<p>Why is the application pool so competitive for international students??</p>
<p>I believe there’s a rule that international students can only take up 10% of total undergrad students.</p>
<p>There’s no quota for individual countries, so while it may be true that MIT has accepted about 10 Canadian students per year for the past few years, that’s not because there’s a limit on the number of Canadian admits, just a limit on the number of international admits overall.</p>
<p>I think it is more like 6% lol. But MIT takes about as many chinese students as canadians, where as Harvard accepts on average 1-2 students from China/Singapore a year and like 20 Canadian students… why is that?</p>
<p>Selectum, last year’s international admit rate was 3.38%. A significant part of the disparity is the applicant makeup. MIT gets enough applications from China alone to fill the class. From India, several times over. I have no published figures for Harvard, but talking to people who would know, I get the strong sense that Harvard does not get the same level of interest from Asia. This is not to say that Harvard isn’t popular there, just not as popular as MIT.</p>
<p>“MIT gets enough applications from China alone to fill the class. From India, several times over.” </p>
<p>Really? So like… 3000+ out of the ~15000 total applicants are international? (I’m assuming 15000 b/c they admit ~1500 for a 10% admit rate.) Or does the total not include international?</p>
<p>Sorry, if I was unclear. The statistics for last year are (of course) available from the MIT website: [MIT</a> Admissions: Admissions Statistics](<a href=“http://www.mitadmissions.org/topics/apply/admissions_statistics/index.shtml]MIT”>http://www.mitadmissions.org/topics/apply/admissions_statistics/index.shtml)</p>
<p>Last year there were 12,026 US applications of which 1,552 were accepted for an admissions rate of 12.90%. There were also 3,636 applications for the 123 international spaces or an admissions ratio of 3.38%.</p>
<p>Given that the international admit class is fixed in size, I was indicating that there was at least 123 applications from China (actually there were many, many more than that) and at least 250 from India (again a significant under count).</p>
<p>So I guess MIT doesn’t really focus on the well-roundedness of students? Like harvard does? Because there would be little opportunity for chinese students to have too much extracurricular activities in their home country. I say this only bc I have a friend from China, who says that the education curriculum is very much vigorous and theory-based. But they do produce the kind of geniuses that MIT is attracted to</p>
<p>MIT looks at subjective factors that are not academic as well as those that are.</p>
<p>ah, I see. Thanks Mikalye - that makes much more sense than what I was thinking… I’m not sure why I thought the other way in the first place. >.<</p>
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<p>International applicants can be well-rounded too! But I feel in order to assess this statement you’ll have to divide the domestic pool with the international pool. </p>
<p>I think there’s no doubt that ECs and well-rounded-ness is something that is heavily looked upon in the domestic pool, because there’s more room for selection and like you said, more opportunities in the US.</p>
<p>Personally, I feel like international admits fall into two categories: 1) the academically brilliant and 2) the life-story brilliant. I think there’s no doubt that MIT attracts academic heavyweights from other countries such as IMO medalists (I forgot which year, but there’s one year where virtually the entire Chinese IMO team decided to enroll at MIT), IPhO and IChO medalists…etc., but I feel like MIT also looks at applicant uniqueness and activities when assessing international admits. I personally know quite many international students at MIT who are NOT medalists nor brilliant researchers in their own countries. </p>
<p>I feel like given the very narrow quota allotted to international students, they’ll inevitably be held at an extremely high academic standard, but this is not to say that they’re all nerds. I feel like MIT also looks for ECs, personal traits, and life stories when admitting these international students. You may perceive that Harvard admits more “well-rounded” students, but that’s sometimes just because they can admit more intl’s and thus they can have a better representation of not just the olympiad medalists. Personally, I feel the things they look for in all of these elite schools are pretty much the same.</p>
<p>I think what you say makes sense, oasis. It’s weird that when applying for MIT as an international, race does not matter ( the application does not allow intls to fill in the ethnicity boxes). But I guess that’s because the available spots are so limited.</p>
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<p>I’m an international EC, and I can assure you that most of what I have read in this thread is wrong. If anything, well-roundedness matters more in internationals than in domestic applicants, if only because admissions is much more competitive. Further, the international applicant pool tends to be much, much more self selective than the US applicant pool. It is very rare for an international applicant to apply to the traditional reach/reasonable/safety school breadth that an American applicant does, if only because their safety schools and indeed often their reasonable ones tend to be in their home countries, so if they are taking the SATs and going through all of the other rigmarole associated with applying to a US institution from abroad, then they usually think that they have a viable chance. This makes the average applicant stronger in the international pool than the domestic pool, and then you pile on the harder ratio.</p>
<p>I can recall no student admitted from my region in the last five years, who did not have more than mere academic excellence. And we have had international medalists from my region who have not gotten in.</p>
<p>Yes, at some schools there is an established group of sports, clubs, and similar activities provided by and encouraged by the school. At these schools, participation in extracurricular activities is relatively straightforward. At others, the school provides nothing. That does not diminish the importance of the extracurricular question “What does the student do outside the regular curriculum or program of courses?” I have seen students who have significant extracurricular activities, despite the fact that the school provides little or no support for the same. If anything these kids are more impressive as they have managed to provide evidence for the idea that these activities are important to them, rather than having had a guidance counselor suggest that they join the community service club as it might look good on an application. That is not to suggest that students are penalised because they go to a school where there is an extracurricular program.</p>
<p>The idea that because a student is not applying from a school system that encourages extracurricular activities, that out of the classroom accomplishments are not part of the application is very, very, very wrong.</p>
<p>For what it is worth, MIT and Harvard have a similar proportion of international students in their entering classes, and the criteria for entry is more similar than it is different.</p>
<p>I would also disagree with the statement that applicants from Asia are less well rounded. When I was at MIT, somebody I knew from Singapore was the top MIT tennis player and prior to that was one of the top players in her country. I got the sense from her that that was as important in getting admitted as her solid academic credentials.</p>
<p>Also, my cousin was a good but not stellar student and went to Tsinghua University (MIT of China). Why? Because she was recruited by the swim team. There are opportunites for extracurricular activities in China (for people who excel at sports anyways) which are not only looked upon favorably by MIT, but by Chinese universities themselves.</p>
<p>I heard that in one particular year, MIT only accepted 2 Canadians… I guess you really do have to be top-notch if you want to get into MIT as an International student.</p>
<p>I’ve also heard about an IMO Silver medalist (in Junior year, of course) not getting into MIT. His marks were probably stellar.</p>
<p>Question of curiousity: Is it any easier to get in as a Canadian female? Probably not, right?</p>
<p>If I were applying to MIT as an Intl applicant once more, I’d take what Mikalye said to heart. </p>
<p>@ ttyl8, </p>
<p>imho, being female alone just doesn’t make it more easier, maybe if your a female like Celine Dion, then probably yes. As in, if you show that your better than the male applicants in academics/personal strength/talent etc. </p>
<p>@forum</p>
<p>And not to sound pessimistic, but, I think its pointless to apply if you haven’t got anything above above-average. I speak from personal experience.
They pick just 123 people from 3000, obviously…they’re all <em>the best</em> internationally.
I know several people who’ve applied to MIT from my region (same as Mikalaye’s 
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and they were the top 1,2 or 3 in their school. And the closest someone came to attend MIT, was that they got on a waitlist. Haha! The reasons why I and some others applied were that we felt given our circumstances, we had done well and we did WAYY better than the others in our school anyway. So we applied ‘hoping’ for the best, and note none of my classmates were national (let alone internationally) accomplished. I repeat, we were just the top from our school. (And note: that school may not be very competitive, hence anyone who works a little hard may be at the top)</p>
<p>On an another note, I dont care what they say about financial aid, but if your an international with sufficient means to just afford the minimum (like transportation, and books), I’d recommend you not to apply for aid (not more than 1000$ anyway). Coz, also note that a lot of internationals (lets say 100(?) out of 123) are fully capable of paying.</p>
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I disagree with this advice.</p>
<p>MIT is need-blind for both international and domestic students, and a student’s ability to pay has no bearing on whether he or she is admitted – correlation is not causation, and even if many international admits are able to pay (where is the evidence for this?), that does not mean they were admitted based on their ability to pay.</p>
<p>Any implication that MIT considers financial need a negative in the admissions process is patently false.</p>
<p>I think many Canadians apply just because, well, US is the neighbour and there are better schools across the border. </p>
<p>If you think about it, 75 dollars (it was 65 dollars last year, I think) isn’t that much if that’s what determines where you’ll be for the next 4 years of your life. It’s more of a gamble- if you pay 75 dollars and you get in (despite all odds), then you get enough financial aid to pull you through school. </p>
<p>And I know that in some Canadian schools, SAT’s are something normal; you take it with your friends and you compare it with your friends. I know a bunch of people who took SAT’s (Reasoning and Subjects) but never applied to a single American school. </p>
<p>As for the re-applying thing R-DNA talked about, I definitely don’t think that you should apply if you’re just going to submit the same application again after twitching it a bit. But if you have just added a bunch of stuff onto your application (e.g. Important courses you should’ve taken, awards, higher scores, AP’s, stronger EC’s…) then I don’t see why you shouldn’t re-apply. You could actually accomplish quite a bit in one year.</p>
<p>I think it’s just best to think about it this way: MIT is a top school that accepts top people. So if you are not within the top 10 people in your country (Internationally speaking), then you probably won’t get in.</p>
<p>I’m not quite sure why the issue of the application fee is really significant- at $75, the application fee is less than the cost of an AP examination, and only slightly more than the cost of SATI registration. For what it’s worth, though, I know that many states (or schools) offer reduced college application costs for those who meet demonstrated financial need.</p>
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<p>Well I do not know if R-DNA is from my region or not, but I do know that again this advice is false. I know of several students who have been admitted to MIT from my region each year who aren’t anywhere near the top of the country in terms of objective achievements. Again it is a matter of context.</p>
<p>Last year my region had TWO admits that were not in the top percentiles nationally but who brought other things to their application.</p>
<p>The standard rule of thumb is that MIT admits zero percent of those who do not apply. Figure out if you really want to go to MIT. If the answer is yes, then definitely do apply. However, as an international, don’t apply EXPECTING to get in. Every year I meet at least one student who has always achieved everything that they have set out to get and is completely confident that they will of course get in to MIT. Sometimes they do, but much more often they do not.</p>
<p>-Mikalye</p>
<p>PS: I personally got in early. I was in the 92nd percentile in my school. Not bad, but not threatening to be valedictorian either. </p>
<p>Now for example, my lowest mark in school was a low C in a typing class. Parents of my friends were horrified, and told my parents that they should never have let me take typing at high school as it would lower my GPA. Which it did. But as I have moved into my professional life, I am very, very grateful that I learned proper keyboarding skills in High School. I can now type faster than most of my colleagues and that is a professional advantage even in a managerial role. And MIT looked at how my GPA was constructed and I got in. My friends parents advice on how to game the system was well intentioned, but ultimately misplaced. It is really quite hard to game the system. Not impossible mind you, but quite, quite hard.</p>