Love it when my kids come home for a week or whatever but can’t imagine them living here, nor could they. Just different priorities (like I like things clean and orderly). Just a habit I can’t shake but I still sleep poorly if they stay out late and feel grate relief when I hear the garage door open.
Just my opinion but I think it’s incredibly important for them to live in their own place and have to deal with all the mundane adult issues (hot water heater not working, ac out, appliances broken, etc.) Dealing with landlords and learning how to be that squeaky wheel without pissing them off to get things fixed is a great life skill. They won’t learn it until they have to.
They can still save money (at least 401k) if they live on their own (in most cases). D will be an issue as she’s a performing artist in NYC. Not sure how that’s going to work after graduation as we’re in FL and she should stay in NY or LA. Currently lives with two other artists. If they had menial jobs, they could afford their Brooklyn apartment and food. Not much else. I imagine we’ll support her for a period of time so she won’t be saving anything until she finds steady work.
Every situation is different but for those that have decent paying jobs, they should be able to live on their own and still start stashing money away. Rent is fine provided they’re building equity elsewhere.
What seems new to me is how the “kids” today seem to spend so much on attending their friends’ weddings. Engagement party, multiple showers, out of town bachelor/ette parties, 3-day out of town weddings, professional hair & make up (for the bridal party) - it adds up!
Maybe it is because kids go to school further away than in my day and make friends from all over the country? (But some of it still seems like a lot!)
Does the boyfriend’s manager make $210k per year? Because if he does, that is in line with the historical rule of thumb (2 months of salary) as to what should be spent. If one makes $210k then two months worth of salary is $35k.
I had a discussion with ds awhile back about why young folks seem to delay marriage so much. Even if they are clearly in long-term, committed relationships and have been living together for awhile. His reply was that weddings cost a lot of money. My response to that was, “They don’t have to.” I kind of hoped that the pandemic would tone down and dial back how elaborate weddings had become, but that doesn’t seem to be the case.
My ds spends quite a bit to travel, but he drives a 15-year old car. He also lives within his means. Travel is a priority for him and where he chooses to spend his discretionary funds.
I think the CA housing market is extremely discouraging to him.
Just had to measure my D’s BF as he’s in an Indian wedding and has to have the outfits made to fit. He’s in Denver, B&G are friends from high school in NJ, and of course the wedding is in the dominican republic at an all inclusive resort ($600/nt, and that’s the discount rate). I don’t think they are doing any pre-wedding things (I could be wrong). Daughter just gets to go along and eat for 4 days. I’m sure she’ll need new clothes too.
They did pass on a wedding in Newport RI last July as it just cost too much to go. Also passed on one in Annapolis on Memorial day weekend as that also happened to be graduation weekend at the Academy and everything costs twice as much.
I think we’ll have to tie this thread to the one about making more than $100k right out of undergrad. They need it to go to weddings.
Typical marriage age has been increasing steadily since the late 1950s, when the median marriage age for women was ~20. There are many contributing factors, but I don’t think cost of weddings is a major one. The average cost of weddings has been decreasing rapidly in recent years and during other periods increased rapidly. These changes in wedding cost had little correlation with the average wedding age – steadily increasingly, regardless of cost.
One contributing factor to the increased marriage age is college education becoming more common. The more educated a group is, the higher the average marriage age for that group. Another is change in religion. Some religions are associated with a much higher average marriage age than others, and the trend in the United States has been in this direction, such as a larger percentage of persons in the US identifying as atheist.
However, I think the primary factor is a gradual change in values and change in what is considered normal/acceptable within communities. Compared to past decades there is more acceptance for things like living together without being married, delaying marriage to focus on career, or being an older, single woman. In your example of persons in long term committed relationships who live together and are not married, there is less general community/family/peer/media/… pressure for them to get married than in the past.
Of course there are is a wide range of individual variation. Some young people are extremely focused on marriage and do not want to be in a relationship for long, if it does not look like it is moving in the direction of marriage quickly. Others would be content to never be married.
I was only offering a sample of one unscientific opinion, not researched data. My ds believes his friends delay marriage because of the cost of a wedding.
I just don’t get playing house for multiple years. My unscientific opinion is that young people seem to delay marriage until they are ready to have children. If that is even on their radar. I have also observed many young people would rather continue enjoying their luxury goods and not make the lifestyle and financial sacrifices that are required of parenthood. Having young children makes it difficult to go to bottomless mimosa brunches.
Declining birth rates aren’t going to jive well with our SS system.
I don’t know why my daughter is delaying marriage. She and BF have been dating for 7 years, own a house together, have moved together twice.
But daughter is only 26 (just) and they are still enjoying their single life. She graduated and then had to take the FE ad PE (engineering licensing) and that was a lot of studying post college. They ski, they travel, they have joined local volleyball teams. Some of their friends are married and have started having children so they know what that looks like. Others are like them and, while engaged, want to have some time to just sort things out after college. He’s a little older (almost 30!) but his parents are younger and not as ready for the grandchildren as I am.
My other daughter (almost 27) is finishing her masters degree and her boyfriend is figuring out his army career (whether he wants one, if he wants to go to law school). I think they will make a quick decision on marriage once those other things are decided. Right now he’s thinking that if he’s deployed for 1 year he’ll save $$$ and then they’d have a good start on marriage, a house, subsidizing her career, etc.
I can see how the increase in young people living with their parents might lead to them purchasing more “luxury goods” because they have extra income due to saving on rent. But I think it’s a big leap to say that means they’ve given up on home ownership. My 26 year old D graduated from college in 2019 so she fortunately had already started a job and moved to Philly by the time the pandemic hit. Her job did pivot to remote but by then she was committed to the lease. Now she’s in her 2nd year of grad school and getting married in September. She and her fiance are definitely interested in buying a house, but feel like they need to wait until she finishes her PhD and they know where she will end up working. They’ll almost certainly have to move when that happens. So for now they try to save what they can based on her grad stipend and his salary as a public defender. As far as I can tell, they spend their disposable income on travel (including attending other people’s weddings), and going out for cocktails and dinner (no bottomless mimosa brunches for them – they’re more likely to find a speakeasy). And they both have hobbies that they spend some money on. He’s into photography and biking and she’s into knitting, sewing, and other fiber arts. I’m happy for them that they are enjoying this period in their lives. The responsibilities of mortgages and children will come eventually.
Ok, I will play devil’s advocate. Given that women want to be treated equal to men, why should men spend money on a wedding ring? And for that matter, why should the bride’s parents be expected to pay for the wedding?
First of all, it’s not women want to be treated like men, it’s women SHOULD be treated. I’m raft, drop the women and men, all humans, regardless of gender should be treated alike.
I agree that many of the old fashioned traditions of who pays what, who buys what are silly. And regarding a ring in general, that should be a couple decision - for both rings - for both spouses, regardless of gender.
The engagement ring is really paid by both, we got engaged after 5 years of dating, used a diamond from my grandmother’s ring to save $, since we were getting married our finances were going to be combined anyway. We were 28 when we got married, only a handful of our friends got married that young and were dating longer than we were. I think weddings have been toned down here in the northeast nyc metro, but marriage after 30 has been the norm for a long time.
Our D paid for the majority of her own modest engagement ring. Groom contributed two small heirloom diamonds and she paid to have a ring made with a tsavorite garnet in the center. We’re paying for the wedding because, frankly, it’s the only way to have the kind of wedding she’d like and we want for her. I’ve noticed a similar thing with my nephews, where their parents stepped in as the grooms’ parents to fund the majority of the wedding.
But getting back to the original topic, I don’t see the pattern of luxury spending mentioned in the article. Maybe that’s because their friends are mostly other grad students and other public defenders, so not people with large disposable incomes and unlikely to be living with parents.
I simply pointed out that this was the standard when I got engaged. I don’t think it’s an unreasonable standard, but nobody has to follow it. People should have and do what they want and pay for it however they want.
All these mini millionaires who are living at home and buying rolex watches are paying the max into SS. In the olden days new grads were making $35k and not paying as much into the system.
The average college grad starting salary is about 55K. High school grads make less.
Only on CC and articles talking about markets for luxury watches are there mini-millionaires. I’m not sure there’s enough of them to save SS… “Lifestyles of the rich” is nowhere near the same as “Lifestyles of the average.”
There’s a lot of financial stats in this Nov '22 article if folks are interested.