<p>I am a final year undegrad student. I'm planning on taking a year off and applying to grad school for english/lit. I am currently a lit major with a philosophy minor. My major GPA is 3.0 and my cum GPA is 2.8. I plan on getting up to at least 3.0 with a winter class I just took (almost certain I am getting an A) and my next semester of 4 classes. The problem in my GPA is with 4 outside of major classes: a math class freshmen year that I failed and retook to receive a B-, 2 history courses from when I was a history major that are a C and a D and fundamentals of biology for a D. Inside of my major and minor, my lowest grade is a C, and there is only one. I can get 3 good LOR: One lit professor who I have taken twice and who is held in very high esteem at my school with whom I have a good relationship, another lit professor who I have taken once but formed a good relationship with and a philosophy professor who is my adviser for philosophy club (I am president) and who I have had for 3 classes. I am taking the general GRE in a month and I will definitely be able to write a good personal statement and essay. </p>
<p>I have a few questions: Is my GPA too pitiful to give me a good chance at assistanceship/fellowship? Can I get in?</p>
<p>If I am applying, where the heck do I start looking? There are so many programs and schools.</p>
<p>Could I possibly take off a year or two to work and pay off my undergrad loans? my first LOR told me that it is generally not a good idea to remove yourself from academia for too long before going to grad school.</p>
<p>I ask that question first because if the answer is “I can’t think of anything else to do,” then you have a problem.</p>
<p>The job market for English MA/PhD students is absurdly awful right now, and particularly terrible for Lit specialists. Check the Chronicle of Higher Education forums for horror stories.</p>
<p>Top-tier English programs are really, really competitive and you’re not likely to get into one with a flat 3.0 GPA, much less funded. (A really stellar verbal GRE score would probably help.) Even graduates from top-tier programs are having trouble finding jobs. </p>
<p>Whatever you do, do not pursue an English graduate degree without full funding.</p>
<p>I’m aware of how bad the prospects for work are. I want to be a literature professor because I can’t foresee any more enjoyable occupation than studying and teaching literature. I suppose I’ve quite thoroughly screwed myself as far as my GPA goes. Realistically, is grad school a total non-possibility for me?</p>
<p>Of course you have a shot. It might not be a Top 10 school, but if you apply to enough places, there’s bound to be a program that’d be willing to take you in. As long as you meet the 3.0 cutoff and compensate for that in other ways, then I’d say you have a chance. Go for it! What do you have to lose besides the time and application fees? And of course, there’s also the master’s path, worst case scenario…</p>
<p>Will the program that is willing to take me foot the bill? Will my employment prospects be even worse if I don’t go to a top 10 school? Where do I find the schools that will be into my statistics? The app fees and my GRE fee are quite a bit of money I could use elsewhere. I can still cancel my GRE for a refund and save the money. I’ve taken the praxis and received a 180/200 so I could go that path if I so desired (not desired, but if I must, I must.)</p>
<p>How much do you want it? In my opinion, doing it just for the job at the end isn’t enough. To thrive in a Phd program, you have to be uber passionate about the subject you’re studying. What are your research interests? This is just a thought, but how about you just get your Masters and teach at a community college?</p>
<p>It’s not easy to find community college teaching positions, either. Lots of freshly-minted Ph.Ds out there going for the same jobs.</p>
<p>If you are dead set on this course, I would look to apply to master’s programs at less “prestigious” universities. With a really strong thesis, publications and great recommendations, you could have a shot at a “name” program for a Ph.D.</p>
<p>I don’t just want to be a professor. I want to be in academia. I know to research literature. I want to be a specialist in political fiction, existentialism and I’m looking for a field that brings together music and literature. I want to teach at a college and continue to learn for the rest of my life. </p>
<p>I suppose I’ll get to grad school somehow. Is there some way to view a list of grad school programs and their offerings or do you just kind of have to wing it? I plan on seeing advisers as soon as the semester starts, hopefully they will have some sort of list.</p>
<p>There really isn’t a list. You have to do your own research - after all, that’s what you’re going to be doing in graduate school.</p>
<p>Essentially every university in the country has an English department - so start browsing department home pages for graduate admissions requirements that you can meet. Then with that subset of schools in mind, look for faculty who share your interests.</p>
<p>That said, your advisers might have suggestions for programs that would fit your situation.</p>
<p>I’d be surprised if your professors didn’t already try to talk to you out of doing a PhD or MA in English lit. Too many professors these days don’t ask tough questions as they should.</p>
<p>Do take a year or two off and see what else is out there. It’s hard to see it that way because you are STILL a student and haven’t taken a break since you started school when you were 5. But I highly recommend it.</p>
<p>I am completely in love with my subject (history) but after being forced to take a year off this academic year, I’m really amazed that there are other things that I can pursue should the whole PhD thing blow up in my face. So I tell people that these activities are my second career plans! But I do personally have a passion for history and have an open mind to all different possibilities after the PhD.</p>
<p>Not only you need be able to eat, sleep, and breathe analyzing lit crits and theories, you need to be able to say to yourself, “So what if I can’t find an academic job at the end of this? I did spend 8 years doing what I loved to do and have no regrets.” If you can’t utter this phrase honestly, then keep dreaming but don’t apply just yet.</p>
<p>I’m aware of how bad the prospects for work are. I want to be a literature professor because I can’t foresee any more enjoyable occupation than studying and teaching literature.</p>
<p>Of course you can’t. You’ve never done anything else besides school. If you are a fourth year undergrad then presumably you came straight to college from high school. I didn’t see anything else either, when I was 22. But now that I’m nearly 25 and I’ve met more people and am out of the cocoon, I see LOTS of jobs that I could’ve enjoyed, some of them maybe more than health care research. As a matter of fact, seeing some of those other jobs made me decide to leave academia when I finish my degree (although my work will be related).</p>
<p>Having come straight to grad school from undergrad, I urge other people to take some time off first and be sure that this is what you want. I mean - you never know what graduate school is like until you get here. But make sure that there really IS nothing else you’d rather do for the next 8 years of your life than study literature - relentless. And not just reading lots of good books, but analyzing them, sitting in the library for hours, sitting through 2-3 years of classes, learning two classical languages (perhaps three!), taking exams, looking through archives…getting little sleep. Heh. It’s hard and it’s not always fun. This is going to sound like a weird q, but do you love literature enough to continue to study something even when you’ve come to hate it, when you never liked it to begin with, or when it bores you to tears? Because sometimes that’s what graduate work is about.</p>
<p>I ask you these questions because some of your reasonings (“I can’t see myself doing anything else,” “I want to learn for the rest of my life,” “I love academia” - you have no idea what it’s like as an undergrad) combined with your low major GPA are sending up red flags for me. Why is your major GPA so low? One C isn’t enough to bring it down there. That means you also only have one A and the rest are a rack of Bs, which isn’t very promising.</p>
<p>Get a realistic portrayal of what “studying and teaching literature” actually means. Do that search polarscribe said - find articles about what graduate school is like (protip: it’s not anything like undergrad, at all) especially in the humanities. Look at the time to degree (average in English lit right now is 10 years). Look at your chances of having a professor position (average right now is 1 in 5, and that’s assuming that you have a decent record when exiting your PhD program). Realize that there are plenty of other ways to “continue to learn for the rest of your life.” Also realize that the thing you love when it’s a side passion sometimes tends to lose its lustre when it becomes the center of your career - and I say that as someone who is still passionate about the issues, but less passionate about the day to day work of being a full-time researcher.</p>
<p>Thanks for a great, great post. I want to note, though, that I read your post as a perfectly good argument in favor of entering a PhD program. You have obviously learned a lot, and you have learned about good jobs in your field that are outside academia, where your PhD program skills (and your ability to withstand boredom, too) will no doubt serve you in good stead. Going back three years, was there a much better path to where you are today? Would things have been better if you had taken a job as a barista when you graduated from college?</p>
<p>I have to admit that this thread is, well, discouraging and depressing. My DD has a passion for English Lit and will be graduating in May from an Ivy. Her goal is to become an English Lit professor. She has applied to a few top 10 PhD programs in English as her advisers told her not to waste her time with any program that was not in the top 10. Just yesterday, she received her first admissions notice: She was admitted to a top 10 with what amounts to a full scholarship package, including tuition, fees, insurance and a stipend. The package does not require her to teach - I’m not sure if this is a good thing. In any case, I am wondering if at this late point I should tell her about some of the statistics that some of you mentioned in this thread: Time to degree, employment prospects, etc.?</p>
<p>MSMDAD, If your daughter is (a) a senior at an Ivy League university, (b) an English major (or some related major), (c) and someone who has the support of her faculty for applications to top-10 PhD programs . . . there is NO chance, NONE, that she is not aware of everything that has been said in this thread and more. She doubtless knows many graduate students at different stages of the process, and knows the difficulties and anxieties they face. (English Lit PhD students do not generally suffer in silence.) She has probably watched her department fill junior-faculty vacancies, witnessed a tenure controversy or two, and watched promising young faculty try to get new positions when they can’t get tenure. She has had realistic discussions with her advisors about what going into a PhD program means.</p>
<p>Thank you for your reply, JHS. At her Ivy, her advisors have had what I would categorize as encouraging discussions regarding her plans. As I indicated above, she has been told not to apply to any non top 10 schools as the employment prospects for those who attend schools below this level is not good. As it relates to your comments regarding junior faculty, she has not experienced or witnessed any of the things that you mention. And some of the TFs (mostly post-docs) that she has interacted with have gone on to tenure track positions at other schools.</p>
<p>Wow. Big congrats to your D, MSMDAD! I don’t know if she’d actually talk about what really goes in the department so you may not know everything. I never talk about what’s happening in my department because it’s no different from any other workplace. Besides, my parents would say that academics are weird/strange/crazy anyway.</p>
<p>MSMDAD – I am a little surprised by your answer, not that it matters. Once upon a time, I was in pretty much the same position, and I had oodles of information and very frank advice from everyone, ranging from world-famous professors to brand-new grad students. Many of the grad students I knew were future stars in their own right – they subsequently chaired the English departments at Harvard and Yale, and the German department at Michigan. I also saw plenty of what it was like to be a tenure-track junior faculty member. </p>
<p>My daughter, who graduated a few years ago as an English major from a university with a high-ranking English department, had a very similar experience. She knew a lot of grad students socially, took classes with them, and had a very accurate idea what their lives, work, and career prospects looked like.</p>
<p>I think that is one of the benefits of going to a research university for college. It also helps explain why lots of LACs produce more PhD students per capita than the undergraduate arms of research universities. It’s hard to be starry-eyed when you have seen things up close!</p>
<p>The important thing for you, however, is that your daughter would not have been successful in her applications without strong faculty support, and she wouldn’t have gotten strong faculty support if they didn’t think she had a good chance to succeed and a realistic plan for approaching her career path.</p>