D is a junior interested in Graphic Design. (I am a father interested in her getting a job after graduation but that’s another thread). Can anyone share insight on the difficulty of getting into these 3 schools? State is a lot cheaper since we live here. How stunning does your portfolio need to be?
There are other places with design programs like Boston U but one thing at a time.
@byadg123 I can only tell you what we based our decisions upon. I will just compare SCAD & NCSU since that will cover the major differences.
SCAD had a high acceptance rate along with a high price tag and only offered art related majors. What does a student do if they decide they want to change majors? What if they want to minor in something non-art related? Also, we heard the large pool of students sort of sink or swim after acceptance. Look into student retention after freshman year. The Savannah location is near a high crime area, check it out. There is no “college feel” to the school due to the buildings being spread across the city blocks. Those were the main deal breakers.
NCSU offered a low acceptance rate with a doable price tag and offers majors outside of the art field. The students are trained as designers/design thinkers rather than just artists. College of Design students take major-specific studios with the same group of students every year, so they have time to develop friendships and a support group. The “college feel” is there with a great campus, superb libraries and a diverse set of academically-minded students. The non-design university required courses allow the designers to mingle with engineers, science majors, humanities majors, agricultural students, etc. that one would miss out on if one attended an art school. Those were some of the factors that went into our decision & our student is very thankful they chose State.
Hope that helps. Look into NCSU’s Design Labs or Design Camp and you will get a good idea of the CoD’s vibe & expectations of the portfolios.
Thanks, Trusting! Father is hoping for State, D uncertain. What concerns me is the degree of difficulty of getting into NCSU. She’ll have to dedicate a chuck of the summer to SAT improvement and portfolio development. Design camp looks like a great option!
Highly recommend Design Camp - that was a major deciding factor for our student.
Did your student get to work on application portfolio pieces during the camp?
@byadg123 Yes, there is definitely potential to create portfolio pieces there - ours did. The camp counselors took photos of the projects at the end and gave the campers the images on a flash-drive for that reason.
During Design Camp students rotate through the different majors while creating a quick project in each field of study - architecture, graphic design, animation & industrial design. It depends on how quickly your student can create on how polished their final piece will be. They also pull really late nights during the residential camp, just like the students.
I believe they have also started targeted mini-camps where you can focus on the major you are most interested in studying rather than doing the rotation. Best of luck to you & your D.
THanks again, @Trusting. You aren’t the first to recommend it so we will apply to the camp - I hope there’s room.
i highly suggest you start considering VCUARTS. In Richmond Va. It is ranked as the #1 public and #2 overall fine arts school overall including privates per USNWR. They have a top 10 graphic design program which our D just got her acceptance to. Also tuition is the most reasonable of the top 10 design schools. Great city too.
@byadg123 Are you looking at schools in NC? My D and I toured ECU over spring break. They have a BFA program with a wide variety of concentrations including graphic design. She is interested in animation and illustration. We liked that they have a foundation year (the only art & design program within a university setting close to NC other than VCU that we know of that has one). Others please chime in if you know of others that aren’t too far away from NC. The campus was not overwhelmingly large, and the layout was easy to navigate.
After the general tour we wandered around the art building and met the Dean of the school who gave us an impromptu tour of the building. He introduced us to one of the animation professors who welcomed us into his class in progress and took time out to explain the program and what his students were working on. The students were very friendly and eager to show us their projects.
I’m not sure why there isn’t much talk about ECU Art & Design School on CC, but it will be on Ds list as a viable option as far as affordability and hopefully acceptance.
@stones3 - thanks. I’d heard but hadn’t done anything about VCU.
@ready2launch - wow. Never considered ECU. Thanks.
@byadg123 - FYI, the rankings cited by stones are for GRADUATE schools (did I say this before, correcting the same inane, self-serving posts, or is that all in my head?). As for the ‘reasonableness’ of costs, stones’ purported experience notwithstanding, VCU Arts is notoriously stingy with any form of scholarships and/or aid. The funding reported by posters on this thread alone – http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/20571730#Comment_20571730 – from just about every top dedicated art school, in just this forthcoming freshman class, makes virtually all of them less expensive than VCU Arts.
NCSU has the lowest acceptance rate (taking in 25-ish GD students each year) and a very stringent application process. D will need to submit a digital portfolio via Behance/personal website, wait on one decision, then come to campus for an in-person interview and physical portfolio submission. It’s no joke!
MICA has about a 50% acceptance rate and relies on the typical college application process. If D is top in high school there’s a decent chance of admission, from what I hear SCAD is similar.
I would rule out SCAD, but I’m biased and don’t know a whole lot about it. I’ve heard of a lot of dissatisfaction from alumni/students. It’s also geographically isolated and expensive. I’ve heard it has strong suits in printmaking and animation.
If you can get past Baltimore’s rep, MICA is in a great location as D can travel to major cities and take in a lot, which is important for a creative. Bmore can actually be good in the sense that it’s an eye-opening place. MICA also has a well-rounded offering of tech/art resources, a great professional network, accepting student body and faculty. Design at MICA is professional, career-minded, offers a huge network, and is backed up with the artistic student body and resources from other departments. If D works hard and is a decent communicator, there is no doubt D will get a job. It’s a great school to experiment and find your own process. You do have to work a bit against neoliberal indoctrination, but that’s not GD departments doing and has its value for becoming socially critical, especially if you’re from the South and already well-versed in the other end of politics (I say all this from an objective standpoint).
NCSU has the offerings of a large university. Pros are exposure to other schools, potential for networking (self-incentivized at the very least), exposure to the budding tech industry, a well-regimented design approach, and of course no bankruptcy. If D thinks empirically, pragmatically, and likes the sound of BS as opposed to BA (more business, less criticism/speculation), it’s a good choice. Raleigh somewhat lacks cultural capital, the art scene exists but isn’t as vibrant as Baltimore’s. Lots of craft breweries and millennial entrepreneurs catering to millennial entrepreneurs. If D is a shy person they may feel lost in the crowd (speaking from experience).
MICA and NCSU are both great for getting a job. One is artsy, one is sciencey.
Byadg123 - I am sure you have the good sense to simply look up the tuition , NET tuition costs of the top 10 graphic design schools in the country and regardless of one posters remarks, it’s easy to compare costs. REAL costs.
And of those top 10 , VCU has the most reasonable tuition , Yet USNWR ranks it as one of the very top programs(grad, as undergrad for everyone is not ranked and the poster knows this). Pretty darn impressive for the only top public design school to be right there with the privates and ranked higher than most. Also UCLA is tied #2.
Anyway always happy to respond with facts and open to pm if you would like. D just finishing fresh foundation year and
has had a tremendously positive experience. High gpa deans list, got accepted to graphic design major, has had some of her work sold (a pleasant surprise), awarded a cash prize for her written work as well! I kid you not, could not have been better. Plus she has an internship all set in nyc for 8 weeks this summer which as you will find out is unusually good for a rising freshman. These are all facts. so its easy to see why we are so supportive of VCUARTS.
VCU Arts has a current out-of-state tuition of approximately $31,000. With R&B at about $10,000, and the standard allowances for books, supplies and miscellaneous expenses (e.g., travel and entertainment) set at a modest $3000-3500, the total cost of attendance is about $44,000-45,000.
At first blush, this does indeed seem to be at the low end of top undergraduate art school costs, although Tyler in Philadelphia is about the same. However, the bottom totally falls out when comparing financial aid/merit awards. The average package, including some measure of merit and aid, for every elite school to which our daughter applied was $20,000. In some cases, RISD and Pratt included, the package was substantially higher. The offer from VCU was ZERO!
Even at a COA of $60k at RISD, the awards brought the cost down to $35k, about $10k LESS than VCU Arts.
The overwhelming reports of dozens of posters discussing the most recent admissions and financial awards experiences for the class of 2021 is that these numbers have held. If you peruse the thread for which I posted the link above, you will see posts regarding substantial packages from SVA, MICA, SCAD, and other elite art schools. There is not one mention of VCU Arts in this regard other than a failure on the part of the school to offer money.
As far as rankings, the above poster’s long track record of misrepresenting the standing of the schools at which her children attend is legendary. If indeed the poster is aware that the USNWR rankings refer solely to graduate schools, then why represent them as if they are germane to a discussion of undergraduate schools? In fact, why bring them up at all? They have no bearing, despite the poster’s contortions to make it so, on any of the discussions into which the poster has injected these ersatz factoids.
Tons of great information - you guys are the bomb!
As for financial aid that’s easy - apply where she wants and look at the packages. The proof will be in the proverbial pudding. There are strongly mixed reviews on VCU so if she likes it we will wait for their pudding.
She’s going to do the Design Immersions Camp at NCSU so will learn tons about life there. An issue will be SAT scores - we’ll see what she can do. We were surprisingly unimpressed by Pratt but liked MICA and SCAD. Really liked Fordham but not Drexel. (We did a Northeast Tour - NYC, PA, and MD. Savannah was an earlier one-off). Fordham will be a stretch but worth a try. If you don’t apply you definitely won’t go.
So the will-visit list now includes App State, ECU, VCU, and BU. And maybe RISD if we’re in Boston anyway. I kind of hope that’s all because I have a non-design twin to worry about! (Overlapping NCSU, BU, and Fordham)
Both SCAD and MICA have excellent reputations for graphic design; however, MICA might have the edge (top 5 rather than top 10). My advice would be to visit both schools to see which is the better fit. Both will provide a solid foundation program and a first-year residential community with relatively newer dorms. SCAD’s are brand new, for the most part. Founder’s Green (MICA) offers apartment-style living with full kitchen etc. which is pretty nice!
SCAD’s sticker price is actually cheaper than comparable schools including MICA; However, the real price is going to be net of any scholarship money. While YMMV, we have found that SCAD is more generous than MICA. With an admissions rate at less than 50% (and this year’s might be lower still, not sure), MICA is the harder school to get into. They also have a better 4-year grad rate and a bit better freshman retention rate. However, I’d say that both schools are headed in the right direction on these stats (especially by adding campus housing!). SCAD is a very large school and really has a big presence in the city of Savannah, especially the historic district. the campus is all over the place and you do need to rely on the shuttle to get you around. MICA is much smaller and a bit more contained within Bolten Hill (but near enough to neighboring communities that you can get out to some good restaurants). Much easier to get from dorm to class.
MICA has the advantage of letting you cross-enroll at other area colleges, including John Hopkins; however, I have no idea how well that works in reality.
Both are located in urban areas known for not being particularly safe but with lots of history and charm as well as an “artsy” community. Both are great cities for an artist to live, go to school, and even work. MICA has the advantage of being about 45 minutes away from DC and the Smithsonian as well as having the Walters and BMA (each some great collections) in town. Savannah has smaller, local museums as well as the SCAD museum of art. SCAD actually has an amazing and visible record of historic preservation and other projects scattered throughout the city of Savannah. Everywhere you go in the historic district - and even beyond - you see the work of SCAD students, so you get a great sense that these kids are out doing projects in the community. SCAD also has a great reputation for bringing industry professionals to campus for talks and seminars, though I’m guessing MICA does as well.
Both schools have interesting architecture, with several building that have been creatively “repurposed” for use as studio or student space.
I was also impressed with the career support efforts of both schools. Each seems to understand that you begin your professional development the second you arrive on campus. That kind of approach will have a higher likelihood of graduating students who can find work in their field.
Study abroad is more limited at SCAD as you mainly go either to the campus at LaCoste or Hong Kong. Lacoste is supposed to be stunning and the SCAD campus is right next to the castle of the Marquis de Sade (which sounds like of cool). Don’t know much about Hong Kong. MICA seems to have a much broader program of study abroad but I don’t know much about it.
@LetsGetUaJob - I wouldn’t exactly consider SCAD to be “isolated” given its proximity to Atlanta (big city - lots of jobs) including the opportunity to transfer to that campus. Also, trains, busses and airplanes all leave from Savannah so no worries there. We live in MN and have been able to get my kid back and forth pretty well.
When my D applied she really liked MICA. One of her good friends is there now and likes it a lot. SCAD has issues from what I gathered through my research. Don’t know anything about your state school. Btw, VCU is very stingy with money/aid.
Ultimately my D decided to attend Temple and loves the school. The graphic design program is highly selective and students have to apply sophomore year which makes it a little stressful but the professors have been amazingly supportive.
Good luck to you! We toured many art schools on both coasts, so feel free to pm me if you have any questions.
How very funny, @byadg123! We also have/had a “non-design twin to worry about!” I hear you on the financial aid and totally agree. Art schools, like all colleges, are a matter of personal comfort. We loved Tyler (at Temple U in Philly). Daughter did precollege at both MICA and RISD, so hear you on both of those as well. @veehee can speak volumes to Tyler. @JBStillFlying has kids at SCAD and Pratt. One thing from the mix of schools you list, is whether or not your daughter is looking for a dedicated art school, e.g., MICA, or an art school that is part of a larger university, e.g., BU. Her preference will go a long way in narrowing your choices. Btw, our daughter chose RISD because of the synergy between an intense dedicated art school and an Ivy League college at Brown. Good luck with your search!
She had been all about the pure art school until twin D visited Fordham and it opened her eyes to design at other-than-art schools. Plus NCSU. Twin has BU on her list and lo and behold, it has an Art school with a design department so now they’re both looking.
There’s no way non-art twin D is going South which may be enough to nix SCAD. They hadn’t planned to be together but would like to be within reach.
@byadg123 have you considered East Carolina University? We briefly looked at the school when they visited my D’s high school. They have a College of Fine Arts and Communication that has a school of art and design within it. It was my experience that the universities that had a dedicated College of Art (rather than the art department in the larger Arts & Sciences college) were more robust (which I felt might allow graduates a better chance at securing gainful employment!)