The last time I posted here was a few years ago. Anyways, I am freshman at a good UC school 4.0 slowly getting leadership positions and I’m about to start applying for research positions. I know that the number of volunteering hours is not as relevant as the experience I attain from it, but ultimately 500 hours of clinical volunteering looks way better than 100 hours of clinical volunteering. I want to go to a California medical school hopefully and possibly OOS schools that may offer some financial aid. A Harvard med matriculant from my hometown got in with average stats for their average student profile and good ecs research and more than seven hundred hours of volunteering clinical/non-clinical hours and another friend got into UCSF with near average stats for their average student profile along with good ecs research and about five hundred hours of clinical/non-clinical volunteering.
Now I would be happy if I got into any of the UC schools or SC (maybe besides Riverside), but really about how much volunteering hours would help me stand out if all else is good on my application? My advisor recommended impossible stats and I came to the conclusion that 200-300 meaningful clinical hours with shadowing is a good amount (along with some non-clinical volunteering).
Sorry for the horrible grammar I was rushing this and thanks!
By interview time either applicant should have at least decided what to talk about during their interview and an applicant would need good stats to get the interview in the first place.
I am not sure about importance of amount of volunteering hours. D. had a lot - she was voluniteering for 3 years during school year, but it was non-clinical. Her non-clinical volunteering experience was one of the most common topic during her Med. School interviews. She had additional clinical hours - volunteered during summers. I have no idea how many, not anywhere near to her non-clinical volunteering.
As for interviews, it seems that having something different on your application results in nice conversations. Interview is basically to check you as a person and to see how your personality fits with the program. At this point, you have passed the stats / ECs cut so to speak. So, while D’s unusual for pre-med volunteering experience was the second common topic during her interviews, the first one was her Music Minor and anything related to music, from classical to pop bands and she greatly enjoyed these conversations. She was actually a bit dissapointed in how little they discussed her 3 year Medical Reseach, poster presentation, grant proposal, it was a big part of her school year. But if you think about it, how much of the same things an interviewer wants to hear hours after hours, volunteering, Medical Research, etc., they are people too, they want to relax a bit, have a nice conversation for a change.
Thanks for your input. Besides having good grades and a good MCAT score, research, 2-4 leadership roles and some volunteering I want to make myself stand out by practicing two sports that I want to do for the next four years (both of which won’t take up more than four hours a week). I have heard that adcoms look for diverse applicants by current applicants (and of course by SDN members) so I will keep this in mind.
^No, you do not have to. If you want to do your sports, then enjoy it. D. dropped her sport as it was way too time consuming, even in the club. She had to do all of her ECs during school year, nothing was available in summers, not even the dirtiest jobs would take her. So, she was also waorking during school year.
Making yourself stand out is way overrated. D. had no problem getting accepted to 2 tp 20s, while she applied only to 8 Med. Schools. She had done nothing, not a single thing for the Med. School specifically, she just followed her heart and did what she wanted to do and enjoy. It worked out.
…and she also tried to stay away from SDN, at least in UG. SDN has been very helpful with residency applications - but this is for 4th year Med. Students. It is a bit on a edgy side for the pre-meds. If you can sort the useful info out of all hype that is going on on SDN, then it is OK, but many pre-meds are way too hyped up about things and it is reflected on SDN very well.
Best wishes! Enjoy your UG years, enjoy your free summers, enjoy your friends, this time will never repeats in your life, ever! Keep this in mind!
To quote the dean of admissions from my school “ultimately I’m just trying to figure out if I can imagine this person sitting across from me as a physician sitting across from a patient.”
^yes, agree.
Imagine, the patient may be a prisoner, brought straight from the prison. Or a patient may be mentally ill who is talking about seeing fire in the corner of the room and he and you are the only people in the room. What else he may see next? These are not theoretical situations, both of these has happened to my D. (and other med. students) multiple times during rotations. Personal maturity will play a crucial role in these situations. Got to maintain your cool and treat everybody with respect and great care.
My D has approximately 300 hospital volunteering hours from high school. They were non-clinical positions with some patient contact, but mostly grunt work. She stopped volunteering at the end of her senior year in high school with the intention of starting again at the beginning of college, but was very focused her first semester on school work/grades, one leadership position, and with getting her feet wet in college. She would now like to focus her EC time on gaining clinical experience, research experience, continued leadership, and a continuation of volunteering in other areas in her community. Since she is pretty busy with school work, much of this will have to happen full-time in the summers. Will she be able to count her HS volunteering hours on her med school application, or do med schools not care about high school experiences related to hospital volunteer work? Since her volunteer work stopped before she started college, does she have to start over as if she has had zero hours of volunteer experience?
Generally speaking volunteering/activities done during high school is not included on her AMCAS application unless it was something especially significant (think Intel Science winner or a journal publication).
How it works is that an applicant only has 15 spaces to list everything they’ve done & achieved. This includes leadership positions, shadowing, jobs, research experiences, clinical and non-clinical volunteering activities, awards, honors, publications, etc.
Hopefully your daughter will have more recent volunteering to list on her application.
BTW, your D will list each different volunteer experience separately on her app, along with a start and end date and the name of a supervisor or contact person who will verify her participation if asked. All of her volunteer activities aren’t all lumped together under “Volunteering” with a hour value.
“Will she be able to count her HS volunteering hours on her med school application…”
Yes, she would. A med school app doesn’t prohibit using high school ECs, but as wowmom indicates above, unless the EC is something significant (or maybe continues into college), D would strengthen her med school app with more recent ECs.
Thanks for the info. I guess my point was that D wants to move on to other EC’s that I listed above, including doctor shadowing (which I didn’t have on the above list, but may not want to leave off the volunteering she did in HS). She wants to use the limited time she has available to work on EC’s that she hasn’t done yet. I understand the 15 spaces to fill things out on the application which is what she had to do when she applied for a BAMD program. All of the high school hospital volunteer hours were at the same hospital with a start and end date. If she can count those hours, it would show an early interest in medicine and D could focus her energy on other EC’s now, unless 300 hours isn’t enough to even bother listing or it would look bad to go that far back in time. Does that make sense? The leadership position she is in also started her junior year of HS and she is still continuing with that same position, so all of that experience would go in one slot.
Early interest in medicine isn’t important. Seriously, adcomms do not care about that. Someone who decides she wants to be physician as college senior or after working for 15 years as a high school English teacher gets exactly the same consideration as someone who has been a pre med since 6th grade.
If your D wants to list her HS volunteer hours, then she is free to do so.
Personally I think including purely HS activities (that is, activities not continued during college) that are not designated as “Most Meaningful Experience” on AMCAS is a sign that an applicant either is padding their resume or hasn’t done anything really interesting in college. Most applicants have to leave a ton of stuff off their app simply because they don’t have enough room.
“Since she is pretty busy with school work, much of this will have to happen full-time in the summers.”
-Do not rely on this. You may be lucky, but nothing was available in our hometown. Check places NOW. Volunteering positions in our place have waiting lists. That was the reason that D. did most of it during school year with some lighter volunteering during summers (obtained some because of her persistant character, was not easy at all). She had all long term, volunteering for 3 years, Research for 3 years, job (3 years) and 2 minors. Her committee was floored with the amount and long term of all of her ECs. Everything is possible if one knows how to manage time. Few things D. had to turn down, she dropped her participation on the club sport team after freshman year and turned down nomination for Sorority president, but she was on Board anyway and it was very time consuming.
Just wanted to want about summers, the opportunities outside of your UG may not be there for you, that was D’s reality. So, she had nice relaxing summers, there are advantages in everything.
Thanks, WOWMom and MiamiDAP. That answered my questions. D has called several doc offices to inquire about shadowing and they either don’t return calls or they say, “I can’t help you, but call Dr. X.” Hopefully one will come through. She did some shadowing in HS, but that was then, this is now.
^Exactly D’s and everybody else’s experience. Got to be persitant. Check your own physicians, friends’ parents, there is a better chance, but even these sometime do not get thru to you. But shadowing does not have to be tons of hours, it is pretty boring, cannot do anything, just observe and not be on a way and sometime there are privacy issues that even observation is not possible. The shadowing actually could be done in a summer.
Any doc. knows that any medical facility is an educational place for a future docs. They consider it and the nicer ones will be happy to have you there as long as you do not 'crowd" them and let them do whatever is needed. That is why you have a better chance with the ones who actually know you.
Don’t agree with shadowing being boring. My son has been shadowing a neurosurgeon. Doctor is letting him shadow in operating room and office. He’s been watching amazing surgeries and the doctor actually goes over surgeries with him trying to teach him. Son comes home excited every time and can’t stop talking about it. While in the hospital he was able to watch a C section which was also amazing. He also shadowed an orthopedic surgeon in the office and loved it. I think if you’re bored shadowing a certain specialist maybe that’s not the specialty for you. Just a thought.