<p>But, on a side note, that wasn’t a good decision JTurner…</p>
<p>^^^
Yeah, but it’s HIS decision and as long as he is happy with the decision - who are we to judge?</p>
<p>I was reading another thread about bringing a plunger to college with you. I don’t know about you but there are certain times I am really happy to see the janitor. :-)</p>
<p>
I think chaos is getting unfairly attacked for his/her view. </p>
<p>Fit is definitely something to consider. A student longing for a concrete jungle would probably not be happy at Cornell, and someone who likes to visit the beach would likely be happier at UCSD than Carleton. </p>
<p>That said, fit need not (and should not) come at the expense of great academics. Most people would recommend the more selective schools for students with many options in April, simply because those are usually the strongest colleges. Could a student studying marine biology be better off at UNCW than at Harvard even if (s)he loves both? Sure. For the majority of cross-admits, however, Harvard would be the better choice simply because it’s better in virtually every aspect.</p>
<p>There are enough colleges in the country (2675, to be exact) that one can find schools that are both good fits and provide strong academics, good research opportunities, great financial aid, large library collections, etc.</p>
<p>I think the question of “prestige” depends more on who the target audience is than anything else. If we are talking about prestige with employers, I would say that it is absolutely crucial and should play a major role in college selection. Money doesn’t grow on trees and considering the ability to get a job unimportant is the height of arrogance. On the other hand, should we really care about “prestige” with ordinary people on the street or even with our families? I can’t see any reason why. They aren’t going to hire you, and an education is worth more than bragging rights.</p>
<p>^^ You can get a good education at a State school and it is less of a drain on family resources. I know there is financial aid out there but if this is an affluent community then noone is going to qualify for need-based assistance. Merit scholarships, yes, I don’t know how easy those are to get.</p>
<p>After college everyone has to work hard, you can’t coast on the name of your school. There are many things besides your degree that go into success after college, having the people skills, working hard, to name a couple. Of my coworkers and managers some went to State schools, some went to private colleges, some have advanced degrees, some don’t. There is no correlation between whether they are good employees or not and where they went to school.</p>
<p>Hmm…This thread is ridiculous, and quite frightening. I felt a little sick to my stomach reading through the last few pages.</p>
<p>Oh, and ring<em>of</em>fire, what I find amusing and at the same time horrifyingly presumptuous and arrogant is that you would judge every single person in this country under the same standard as your father. Not everyone is the same, and not everyone is living in the same conditions. Imagine that your dad had no family, which you yourself said was his motivation. Where would he be? Now imagine a single person with no support and no opportunity in America – someone from a broken home, a school where actual teaching is non-extant, and a “community” with no role models, who also has no family. Where is his motivation? How can he succeed?</p>
<p>You are speaking for a fraction of the population with which you probably have no contact. You chide the fools who have made too many mistakes while benefiting from them yourself. You berate those who sustain the very lifestyle you enjoy, and then you have the gall to speak on their behalf. You are gross.</p>
<p>Oh, and in reference to this little gem:
</p>
<p>I would never be happy at Stanford. If I had visited in my junior year, I wouldn’t have wasted my time applying early. The campus, the classes, the people, they all didn’t appeal to me. So I turned it down. I’m off to Princeton next year, where I can actually enjoy my education. At least I recognize that I am fortunate to even have a choice, unlike your offensively obnoxious self – the $200,000 a Stanford student will have to borrow because his middle-class family didn’t get any aid will NOT pay for itself, especially since many Stanford grads can’t even get jobs now.</p>
<p>I suggest less talking, more thinking. And given that I am “more” educated than you because Princeton is better than Duke in the eyes of most, I guess you have to respect me more than you do yourself now. That is, if you adhere to your absurd, and by the way disgustingly entitled, approach to human contact.</p>
<p>Ringoffire has been so busy chasing prestige he forgot that the real end goal is class. </p>
<p>Can’t wait til he gets to his first job and shows his lack of respect for the secretary who may not have his educational credentials. And he’s so naive he thinks that he’s actually scoring prestige points with his superiors. That takedown will be more exciting than any Duke basketball game.</p>
<p>ROF is a perfect example of why we need to implement a mandatory two year tour of duty in the military.</p>
<p>“Can’t wait til he gets to his first job and shows his lack of respect for the secretary who may not have his educational credentials.”</p>
<p>When I taught Career Planning to graduate students at Tulane Med School, one of the FIRST things I told them was that in ANY new situation (whether school or work or the local country club), get to know the people who REALLY make things happen…the secretaries, assistants, security guards and yes - the janitorial and maintenance staff! THOSE are the people with influence and power. THOSE are the people you need to make things happen. You needs something done quickly - you need to be on good terms with the people who can actually MAKE it happen quickly.</p>
<p>As the students went off to their administrative residencies and reported back to me…the kids who took my advice thanked me profusely. The kids who didn’t…had problems. </p>
<p>By the way - I work part time for a friend of mine. Poor thing…graduated with very mediocre grades from a simple Catholic HS in New Orleans, went to LSU, graduated (with very mediocre grades) with a BS degree. Never went to grad school. </p>
<p>Funny thing…he was out of the office today…busy on his 4 acres property on a lake outside Austin…staying in his 3000 SF guest house…while meeting with the architect to finalize plans for the $1 million+ house they are getting ready to build. </p>
<p>I’ll be sure to remind him what a mistake he made with LSU when I see him next week.</p>
<p>If JTurner is looking at the cryptology/national security programs available at WVU, there <em>is</em> no better place to be. (Job security is nice, too.) With four other sibs in college, I am sure your parents are also tremendously proud of your accomplishments so far and of the mature attitude you have taken WRT your education.</p>
<p>OP, I believe your father would be ashamed to read what you have written here.</p>
<p>^^^
In fairness to the OP…I think it is ring<em>of</em>fire who refer to (forgive me if I am mistaken).</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Old fogie time for me again, noimagination. I’m a middle manager with management experience going back to 1983. The school impresses HR, and sometimes the owner of a small company. Beyond that its up to the candidate to win the job. I’ve been there, on both sides of the table. I speak from the real world there. The school loses its value long before the hiring decision is made.</p>
<p>And Pizzagirl, your remark about the secretary <a href=“we%20call%20them%20’Admins’%20now”>i</a>* reminds me of a true story from my past. I was in the Regional VP’s office of a corporation back when I was a young manager, waiting to go over some numbers while he was in another meeting in his office. A man called the office and got the VP’s admin. The man was unhappy he could not talk his way past the woman, and he abruptly hung up on her. A few seconds later another line on the same phone rang, and the man was astonished to discover that the “private” number he had … also went through the admin’s desk. I saw her smile, pick up the phone and wait for a moment then answer:</p>
<p>“Yes, this is the “b—h” again … and if you don’t apologize to me right now I can make sure you never get through to Mister Wilhelm.”</p>
<p>The man apologized profusely <a href=“I%20got%20the%20details%20from%20the%20woman%20soon%20after,%20we%20were%20friends”>i</a>*, the admin took careful note of his number, then disconnected him. </p>
<p>I asked her why she took his number if she was going to hang up on him.</p>
<p>“Simple,” she smiled, “I keep all kinds of lists. That guy is now on the list of numbers that never get through, just in case I need to make sure.”</p>
<p>Bosses and executives may or may not forgive, but admins never forget.</p>
<p>Once again it is evident that the character of a parent is not passed on genetically to the child.</p>
<p>I think Ring<em>of</em>Fire’s father sounds like an admirable person. The son however somehow has missed the boat.</p>
<p>RoF – are you not even the least bit chagrinned that we who are superior to you (by your value system – Stanford, Princeton, MIT admittees) think you are are an arrogant pitiful fool?</p>
<p>MBA Grad - have I told you today that I love you???</p>
<p>Oh yeah, I did (# 80 something)…</p>
<p>Well, it still stands!!! :)</p>
<p>I said that my family <em>could</em> afford the hefty price tag; I never said that it would be easy on any level. My parents are older than most of my peers’ parents - 59 and 69, respectively - and I’m sure they don’t want to be working for the next 20 years trying to get me where I need to go. They’ve dedicated the past 27 years of their lives to my siblings and me; I want to give them something back. Also, I’m not exactly eager to take out $100,000 in loans. WVU offered the full-ride scholarship, a $20,000 minimum toward medical school, and free travel; and I love the school. So, ring<em>of</em>fire (to whom, by the way, I was not writing in the first place), you may believe otherwise, but I don’t think I’m the fool here. I would have been a fool not to take all that I was offered. As cliche as this sounds, my belief in my abilities and my desire to succeed will determine where I go in life, not a 100% job placement rate from the college I attend. I’m not saying it wouldn’t help, but it certainly isn’t the only factor to consider. While I agree with your ideals of rewarding excellence, I believe that your extreme elitist attitudes will be much more detrimental than advantageous to your future.</p>
<p>
I think I speak for all the younger posters on this board in saying that I’m thankful for all the years of experience “old fogie[s]” such as yourself can impart. My thought was poorly expressed to the point of irrelevence - I was trying to say that colleges play a role in helping students get their first jobs (through internships, recommendations, career centers, alumni networks, etc.)</p>
<p>This thread is seriously convincing me to go to a school that some might say is “beneath me.” Refreshing, as a high school student, to hear that- GASP! - college prestige is not everything (or much of anything, for that matter). MBA Grad… echoing what others have said, thanks. Ring of fire, thank you, too… for being a perfect example of what I don’t want me or my future kids to be.</p>
<p>“Beneath” you is in the eye of the beholder. If you want to go into investment banking and work on Wall Street, then the Ivy League is probably going to give you the best shot at getting there. If, however, you want to be a large animal veterinarian and specialize in surgery – which takes eight years, residency training, and some serious smarts – you would be far better off attending a school like Texas A&M, Colorado State or Kansas State. Are they “lesser” schools in this example? It all comes down to what you want to do. No one school is the best at everything.</p>
<p>Yes to all the latest posters. Go into any doctor’s office. Some of the doctor’s went to prestigious undergrad and medical schools, some went to State schools. What they all have in common was they went to schools that molded and shaped them into who they became. College is a time to find out who you are, to find your direction, to shape your mind. If you find a school that is right for you it can do all that.</p>
<p>To noimagination that first job out of college is a tough one. I went to a small liberal arts college for my undergraduate degree but the career officer was excellent. He helped me immensely in getting my first job. When I finished my graduate work at a State University the career advisor was absolutely worthless. The most she could offer me was to check the want ads.</p>