<p>LOL, thanks nngmm, I went to Syracuse, so I identify with that one, went to a final exam once in May with snow on the ground! Unfortunately, it was “Spring” and I had brought a lot of my clothes home, so wore sandals & socks to the final exam. :)</p>
<p>nngmm,
Did you type all that?</p>
<p>Really, so much is about maturity and making the most of where one is. S’s friend loved his UG years at Princeton, then his grad school, and now works near Madison, and is having a great time. All 3 schools/communities have different vibes, but this young man has fit into it each.</p>
<p>I don’t think admissions is “extremely arbitrary”. Long time CC posters/readers, along with professional college counselors, can listen to a student’s wish list, reflect on his/her background, and devise an appropriate list of colleges. We are not privy to the essays, which can be a deciding factor, nor do we know what their teachers say about them. Even so, the collective wisdom from CC’ers can guide the students and the parents new to the process. </p>
<p>What parents know is their child’s personality, learning style, ability to handle stress, and degree of independence.</p>
<p><already forwarding=“” the=“” lightbulb=“” list=“” to=“” friends!=“”></already></p>
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That may be but That doesn’t mean that at some campuses you will be in the minority and at others you will be in the majority. For example, my older son is Mr. Computer Nerd. If he goes to Harvard he’ll find a great diversity of kids including a small group of kids like him, but he is not the type to get the most out of Harvard. While at CMU he has a much larger group of kids to hang out with and a culture that fosters them getting together. Harvard wanted him to increase their diversity, but he’s happier at CMU. Other kids will choose differently.</p>
<p>bookworm is exactly right - what parents (and the child) know is the child’s personality, learning style, ability to handle stress, and degree of independence and different schools offer different approaches to all these areas.</p>
<p>Is it a hard and fast “fact” that Cornell is more stressful than say Brown? No, but there is a lot of truth to it for anyone who knows the school well. Can a student who needs structure survive in a looser environment that is Brown? Survive, yes, but it might not be the best place for him/her. </p>
<p>Dartmouth is in the middle of nowhere and cold and snowy, Johns Hopkins is in the middle of a mixed urban neighborhood, Northwestern is in a beautiful suburb of a major city, Duke is down south. Again, for the cost of education you want the best match possible and that is very different from just matching GPAs and SAT/ACT test scores. </p>
<p>Every school has a personality and philosophy and so does every student.</p>
<p>Oh but I did really like the lightbulb list, it’s very inclusive!</p>
<p>There used to be a “Barbie” list of different towns in the NY metro area which was also very on target for the personality of each town. These views don’t come from nowhere.</p>
<p>Thanks, AMTC.</p>
<p>How I wish I had known of this site prior to my son applying to college. Gosh, he even wrote an essay on death of grandmother. I wonder how many schools turned him down because of that topic? (I jest)</p>
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<p>Haha, no. It’s all “cut & paste”… Someone sent it to my son when he was applying to colleges 8 years ago (he picked Stanford ;)…)</p>
<p>The 5 Scooby Doo characters (Scooby Doo, Daphne, Velma, Shaggy, Fred) are purportedly modeled after the personalities of each member of the 5 College Consortium (UMass, Mt. Holyoke, Smith, Hampshire, Amherst). If you know the colleges and the TV show, it sounds just about right. Sadly, this theory has been debunked:
[snopes.com:</a> Scooby-Doo Origin](<a href=“http://www.snopes.com/radiotv/tv/scoobydoo.asp]snopes.com:”>Do Scooby Doo Characters Represent Colleges in Eastern US? | Snopes.com)</p>
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<p>You think? I think it all depends on WHO is looking at the students. We visited Princeton (not for a college visit as neither of my kids would have gotten accepted there) and Stanford too…just because they are pretty college campuses and we happened to be in the neighborhood. My DD thought the students she met at BOTH places were VERY snobby. Even IF these had been reachable for her…she would not have applied…not the right “fit” from her perspective.</p>
<p>Sorry for the serious response…I do like the funny ones a LOT better.</p>
<p>NYC </p>
<p>You seem to be implying that because there is not ONE type that fits a college, the whole idea of fit is wrong. This is not logical thinking.</p>
<p>Many of these are large institutions. Many attempt to get, with varying degrees of success, diverse student bodies. At some, perhaps, all can fit. At many most can fit, but a few will not. At many, there are severa; “types” who would fit, but not all. At a few, there may be only a few types who would fit.</p>
<p>Exampla gratua = At Harvard a few decades ago, someone said “everyone here is a preppie, an aspiring preppie, or a Jewish intellectual” that was an exageration of course, but it had a seed of truth. Harvard was diverse (certainly NOT all preppies, as some thought) but there were some more common themes running through that diversity. Broadly, if NEITHER social status, nor intellectuality (esp of the engage type implied by “jewish” intellectual, though of course not really limited to Jews) were important to you, you were going to have a harder time than many others fitting into campus life. </p>
<p>Second exampla gratua - My DD will be attending RPI. It is known for nerdy,techy, video game playing young men. However we met kids there, especially young women, who were outgoing, sociable, and socially committed. It was not all one type. But it has only a single div 1 sport, and the greek community seemed relatively subdued compared to many other campuses. Someone who expects to spend every weekend watching football and tailgating not only will find those activities lacking, but will find herself something of a fish out of water.</p>
<p>Third exampla gratua - Lehigh univeristy has established SOuth Mountain College as a “LAC within Lehigh” for intellectual exploration, apparently in an attempt to diversify the student body further. When we saw it, it was a house with about a dozen single rooms, and it was not nearly full. Had DD gone to Lehigh, she would likely have entered SMC, and it would have been her niche. But clearly this niche was not very big, and that was an issue.</p>
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<p>You are implying that students are looking at fit as an application strategy. I don’t think that’s what’s usually meant. It’s about where a student might be happier. My D “fits” the stereotype of Wesleyan–activist, countercultural to some extent, non-competitive, a bit goofy, very unpreppy–and was extremely happy when she transfered there from a school where she felt in a distinct minority. It wasn’t an admissions strategy, it was self-preservation.</p>
<p>garland - I think to the extent that some (many?) students rule out certain schools before even applying based on lack of “fit” (too small, wrong part of country, no Div 1 sports, whatever), it is used as an application strategy in the negative sense. I imagine it is used in the positive sense more often for selection between schools where admission has occurred. Sometimes people don’t, and sometimes they try but get there and find out it isn’t what they thought. It is tough sometimes, and CC can be a big help in that regard. It isn’t perfect of course, but at least one can get a lot more impressions than before it existed.</p>
<p>Fit is defined in many ways. My DD ruled out a school because she didn’t like the pink petunias and begonias, and she hated the red brick buildings. Maybe someone else can link and find the thread here that talked about silly reasons kids did not choose schools. It relates to this!</p>
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<p>I’m not saying that at all. I’m saying the idea of fit is wrong from an admissions standpoint-- these admissions officers don’t care if you prefer a suburban location or a city location or a techie vs. liberal arts environment (I mean they do but they assumed you’re applying because you believed the school to be a fit in the first place-- who are they to tell you what fits you when you know yourself the best?). All they care about is whether they want YOU and the decision isn’t necessarily based on “fit” in the conventional way we understand the term. They care about what will meet their institutional needs.</p>
<p>At Oxbridge, this “fit” thing would be laughable. All they care about is are you excellent in the ways we want you to be excellent? That’s it-- it’s about ability more than anything else.</p>
<p>well then NYC, I think you are misunderstanding MOST discussions of fit here.</p>
<p>IIUC most colleges want kids to A. Be succesful and B. Add to the diversity of the campus</p>
<p>Being successful is generally a function of A. Academic/work ethic qualities and B. “fit”<br>
Adding to diversity is usually the reverse of “fit”</p>
<p>Joe Blow, who is a football loving frat boy type, with an amazing math SAT score and a special talent programming in C, will meet the academics to succeed at RPI. he will not “fit” at RPI, but will definitely add to the diversity. Will RPI accept him - probably, and his unfit probably helps - UNLESS they find someone who adds to diversity in ways less likely to make them desperate to transfer in a year (like a geeky, nerdy, woman from Somalia lets say) </p>
<p>The more common q is should Joe Blow CHOOSE RPI, despite it being a place that will drive him batty within one semester - well maybe he SHOULD, if he gets a great FA package, or is in love with their unique programs, or just has always wanted to live in Troy NY. Otherwise, maybe not.</p>
<p>OP - You’ve got the issue turned on its head</p>
<p>For those gung ho about “fit”, “fit” is not something viewed from the college’s perspective, but rather from the student’s</p>
<p>It is not a matter of a student being the “right fit” for a school, it is a matter of the school being the “right fit” for the student</p>
<p>nuchomie, I disagree with you that the admissions assumes that students understand the personality. Kids are applying so many places and they are applying places that have never visited and they are applying to places they’ve only envisioned. My oldest went to a very small school that is remote, the town has no movie theater, no bowling alley, no MacDonalds, no chain stores. The kids spend a a huge amount of time outdoors…even in subzero weather. The kids might own fancy clothes and some of the daddies own planes, but you’d think they were street bums to see them, they just aren’t that into “looking good.” And all 2,000 of 'em are some derivative of that picture. They spend every waking moment not in class or studying in the great outdoors even in sub-zero weather and the minority group of women can keep right up with the guys. </p>
<p>Now if you’re a kid who wears leather shoes, and button down shirts, you cut your hair on a regular basis and shave daily and the outdoors for you has been having to hike to the subway, you might be darn unhappy pretty quickly. You don’t think that an admissions officer might pause a second with certain candidates and wonder if they’ll get through Freshman year? You’ll never convince me that they dont’ stop and consider a “fish our of water.” Remember colleges WANT kids that will stay for four years. And kids want to have friends who have common interests outside of the class and the library. Common interests is entirely different than “looks like me, grew up like me.” Freshman year my son lost a roommate from Little Rock who had perhaps romanticized a tad too much…he lasted a month…was gone by mid-September…great guy but he was so unhappy. Heck ya, schools have personalities. </p>
<p>Personality of a college is different than “academic fit” of which there might be hundreds of those that fit a particular student as there might be hundreds of colleges that might have the same personality. But, if you are at the ‘wrong’ one you’re either going to have a miserable 4 years, you’ll be transferring at the end of 1 year or you’ll tolerate the 4 years and move on in life. It’s alot more fun to enjoy where you are.</p>
<p>Right, BBD and momof3–“fit” is used most often in the context of where the student feels he/she will most likely be happy and succeed, not in the context of does the student fit the school’s needs. The latter is important, but not the common use of “fit” on this site. So maybe we are talking at cross purposes here.</p>
<p>Absolutely - nychromie is somewhat right that the university can’t “know” if that student will “fit” at their school in the way we usually talk about that on here. He is talking about something else, I guess. Using the word fit, then, was an unfortunate choice.</p>
<p>What the best universities (because they have this luxury) do care about is, within their academic parameters, getting people that can do many different things and that might bring different points of view. They want a mix of athletic types, music types, acting types, debate types, politically active types, etc. etc. They want ethnic diversity. They want geographic diversity to some degree. So on and so forth. So while they cannot know if a particular student loves or hates red brick buildings or frat parties, they can know most of the rest. But most people don’t call what the school is doing in that regard “fit”.</p>