<p>I recently got into a fairly good school, but not into the honors program. However, I also got into the honors college at a school that isn't necessarily bad, but just isn't as good as the other one. They were both safeties for me. Right now I'm considering my options, and I was wondering which would prove more beneficial in the long term, and wanted some advice from parents who also had to help their kids make this choice and have experience with this kind of thing. Thanks!</p>
<p>I know some people with disagree with me, but no school is bad. I can't say Harvard is better than Colorado State (for example). I have had professors who did guest teaching at Harvard and they said that the caliber of students is the same everyone.</p>
<p>Perhaps you have already done this, but it is important to look into exactly what "honors program" means. How many courses are actually offered at the honors level, especially in your major? How many courses that are not at freshman (introductory level)? Are the honors courses smaller, and taught by professors? Are there other special programs available to honors program students? Does it include separate housing, if that matters to you? </p>
<p>Some honors programs are pretty all-encompassing, but others don't really offer very many honors courses or many other perks. Check into it.</p>
<p>Does the honors program get you early registration? At some schools that could mean the difference between graduating on time or not.</p>
<p>I have to call Insomniatic on his/her claim that the "level of students is the same everywhere". </p>
<p>There are certainly motivated students "most" places, but there is a definitive difference in caliber of students in tier four or three and tier one. Having taught at a couple of tier fours, I know of what I speak.</p>
<p>That said, it would be hard to comment further for the OP without knowing the specific colleges.</p>
<p>My son applied to the University of Maryland and the University of Delaware, both of which have honors programs. Delaware was sufficiently impressed with his credentials that they called him on the phone and invited him to apply to their honors program. He did not qualify for the honors program at Maryland.</p>
<p>He went to Maryland. The reason? It has a better program in his major. This turned out to be a good decision. He stayed with the major he had originally intended, and the department truly is very good.</p>
<p>Sometimes, considerations other than whether or not you are offered a place in an honors program may be the most important things to take into consideration when selecting which offer of admission to accept.</p>
<p>It really depends on the perks of the honors college, what your most likely majors are, and which schools you like better. My son turned down the school rated 1 or 2 in the country for the one rated number 25, because in his major his school is one of the top schools. We looked at the SUNY honors program (I think at Stony Brook) and could see of no reason for him that it would be of interest. Small differences in rank are basically meaningless. Choose the school that appears to be the best fit for YOU.</p>
<p>Does the honors program give you special housing?</p>
<p>A friend and I were just discussing this last night. Is there any advantage to graduating "with honors"? That is, all perks like housing, better registration, better classes aside -- are there any real advantages in terms of graduate school or employment for doing the honors programs?</p>
<p>^^^I don't know about employment, but for graduate school, all other things equal, an honors degree should give a student a leg up, if for no other reason than that usually it involves writing an honors thesis or doing a capstone project that ensures the student is familiar to a few letter-writers/recommenders.</p>
<p>In my opinion, the very biggest drawback to attending a really large school is the relative lack of opportunities to get to know faculty who can write good letters of recommendation. An honors program can help alleviate that, if it is a good honors program.</p>
<p>dbwes, just a point of info: there's a difference between "graduating with honors" where it says cum laude on your diploma, versus attending an honors program all the way through. DIfferent colleges have different criteria for putting the latin words on your final diploma (GPA, special capstone project, etc) but the levels above normal B.A. diploma are: cum laude (with honor), magna cum laude (with lotsa honor) and summa cum laude (highest honor). My Latin translations are loosey-goosey. To Latinists: Mea culpa mea maxima culpa (I'm sorry, I'm really sorry...) :)</p>
<p>One of my kids turned down the honors program in a large private uni because he discovered it had too few kids, and the same kids each year. He liked the access to professors and great program, but he also wanted to learn through meeting many other students. He went to the "better" academic small LAC without any honors program. He felt everyone he met was honor-worthy, but instead of knowing a handful of elite students at a huge private uni, he knew several hundred attending a very small elite LAC. He also believed strongly in "building community" rather than "rising to the top competitively." His network of friends from college is a source of strength for him, more so than his GPA there, although both are meaningful to any student.</p>
<p>So he turned down the "honors" position at a huge-and-wonderful school (NYU) and went as a trooper to a small-and-wonderful school (Amherst). Now thinking of dbwes, he did graduate cum laude, due to a senior major capstone project not GPA, so I guess it all came full circle! Funny, he now lives near NYU and sees graduates from Amherst all the time, too, because he chose to move to the urban location they visit, work or live in. It's all good. </p>
<p>Many paths, just consider the social aspect, too; how many people will you get to know; will you be cordoned off in the honors classes with the same kids year after year, etc. At some schools, more students might take "Honors Classes" if they qualify specifically, so that lets in some new people and fresh air to your social circle. And some kids like to study with the top kids, but socialize comfortably with everybody through EC's, sports and so on. </p>
<p>Many paths. Which one sounds like you?</p>
<p>All good to think about. Thanks!</p>
<p>I have been looking at honors programs at various large schools in California for my S. There is a huge difference in what they offer. Some do have separate dorms. Some require a minimum GPA to stay in the program (which is not always easy to maintain if you take science classes). Some schools seem to have a real program where there is a separate counseling staff and a real effort to help honors students get internships etc.</p>
<p>It's all over the board, I would encourage you to read the honors website throughly and then start asking questions.</p>
<p>Sparta - I have two in Honors programs. Both offer lukewarm support for their programs (at best!). The Honors housing is nice, but isolating. And early registration is nice, but most kids get the courses they need anyway. Based on this extremely unscientific sample of two, I'd say don't let the Honors Program drive your decision. Choose the school you like better, and if that school invites you to join their Honors Program, great.</p>
<p>Tough call. The honors program is not irrelevant but it has its limits. Among the key issues are: does it include separate and better housing, is it just for a limited number of courses or does it have an actual curriculum that will allow you to fulfill all but your major and minor within the honors college. Remember you may not like the honors group and if you don't the general population is your fall back. Make sure that is OK with you. That said these can be great programs that will give you small classes with great profs.</p>
<p>I think even at a big school you can get to know professors who can assist you and write letters for you. You just have to take the initiative and get to know them, but its no more difficult than in a small school. Class size can make a difference but that varies a lot (I know many a big school where senior classes are small). And again, with some initiative, you can easily get to know your profs, and even work with them if you are really interested in their field.</p>
<p>My D's final choice last spring was very similar to your situation. She had to decide between a good, smaller school and a sweet honors college deal at a huge, lesser-ranked school. The honors program at the latter school actually had two levels, and she was offered a position in the higher level that included special housing with a supplement covering half of her housing costs. She finally decided to go to the smaller school because it was the better fit for her. In the meantime, her BFF from high school is in the honors program/housing in the larger school, and loving it. As others have said, fit is most important, but even just the early registration and special advisement of a basic honors program could be very helpful.</p>
<p>On graduating with honors:</p>
<p>I think this from college to college. At my own LAC, there was no "honors program." I graduated summa cum laude because I had good grades. To have graduated with honors in my major, I would have had to do research and a senior thesis in my major - and I already knew I was going to grad school in a different field - the graduating "with honors in ABCDology" did not seem particularly useful. I figured on the off chance that anyone in the future ever wanted to know if I was good at ABCDology, they could look at my undergraduate transcript.</p>
<p>Hi, thanks for all the responses! Certainly has given me a lot to think about. In the mean time, here's some additional info: the school whose honors college I didn't get into was UPitt. The other school is the local large state school. Business programs for both, and although they're similarly ranked (state school's a little lower), I absolutely abhor the state school, while I could be pretty happy at UPitt, despite being stung a little that I didn't get into the honors college. Is there a way I could get in at some point during my career there, and should I consider asking for my application to be reconsidered? Thanks again!</p>
<p>I would definitely call and ask if there is a way to enter the honors college after one or two semesters of good grades. While you are on the phone, ask if you can ask for reconsideration before you enroll.</p>
<p>If you are taking opinions, I think you are better off attending Pitt without the honors program than a school that you "abhor". That is a pretty strong judgment.</p>