<p>Or maybe they just don't know what to cheer for. I mean, a Bulldog is a pretty well-defined mascot, but what is "Crimson" but a color? Somehow, "RAH-RAH RED!" just doesn't inspire the sort of verve that one associates with great school spirit.</p>
<p>Does Harvard even have anything other than "Crimson"? Other schools have both colors and some kind of team name or symbol. That must be where the difference lies.</p>
<p>they have a puritan mascot, sort of indicative of the social life...
bulldogs are sloppy and messy and **** everywhere, puritans are godly and pure and most importantly, celibate.</p>
<p>Patriots? Boooooooooooo</p>
<p>"don't listen to northstarmom crimsonbulldog, what she says isn't always accurate. In this case, she's speaking from a personal perspective. Apparently she is appalled by people who love their school, therefore she resorts to saying that harvard has none."</p>
<p>That's ridiculous. I am not appalled by people who love their school. I love my school. I just don't have to paint myself in crimson or constantly put down Yale or other colleges to prove that I love my school.</p>
<p>I agree with whomever posted earlier that Harvard alum and students prove their love of Harvard by donating -- money as well as time. Since I am not among the many wealthy alums, I don't donate a lot of money to Harvard, but I certainly do donate a lot of time -- serious time being of service to the college, not in general hanging out at football games, etc. </p>
<p>I know that college spirit is very important to some people. I have a friend who went to Stanford over Yale for undergrad because she wanted to be in a school that emphasized football. She's far from a ditz -- one of the smartest people whom I've ever met. She just likes school spirit.</p>
<p>Clearly, Harvard would not have been a good place for her to go nor is it a good place for people who think like she does. That's why we're lucky in the US that there are a lot of excellent colleges with different atmospheres.</p>
<p>Just because Harvard had what I wanted when it comes to wanting to avoid ostentatious displays of school spirit doesn't mean that that's what I think that everyone should want.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Or maybe they just don't know what to cheer for. I mean, a Bulldog is a pretty well-defined mascot, but what is "Crimson" but a color? Somehow, "RAH-RAH RED!" just doesn't inspire the sort of verve that one associates with great school spirit.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Why would that matter? If people wanted to live vicariously through athletes, having a color as a "mascot" wouldn't stop them from doing so. It's not very hard to say "Go Harvard" or "Go Crimson." Just because they don't have an animal or something to represent them, it doesn't mean that it would result in lower school spirit.</p>
<p>No, I believe it comes down to Harvard students simply not seeing the point in caring so much about what their athletes are doing. In the end, is it of any significance whether or not Harvard has their 5th consecutive victory over Yale in the football game? Not really. Harvard students know this and choose not to care too much about it.</p>
<p>Their love/pride for the school is demonstrated clearly by the alumni donations. They care enough to support the school through ways that actually matter. It's pretty silly to define school spirit with how many people support their athletic teams.</p>
<p>I think having school spirit is great. Of course there can be extremists in either direction but I think that in general school spirit is good. I havent noticed any lack of school spirit from the harvard alums I've met</p>
<p>I give money and ALSO go to games. </p>
<p>And note to Bulldog: those Puritans were hardly celibate - having 10 children or more was the rule, rather than the exception. The operative word is fecund. </p>
<p>The Bulldog, on the other hand, is a rather odd mascot - the second stupidest among 87 recognized breeds. Handsome Dan #1 earned his job because he was so slow-witted that all the yelling and screaming on the sidelines didn't faze him; he didn't have a clue what was going on.</p>
<p><em>third most stupid</em></p>
<p>thank you</p>
<p>edit: </p>
<p>I think you misinterpreted my description of the puritan. Of course they have many children... once they are married. Like the puritanical Harvard college students, they would never engage in such a mortal sin as premarital sex, nor ever imbibe upon the devil's brew. These things are strictly forbidden as sinful and enforced by your local proctor and House Master.</p>
<p>Ranking of dogs by breed intelligence: [From "The Intelligence of Dogs"]</p>
<p>ELITES: </p>
<ol>
<li>Border Collie</li>
<li>Poodle</li>
<li>German Shepherd</li>
<li>Golden Retriever</li>
<li>Doberman Pinscher</li>
<li>Shetland Sheepdog</li>
<li>Labrador Retriever</li>
<li>Papillon</li>
<li>Rottweiler
<ol>
<li>Australian Cattle Dog
Welsh Corgi (Pembroke)</li>
<li>Miniature Schnauzer</li>
<li>English Springer Spaniel</li>
<li>Belgian Tervueren</li>
<li>Schipperke</li>
<li>Belgian Sheepdog</li>
<li>Collie
Keeshond</li>
<li>German Shorthaired Pointer</li>
<li>Flat-Coated Retriever
English Cocker Spaniel
Standard Schnauzer</li>
<li>Brittany</li>
<li>Cocker Spaniel</li>
</ol></li>
</ol>
<p>MATCHES:</p>
<ol>
<li>Weimaraner</li>
<li>Belgian Malinois
Bernese Mountain Dog</li>
<li>Pomeranian</li>
<li>Irish Water Spaniel</li>
<li>Vizsla</li>
<li>Cardigan Welsh Corgi</li>
<li>Chesapeake Bay Retriever
Puli
Yorkshire Terrier</li>
<li>Giant Schnauzer</li>
<li>Airedale Terrier
Bouvier des Flandres</li>
<li>Border Terrier
Briard</li>
<li>Welsh Springer Spaniel</li>
<li>Manchester Terrier</li>
<li>Samoyed</li>
<li>Field Spaniel
Newfoundland (dog)
Australian Terrier
American Staffordshire Terrier
Gordon Setter
Bearded Collie</li>
<li>Cairn Terrier
Kerry Blue Terrier
Irish Setter</li>
<li>Norwegian Elkhound</li>
<li>Affenpinscher
Silky Terrier
Miniature Pinscher
English Setter
Pharaoh Hound
Clumber Spaniel</li>
<li>Norwich Terrier</li>
<li>Dalmatian</li>
<li>Soft-Coated Wheaten Terrier
Bedlington Terrier
Fox Terrier (Smooth)</li>
</ol>
<p>SAFTIES:</p>
<ol>
<li>Curly Coated Retriever
Irish Wolfhound
<ol>
<li>Kuvasz
Australian Shepherd</li>
<li>Saluki
Finnish Spitz
Pointer</li>
<li>Cavalier King Charles Spaniel
German Wirehaired Pointer
Black and Tan Coonhound
American Water Spaniel</li>
<li>Siberian Husky
Bichon Frise
English Toy Spaniel</li>
<li>Tibetan Spaniel
English Foxhound
Otterhound
American Foxhound
Greyhound
Wirehaired Pointing Griffon</li>
<li>West Highland White Terrier
Scottish Deerhound</li>
<li>Boxer
Great Dane</li>
<li>Dachshund
Staffordshire Bull Terrier</li>
<li>Alaskan Malamute</li>
<li>Whippet
Chinese Shar Pei
Fox Terrier (Wire)</li>
<li>Rhodesian Ridgeback</li>
<li>Ibizan Hound
Welsh Terrier
Irish Terrier</li>
<li>Boston Terrier
Akita Inu</li>
<li>Skye Terrier</li>
<li>Norfolk Terrier
Sealyham Terrier</li>
<li>Pug</li>
<li>French Bulldog</li>
<li>Brussels Griffon
Maltese</li>
<li>Italian Greyhound</li>
</ol></li>
</ol>
<p>THIRD TIER TOILETS:</p>
<ol>
<li>Chinese Crested Dog
<ol>
<li>Dandie Dinmont Terrier
Petit Basset Griffon Vendeen
Tibetan Terrier
Japanese Chin
Lakeland Terrier</li>
<li>Old English Sheepdog</li>
<li>Great Pyrenees</li>
<li>Scottish Terrier
Saint Bernard</li>
<li>Bull Terrier</li>
<li>Chihuahua</li>
<li>Lhasa Apso</li>
<li>Bullmastiff</li>
<li>Shih Tzu</li>
<li>Basset Hound</li>
<li>Mastiff
Beagle</li>
<li>Pekingese</li>
<li>Bloodhound</li>
<li>Borzoi</li>
<li>Chow Chow</li>
<li>Bulldog</li>
<li>Basenji</li>
<li>Afghan Hound</li>
</ol></li>
</ol>
<p>Byerly I'm impressed, you never fail to provide the facts to back up your argument :)</p>
<p>Obviously you are a science geek with little background in history - a clear case of one who did not acquire a broad liberal arts education.</p>
<p>Herewith, a short tutorial:</p>
<p>"Puritans' positive legacy for America</p>
<p>By Betsy Hart</p>
<p>During the Thanksgiving holiday, we inevitably think of America's first pilgrims, or Puritans, as those who practiced their strain of Protestantism came to be known.</p>
<p>Thoughts of the first celebratory feast with the Indians aside, those early settlers who came to the New World seeking "purity" in worship are today regularly characterized as stern, colorless, humorless and certainly sexless people. In short, "puritanical."</p>
<p>But is this wildly accurate. Worldly Saints by Leland Ryken and A Quest for Godliness by J.I. Packer are just two scholarly books in recent years that shed light on who the Puritans really were.</p>
<p>Did those early Protestants hate sex? Hardly. When a New England Puritan wife complained, first to her pastor then to her whole congregation that her husband was neglecting their sex life, the church excommunicated him!</p>
<p>A leading Puritan preacher, William Gouge, said married couples should engage in sex "with good will and delight, willingly, readily and cheerfully." An anonymous Puritan expressed the common view that in marriage a couple "may joyfully give due benevolence (a Puritan term for sex) one to the other."</p>
<p>Throughout the writings of the Puritans, marriage and the sex act within it are affirmed as gifts from God. This was a progressive view, for it contradicted the prevalent medieval teaching that religious celibacy was more virtuous than marriage and family life. This affirmation of marriage in turn raised the status of women.</p>
<p>Were the Puritans always afraid "someone, somewhere, was having fun" as is heard today? No. One Puritan pastor, for instance, instructed his followers to enjoy recreations " including sports like hunting, bowling, swimming and archery " "as liberties, with thankfulness to God that allows these liberties to refresh ourselves." Yes the Puritans lived in a different and far more difficult time, in many ways less frivolous than today. But it was always the generally held view that "the Christian gospel was good, merry glad and joyful tidings, that maketh a man's heart glad, and maketh him sing, and dance and leap for joy" as one Puritan noted.</p>
<p>The Puritans enjoyed alcohol - both beer and rum. (Though apparently there were enough cases of enjoying it in more than moderation that later a Harvard student could be fined "five shillings for drunkenness.") And the Puritans did quite a business in rum. The productilon of rum was a leading industry from the earliest days, in both the Puritan and the Pilgrim settlements."</p>
<hr>
<p>In 1638, students at the Puritan Harvard had beer served with every meal - including breakfast!</p>
<p>Yeah, Byerly, I learned in THIRD GRADE enough facts about the Puritans to know Bulldog was mistaken on that point (and I had never even been to New England up to that age). What has happened to history teaching in this country?</p>
<p>I was merely extrapolating what I saw at Harvard over four years. I guess Harvard kids today are not true to their wily puritanical ancestors (although I hear they just started serving beer at Annenberg once a week)</p>
<p>Note also that a lot of those beer-swilling Harvard students - back in the early Puritan days, - were 12-13 years old!</p>
<p>This tells me that your nerdy life as a science geek and medical student not only prevented you from understanding the history of Harvard, but also - quite obviously - prevented you from gaining much of a feel for the place during your brief, cloistered interlude in Cambridge.</p>
<p>Your experience - or lack of it - reminds me of that fable about "The Blind Men and the Elephant" - where the poor fellows wrongly understood the vast and impressive creature that stood before them based on their limited personal contact.</p>
<p>Harvard has great school spirit, dammit!!!! Just look: <a href="http://www.harvardsucks.org%5B/url%5D">http://www.harvardsucks.org</a></p>
<p>Byerly,</p>
<p>You would bite off your own tongue before you would allow yourself to criticize Harvard...admit it, you wish the Harvard student body shared your love for their school: oh school spirit where art thou!
Those beer-swilling Harvard students of 2005.</p>
<p>I severely criticized Harvard for cravenly giving in on the matter of so-called "restricted EA" after having sent an earlier signal that they were prepared to bring the whole ED scam down like a house of cards.</p>
<p>And I rather think the current Harvard student body has as great a regard for their school as Harvard students always have had. Their tendency to (naughty word) and moan about the cause de jour is nothing new, and is part of what makes someone Harvard material in the first place: an unwillingness to accept the status quo, or to be satisfied with less than the best.</p>
<hr>
<p>Any school that tries too strenuously to suppress alcoholic consumption runs the risk (as we have seen) of encouraging binge drinking. At the moment there seems no easy way to break out of this vicious circle.</p>
<p>It has nothing to do with morality, and everthing to do with liability. Harvard (and virtually every other school that isn't stupid) is simply scared to death that some kid will die of "alcohol poisoning", or fall out a window in a drunken stupor, and that the damn parents will sue for $250 million.</p>
<p>Common sense and the "new prohibitionism" will continue in conflict until Congress and the states limit liability in such cases.</p>
<p>We have witnessed a tactical diversion thus far. Are we sufficiently off topic? To get back on topic I am sumbitting a ten year old Crimson article to basically support three points made earlier:</p>
<p>a. Harvard's lack of school spirit has been around for a long while;
b. As stated below, "a catalyst for issues of school spirit, the solutions lay with the undergraduates" (who, unfortunately remain a minority at the school);
c. As stated below, the "administration could be a catalyst for issues of school spirit" (but clearly they have done their best to dampen it).</p>
<p>Published on Saturday, October 29, 1994
U.C. Plans College Pep Rally
Proposes Bonfire in MAC Quad to Revitalize School Spirit</p>
<p>By JEREMY L. MCCARTER
Crimson Staff Writer </p>
<p>Members of the Undergraduate Council said yesterday they are considering plans for a college-wide pep rally on the eve of the Yale Game to address the College's notorious lack of school spirit. </p>
<p>Co-chair of the council's Campus Life Committee Rudd W. Coffey '97 proposed the rally at last Monday's committee meeting. </p>
<p>"We want to have a bonfire and pep rally in the quad behind the MAC from 7-9 the night before the game," Coffey said yesterday. </p>
<p>The rally's main purpose would be to show students' support for the football team, Joshua D. Liston '95, a member of the Campus Life committee, said yesterday. </p>
<p>"Before everyone goes out and parties, we'd like to have everyone come out and cheer on the Crimson," Liston said. </p>
<p>Liston said he hopes cheerleaders, the band, the football team and Head Coach Tim Murphy will participate in the rally. </p>
<p>A rally of these proportions would be a unique event at Harvard, and may trigger an increase in school spirit as a whole, council members agreed. </p>
<p>"We haven't had a full-scale pep rally like this, not since I've been here," Council Vice-President Brandon C. Gregoire '95 said. </p>
<p>But two years ago, the Harvard University Band marched through Harvard's dining halls playing "Ten Thousand Men of Harvard," then joined the cheerleaders for a pep rally on the steps of Widener Library, according to Anne Q. Eakin '95, the manager of the band. </p>
<p>"[The possibility of a rally is] sort of a non-issue to me, because we'd do it with or without the U.C.," Eakin said yesterday. "But if the U.C. ends up funding some advertising, that would be great." </p>
<p>But gaining bureaucratic approval for the pep rally may be a difficult task, Coffey said. </p>
<p>After finalizing plans for the rally, the council would need approval from the Harvard Police Department, the Cambridge Fire Department, the masters of Lowell, Eliot, Winthrop and Kirkland Houses and Dean of Students Archie C. Epps III, Coffey said. </p>
<p>Epps has demonstrated his interest in school spirit in the past. Two years ago, the dean formed a Spirit Committee to address the issue of school spirit at Harvard. That committee is currently inactive. </p>
<p>"It is not active. I had concluded that while the administration could be a catalyst for issues of school spirit, the solutions lay with the undergraduates," Epps said yesterday. "I am therefore happy that the Council is interested in the rally and I hope that it goes well for them." </p>
<p>Coffey, Liston and Gregoire agreed yesterday that steps must be taken to increase school spirit at Harvard. </p>
<p>And Jeremy H. Gunther '98, an offensive tackle on the junior varsity team, said a rally would help to increase students' awareness of the football program. </p>
<p>"I think it would be nice to get something like that started, to get people interested in us," he said.</p>
<p>Speaking of irony...I think its ironic that y'all Harvard-ites bend over backwards to affirm your superiority over New Haven and cite as evidence of this superiority the fact that you dont have to point it out in the first place...</p>