn’t say 10 years but i wouldn’t be surprised in, say, 30 years.</p>

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<p>

you don’t know that. + i said it was a stereotype anyway, that implies it wasn’t meant to be taken seriously.</p>

<p>

That could have had to due with other factors, like your friend not planning out ahead of time what classes were offered what semester, etc. </p>

<p>There’s a philosophy class at UCLA that’s only offered in the winter, and it’s required to graduate so if you miss it, you have to wait until the next winter to take it before you can receive your degree. Does that suck? sure. Can it easily be avoided? of course.</p>

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for engineering it might be.</p>

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the decision is still difficult because although he seems like he would enjoy USC much more, there’s no denying that UCB is much higher ranked.</p>

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<p>it seems pretty unlikely that some of the best universities in the world are going to just constantly decline in rankings purely because their state funding is declining. The universities can find, and already are finding, alternate methods to fund themselves. Sure, UCM, UCR, and UCSC may have huge problems looming ahead of them because of lack of state support, but UCB, UCLA, and UCSD should be fine and have no problem funding themselves. +, the decline in state support is only temporary, and it probably isn’t long enough for any major change in reputation/prestige to occur. And if the precedent remains of allowing nearly 30% of OOS students into the top UCs, then i imagine the universities will only become more prestigious as more out of state students attend (this is why i think to some degree Michigan is thought of as more prestigious than perhaps UCLA)</p>

<ul>
<li>UCLA and UCB have some of the most highly-cited faculties of any university in the world, which also contributes to making a university good. Reputations take a LONG time to change. Even if it were actually the case that USC became a better school than cal or UCLA, it seems unlikely that anyone would take it seriously until several decades after it was an established fact.</li>
</ul>

<p>take a look at this ranking, a ranking which attempts to be objective and not look at any prebiases like percieved prestige:</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.highimpactuniversities.com/rpi.html[/url]”>http://www.highimpactuniversities.com/rpi.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>In this ranking UCLA is actually ranked higher than berkeley (by one ranking) which is pretty rare to find in any ranking. This mainly has to do with the fact that berkeley isn’t that great in the health sciences fields, and its faculty are not that highly regarded: cp UCLA (4) to Berkeley (134) and i’m willing to bet people sending angry emails to the publishers responding in shock, as my brother did, that UCLA was ranked higher than berkeley. </p>

<p>I think the whole thing is still pretty funny though when one considers that when objectivity is taken into account, UCLA is ranked higher.</p>

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<p>Your friend taking an extra year for Berkeley engineering would be an exception to Berkeley’s College of Engineering published policy (see link above). COE says they grant one extra semester with exceptions made for illnesses, etc.</p>

<p>Current engineering students I’ve talked to and read on here haven’t had problems getting required classes.</p>

<p>OP, your Dad wants you to go to Berkeley. He is obviously smart and has good taste. I would listen to him. ;)</p>

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<p>Haha, thank you for your advice UCBChemEGrad. :p</p>

<p>I’ve neglected to mention one other college: University of Virginia. UVA would cost me around $25k a year, compared to USC’s $35k a year and Berkeley’s $52k a year. Evidently we’re all aware of Berkeley’s enormous academic prowess, so let’s exclude Cal for now.</p>

<p>Between UVA and USC, for computer engineering, and given the two costs I listed above, which would be the better choice? Obviously, UVA has much more prestige than USC. But, does that prestige make it a better school to attend for computer engineering than USC? Both USC and UVA are big party schools, so that’s no worry here; I’m sure I’d be happy at either school. In terms of academics and in terms of which college would get me the better job right out of college, would UVA or USC be better?</p>

<p>Edit: And I’ve neglected to thank the rest of you, too. You guys have been enormously helpful. Thank you so much!</p>

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<p>bump</p>

<p>Anybody have any ideas?</p>

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<p>“Obviously, UVA has much more prestige than USC.”</p>

<p>maybe 20 years ago. i don’t know anyone who truly thinks that now. they are viewed as peer institutions.</p>

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<p>bumpppp</p>

<p>I’m still curious on what you guys think about the questions I asked in my prior post. I’m still not certain on UVA vs USC. I feel like Berkeley would be a terrible idea given its pressure cooker environment, lack of diversity, inevitable drastic tuition rises, budget cuts, etc.</p>

<p>Also, my dad’s presented me an interesting argument for why I should attend UVA. He says that I should attend UVA as a matter of “humanity” so my family (parents, sister) can visit me in Charlottesville on a monthly basis. In contrast, if I were to attend USC, I would only see my parents a couple times a year - during longer breaks. There would also be the added burden of purchasing plane tickets. I don’t know; I didn’t realize it was even orthodox for parents to visit their kids in college on such a regular basis. I feel like he’ll consider me “evil,” “selfish,” “greedy,” and “inconsiderate” if I choose to go to USC. But the thing is, a dream of mine has always been to go to California…</p>

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<p>What gave you the idea that Berkeley lacks diversity?</p>

<p>I have degrees from USC and Berkeley. UCBChemEGrad’s impressions of the two (in her/his first post on this topic) are pretty similar to my own.</p>

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<p>in terms of quality i agree; in terms of prestige they’re definitely not. UVAs prestige is pretty huge on the east coast, USC’s prestige is not.</p>