<p>Again, please read my post carefully. I very specifically noted that the 3.6 figure is almost definitely inflated: it’s a self-reported number, via a survey conducted by The Crimson. It comes from ONE specific source, and it’s not the Harvard registrar. Don’t read into what’s not there. No one ever said ‘Everyone’ says the average GPA is a 3.6 or for that matter, 3.5.</p>
<p>Dwight - As you know, yes indeed D is taking the courses in with all the pre-meds though she is interested in research (la1a, ls1b, sls 20, ps1, chem 17 and then the early math courses that can ruin ones love of math). It very well could be that those courses are not representative for grading curves at Harvard. This semester will be her first without those courses dominating her schedule. BTW - what did you end up declaring as your concentration?</p>
<p>Also from Harvard’s web site:</p>
<p>“Each June, approximately 30% of the class will graduate with a degree cum laude in field.” </p>
<p>“the lowest GPA to receive a degree cum laude in field in June 2006 was 3.417”</p>
<p>So, it would seem that achieving a 3.7 overall GPA is something that only about 1 in 5 Harvard students is able to accomplish while about 1 in 2 (20% plus 30%) Harvard students are able to achieve a a 3.4+ GPA.</p>
<p>Thus, in response to the original question and given that Harvard is not Lake Wobegon, achieving that 3.4+ GPA is hard enough that about half the students that manage to get in to Harvard, don’t do it.</p>
<p>Of course parents are reminded at matriculation when told not to obsess about their kids’ GPAs that the answer to “What do you call the student who graduates last in his or her class at Harvard?” is “A Harvard graduate.”</p>
<p>^ I think that calculation is basically right, but there is a twist that affects it a little. I believe that in most concentrations eligibility for honors requires writing a thesis, and there are always some people who would be eligible for honors on the basis of their grades but who choose not to write the thesis. As a result, the bottom cut-off for cum laude in a particular field (3.472 in 2010) is likely to be somewhat below the median GPA for the class, because the formula for determining the cut-off is the number that will produce a number of honors-in-field graduates equal to half the class, but only (60%? 70%?) of the class is eligible for honors-in-field. (I assume that people who think they will not be eligible for honors based on their GPAs usually don’t choose to write a thesis, unless they think they need it for graduate school applications. So the number of honors-eligible students is not likely to be that much over 50%.) The real median is probably something just a little short of 3.5.</p>
<p>Harvard will award non-field cum laude honors to anyone whose GPA meets the magna standard, but who is not eligible for field honors, and with a cap of 10% of the class. It would be interesting to know how many people get general honors like that each year – it would give some hint of how many people with top grades take themselves out of eligibility for field honors. I bet it’s not anywhere near 10% of the class, however. (If it were 10%, that would mean that 30%, not 20%, of Harvard students graduated with a GPA of 3.74 or higher last year, and it would raise my guess of the median GPA significantly.)</p>
<p>I must not hang out with the right crowd…Almost everyone around me senior year were writing theses </p>
<p>JHS brings up a great point. I’m really not sure what percentage get college/general studies cum laudes…it’s actually not difficult to figure out, since it’s listed in the commencement booklet each year, seperate from those who achieved cum laude via their department and a thesis. Unfortunately, I don’t have it with me; otherwise, should be easy enough to do a rough estimate…</p>
<p>I checked a few concentrations quickly, and there are a few that don’t require a thesis at all for honors eligibility (e.g., Computer Science, although a thesis is “highly encouraged”), or that require a thesis only for magna/summa eligibility (e.g., Economics, English). Lab sciences seem either not to require a thesis at all, or to require one only for summa eligibility. That will tend to drive the cum laude cut-off a lot closer to the median, since high-GPA students who choose not to write a thesis will still be in the pool for field cum laude in a lot of the most popular concentrations.</p>
<p>As for Wind Cloud Ultra’s sense that almost everyone writes theses . . . (a) it can’t be right, but (b) it may reflect departments where a thesis is mandatory for all graduates, whether or not they want to be eligible for honors. That was the case at Yale when I went there – senior theses were not optional in most departments – and I know that at Princeton everyone has to write one. I didn’t think that was the case at Harvard, but it maybe is in some departments. I note, however, that the History Department’s website says that [only] 40% of History concentrators write theses!</p>
<p>D’s concentration and track (neurobiology with mind, brain, and behavior) does require a thesis for all graduates so her completing one will have nothing to do with her GPA.</p>
<p>My son did econ + premed and has found it very hard to maintain a high gpa. The only class that seemed to be an A with little stress was in art history but that was a core vs. departmental class which he says tend to be easier.</p>
<p>Well, it’s not insanely difficult to maintain a GPA in that range, though it will take a lot of work. I’ve come to find that you can screw up terribly in some courses and still make up for it if your mistake is made early enough. </p>
<p>I’ve taken LifeSciences 1A and Math 1b, two introductory courses that many premed students take, and I think that they’re really not as hard as a lot of people complain they are - all you have to do is stay on top of your work. I didn’t do that for the first half of the semester, and after the first midterm, I basically stopped sleeping until I caught up. If you do that, you should have no problem pulling an A- from the class. :)</p>
<p>However - and perhaps this was just my experience - I have found that language classes are fun and not too harshly graded. If you need an extra class, take one. :)</p>
<p>Not sure if I am in theright place or not but here goes…My daughter received a letter 3 weeks ago ( this was after a call from her admissions officer informing her ) notifying her of an "early positive indication"of acceptance. She is extremely thrilled at the great news. My question is…she has a couple other applications out to other Ivy league schools, does anyone know if any of the other Ivy’s ever send out this type of letter of will the notification come around April 1st, as we thought Harvard’s would?
Thanks</p>
<p>moon81 – Congratulations to your daughter! That’s really a nice surprise for mid-January, and it probably reflects a lot of hard work and talent on her part.</p>
<p>Many of the Ivies send out that kind of letter – known as a “likely letter,” most often in the fall to athletes who are being heavily recruited, but also sometimes to non-athletes. I don’t know whether it’s all of them or just 5-6, but certainly Harvard, Yale, and Princeton do it, and perhaps more aggressively than others. I think it’s not unknown for someone to get a likely letter from more than one college, but still pretty unusual – no college gives out very many, so the chance of overlap is not great, and with athletes it usually reflects an understanding that the student asking for the letter will effectively commit to that school if it is forthcoming.</p>
<p>Formal admission, at Harvard or at any of the other colleges to which she has applied, won’t come until late March.</p>