<p>I’m a former “NMF” currently at Vassar and according to your definition, I’m not living up to expectations with my 3.35. Fortunately, I don’t care, as I’m learning and also very active with extracurriculars at school that are giving me real-world experience. I graduated high school with a 4.0/4.8 weighted, valedictorian of my class, and I don’t feel that I’m disappointing anyone by not getting a 3.6 or higher. I’m a little offended by that generalization, actually…</p>
<p>I would second calmom:
Most NMFs are naturally good SAT-takers. This gift goes unclaimed in colleges (college tests are different).
Indeed, the important thing about NMFs is not that they score high. To become NMF you need a score equivalent to mid-2100s on SAT (which is by no means super-high at competitive high schools or in top colleges), and then a decent (but by no means stellar) GPA in order not to get into 10% not advancing to NMFs at the last step. But you have to get this score EARLY in 11th grade.
In most cases it means scoring high without preparation. Natural SAT-taking ability can help tremendously. But this is not an indicaton for future performance at college.
Another group of NMFs - those, who were PREPARED for PSAT. Kids are rarely into colleges and tests that early. Either their mother was heavily helocoptering (bad prognosis for college without mom around) or because their usually Asian parents pushed as hard as they could (such kids usually get life in college and forget about perfect GPA).
Some NMFs are either serious enough to learn about PSAT and prepare without parental nagging, or are really exceptional (for them breezing through PSAT is just one of many achievements). Those do great in college.</p>
<p>Perhaps a bigger question is how do all academic scholarship recipients do? Why single out NMF other than it is high profile?</p>
<p>I wonder if the college GPA is that much different than those on other high achieving scholarships? I hear of students losing those as well.</p>
<p>My son is a NMF and at a top 30 private university. In electrical Engineering he has a 3.4 and I don’t think that is too shabby given his course load. The University requires a 3.0 to maintain the scholarship. In non grade inflation Universities a 3.5 is a great score.</p>
<p>I think that students receiving scholarships based on multiple criteria (traditional internal merit scholarships) are more likely to be strong and motivated.
Drizzit: Engineering IS harder on GPA, and 3.4 is pretty good. But was NMF the only outstanding thing about your son? What I meant is that some kids have plenty of achievents, NMF frequently being just one of them. Others have NMF as their major achievement, and those are NOT rare. There is a HUGE difference for performance expectations for these two groups.</p>
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<p>Or a third possibility–parents have been on CC, knew that merit scholarships would be required for college, and knew from CC that National Merit designation would be extremely useful. At our local high school College and Career Office, we clue parents in about the benefits to their kid being NMS if $$$ is a concern.</p>
<p>dc89 notes,“I’m a former “NMF” currently at Vassar and according to your definition, I’m not living up to expectations with my 3.35. Fortunately, I don’t care, as I’m learning and also very active with extracurriculars at school that are giving me real-world experience. I graduated high school with a 4.0/4.8 weighted, valedictorian of my class, and I don’t feel that I’m disappointing anyone by not getting a 3.6 or higher. I’m a little offended by that generalization, actually”</p>
<p>Response: I have mentioned this because you are getting both a NMF scholarship and probably one at your school, not to mention probably a boost in admission as a result of your status. This should be contrasted to some others who didn’t get these scholarships yet achieved the 3.6++. It comes down to fairness and raises the question of whether schools put vastly too much emphasis and scholorships on NMF. Many schools even offer a free ride to these kids regardless of whether they live up to these expectations or not.</p>
<p>“Many schools even offer a free ride to these kids regardless of whether they live up to these expectations or not”.
Well, in our experience, the schools that do offer full rides are rarely considered by these students. Are there any schools in the top 50 (USNWR) who do this? Top100?
Overall, I agree though. NMSF status is just one indicator - and should not be the basis of a full scholarship. Maybe a bonus or small scholarship…but that’s it. And really, I don’t think it gives you ANY kind of admissions boost at top schools. Certainly didn’t for my s who was rejected at his two top choices, with top grades and ECs. I remember some of the admissions folks telling us it didn’t mean much. They look much deeper…</p>
<p>Toneranger, I think that the very tippy top schools get more than enough NMF and similar others for it not to mean that much. However, for the lesser tiered schools, it does have a lot of meaning. For example, University of Florida and University of OKlahoma, among many others, give out nice scholarships to NMF and NMS.</p>
<p>taxguy, GPA scales at US universities are non-standardized, & outside of context are as meaningless as comparing a 4.0 at an underperforming public high school to a 3.5 at a very selective boarding school. College GPA’s vary by campus GPA policy, by individual professor’s grading policy, and definitely (as someone else said), by major.</p>
<p>Additionally, distribution requirements at college can affect GPA, particularly where those courses are quite challenging for the non-major & quite unforgiving in their grading. Like ellemenope’s D, other students of parents on CC might disappoint you as well – having earned grade-DEFLATED 4.0’s in their majors but equally grade-deflated 3.0’s in distribution requirements.</p>
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<p>How large a number? In what setting have you met them? </p>
<p>And how much money did they have? </p>
<p>Here’s a link to the 2007 National Merit Scholarship Corporation annual report: </p>
<p><a href=“http://www.nationalmerit.org/07_annual_report.pdf[/url]”>http://www.nationalmerit.org/07_annual_report.pdf</a></p>
<p>Epiphany, I can’t say you are wrong…but…</p>
<p>Most of the colleges that I have seen have their grading in such as way as to provide a sort of bell curve for the GPA for all their graduates. Thus, a certain percentage,which does vary by school, will graduate Cum Laude, Magna Cum Laude etc. If that percentage becomes too high, some schools will have grad deflation ( such as Princeton). </p>
<p>Kids that are NMF with top notch SAT should theoretically get at least a 3.5 in any major! Yes, I have certainly heard the argument that some majors are harder than others,which may have some some validity. However, I have found that each major tends to be difficult in their own way. Some may require a lot more math skills while some require a lot of strong writing skills and lots and lots of papers. They each have their challenges.</p>
<p>Again, since many colleges put such an emphasis on the NMF status, I am only questioning whether this status and scholarships are really worth it.</p>
<p>You are clearly not acquainted with the varieties of grading policies at many of the Elites, to which many NM <em>Finalists</em> (I don’t know about semifinalists separately) matriculate. There’s no forgiving “bell curve” at some of these. If anything, it’s quite the opposite. </p>
<p>Also ask newmassdad about U of Chicago’s grading standards. You seem not to have much information to give credibility to your speculations.</p>
<p>epiphany notes,“You seem not to have much information to give credibility to your speculations.”</p>
<p>Response: As I have stated, I can only base my specuation based on my experience,which is why I started the thread.</p>
<p>For example, among many, I know of one kid who got a full ride to ASU because he was a NMF. He promply met a girl in honors class and both did HORRIBLY.</p>
<p>At University of Cincinnati, my daughter’s roommate is dating a NMF who is lucky if he has a 3.2 overall.</p>
<p>A friend’s daughter got a full ride to University of Maimi and has about 3.0 GPA</p>
<p>Notice. I am not talking about Univeristy of Chicago, and schools of that caliber. </p>
<p>I can go on and on of people that I know who are in a similar situation.</p>
<p>taxguy:</p>
<p>if a college has a mean gpa of say, 3.3, then by definition, 49.99% of students are below that number. Thus, saying that a high scorer should be able to earn a “3.5 in any major is illogical”. Don’t forget, there are plenty of 2150-2200 scorers, but commended. And, of course, colleges have plenty of ACT folks who score 33+ but are ineligible for NM.</p>
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<p>Not just any major. And less likely so at a college in which a very high percentage of all students had the qualifications to be National Merit finalists. </p>
<p><a href=“http://www.nationalmerit.org/07_annual_report.pdf[/url]”>http://www.nationalmerit.org/07_annual_report.pdf</a></p>
<p>taxguy, if National Merit designation is, in fact, so worthless as a predictor of college performance (however you care to define it), why do some schools continue to offer scholarships to finalists? Are the schools being run by idiots?</p>
<p>In the absence of actual evidence to the contrary, I assume that good performance on this sort of standardized test is seen as useful for targeting a group of students that is MORE LIKELY to perform well in college (as measured in a variety of ways) than the general group of applicants a given college is likely to attract. That doesn’t mean there won’t be a spread in actual performance, but, on average, designated students are higher achievers. If schools start to find this assumption is not borne out, then they will stop offering the incentive.</p>
<p>Is this “fair” on an individual basis? Of course not; many very fine students will be paying more for the same opportunities as another student with natural test-taking smarts. But, if your goal is to make the world of university admissions and financing completely “fair” from the point of view of every individual student, you have quite a task ahead of you!</p>
<p>P.S. After more than three decades in/at/on a variety of university campuses, ranging from so-so publics to elite privates, and encompassing a variety of fields, nobody will convince me that there is not a very broad range of what constitutes a “good” gpa, or that gpa (in and of itself) is a useful measure of a successful college career, from the point of view of the student or the institution.</p>
<p>So, all we have is anecdotal evidence here…even the survey annual report encompassed only 80 students. Would be nice to see some tracking of a large group.
Tax Guy - I wonder if the school choices of these NMFs may be a clue. In our hs NMF group of about 30 kids, most went on to Ivies, Duke, Johns Hopkins and other top schools. My s went to his state U honors college and is doing great (only a $1000 one-time scholarship for NMF though). Very few took full rides (actually I don’t know anyone who did this).
So, if I’m go to University of Arizona or UCF, maybe I not shooting as high as I could or maybe I got rejected from other top Us because I wasn’t very well rounded. Sure, it may be the money, but I’m just wondering if this might be an indicator.<br>
Bottom line though, I agree that this is a somewhat bogus award that is given WAY too much significance by certain schools. When I find out someone is a an NMF, I think, hey “he or she is a good test taker,” not “he or she is brilliant.” I guess it’s an easy way for some schools (not top tier)to TRY to identify top students. I know there are some who pump themselves up by promoting how many NMFs they have.</p>
<p>You wonder if these “full ride” schools have been reading the research…
[SAT</a> I: A Faulty Instrument For Predicting College Success | FairTest](<a href=“http://www.fairtest.org/sat-i-faulty-instrument-predicting-college-success]SAT”>SAT I: A Faulty Instrument For Predicting College Success - Fairtest)</p>
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<p>I think that for most people who are NMFs, this is the BEST that they get. Most don’t even get a small bonus or one time scholarship. Just bragging rights…like winning the disco ball from dancing with the stars.</p>
<p>FairTest’s axe-grinding doesn’t convince me at all.</p>