Have you used a private admission consultant, if so what is your experience?

Parents Forum
81

I think of most college counseling work along the lines of a fancy restaurant chef’s work vs. home cooking. Many U.S.-educated parents have enough knowledge and skill to make dinner, but it would take them a ton of time and effort to approach what a professional makes with ease. Of course, many parents are not educated or U.S.-educated and don’t have the underlying knowledge or skills.

Helping my special circumstances clients is a lot harder. That’s like making a five-tier wedding cake covered in realistic flowers. Home cooks can’t do it, even with a recipe; you need years of experience to get it right.

82

Things are constantly changing in elite college admissions. Things you thought you knew, you don’t anymore. It’s helpful to have someone who has up to date knowledge on the ins and outs of what is College Admissions today. For many students, you only get one try to put the ball in the basket, so getting all the help you can in addition to your assigned college counselor is necessary when the stakes are high at getting admitted to the college that’s right for you.

83

We have hired a couple of ed consultants over the years for boarding school and college. My advice is not to hire one to get your dc into school, but one that will help your dc identify the right school and target the most realistic list. My son was a bit of a special case for college - very high scoring, mediocre grades and a disciplinary history. The consultant knew which schools were more open minded about such kids and would take a chance on a very bright late bloomer. She also talked him through how to present his story in essays (she did NOT write them), and then which college to choose once he was accepted (he got into 8 of the 11 he applied to, W/L at the other three). Unless you hire someone in 8th grade (and people do!) no consultant will “get your kid in”. It is (and should be!) up to your child. Bonus - I wasn’t involved at all except for facilitating visits.

84

I didn’t mean to suggest that people who use a maid service are lazy, nor do I think those who choose to use a consultant are lazy.

I maintain that this process is designed so that the students will be able to navigate this process themselves. Those that don’t get in on their own should not be made to feel as though they would have been successful had they used outside help. If everyone used a consultant, the elite schools would still reject 19 out of 20 applicants.

Perhaps you are giving too much credit to the consultants, or perhaps maybe just as likely, I am not giving them enough. The right answer for a given family will likely depend on their circumstances.

Perhaps because our approach worked out so well for us, I am not as concerned about the advantages that other parents give their children. Just like I didn’t care so much about test prep because my pups had perfect scores without it.

Even though my pups were very successful in getting into the right programs for them, without the use of consultants, I admit that we helped them out a lot, by visiting a LOT of elite colleges. We gave them the opportunity to attend the in-person information sessions at the admissions offices - including Stanford, Pomona, etc. (quite a hike for us on the East coast). Going on so many tours helped them get a good sense of how to present their own story. I would admit that even this was an advantage to them that many less fortunate students did not have.

I totally get that parents want to give their children every advantage they can. My perspective is undoubtedly affected by our experience.

85

Some people have more time than money, for others it’s the other way around. Paid consultants seem to me a good solution for those who would prefer to spend their (precious) free time eating dinner with the family, relaxing at home, or watching their kids’ baseball games on weekends. Yes, CC is a great free resource but you have to put in the time to educate yourself in all the nuances. Who am I to tell others, don’t pay someone, devote your evenings to CC?

86

I like @Hanna’s analogy but believe that for it to be true the private counselor has to start working in elementary school if not earlier. I’d think most PCs are dish arrangers not chefs. A customer may think an artfully arranged dish of the same thing tastes better or even think it’s something else, but potatoes cannot be arranged to look like beef steak. A skilled chef might be able to do so, but potatoes are no beef.

87

@Musicmom2015 What was the homerun essay topic that got your kid to Yale?

88

We used a college counselor junior and senior years because my parents hired one for my kids – they live in an affluent area and it’s what people do there. It’s not something I would have done on my own. I would say it was nice but not essential. The public school counselor met with kids once in the spring of junior year to go over lists and that was it. Plenty of kids wound up with unrealistic lists and were disappointed. Could we have come up with our own lists? Yes. D1 knew exactly what she wanted and developed her list mostly on her own anyway. It was nice to have the counselor for reassurance that she was on the right track. She wrote a supplemental essay for her EA Yale app that was very unconventional and then used it for her common app essay in the RD round. Counselor loved the essay (as did I) and affirmed that it was OK to use it for this.

D2 was much less sure about what she wanted and needed a lot of help with her list. Counselor worked with her on common app essay (it was very much her essay but I didn’t have to nag her about getting drafts done). Most supplements were not reviewed by the counselor as she didn’t start them till after Xmas!

Both kids did very well with admissions – but they were well-qualified.

I could see some situations where tensions between kid and parents are high where a counselor could act as a buffer in the process.

89

solid gold :slight_smile:

90

@3puppies And all of those visits to the elite colleges that you all were able to make, might not be possible, or seem necessary to others. We all make the best choices we can for our kids with the resources we have. I’m glad things worked out so well for your children! And I feel good too about the options that my daughter has. :slight_smile:

91

I’m no expert. I have one kid almost through with the process, and a freshman in high school who will allow us to go through this whole experience again! But what I’ve learned so far is that there are no guarantees for a particular school no matter what the situation, and that there is a lot we can learn and do to maximize our kids’ options and opportunities.

92

yes

93

no

94

@CaliMex The topic was really just telling a story about a meaningful HS memory. It’s hard to explain, but within a simple story he was able to share several important things about himself. I think it was the “voice” that just came through much better with this one. The consultant kept saying " show, don’t tell".

95

We did not use a consultant. I told my child to work on the practice SAT book every day over the summer and the scores were - let me just generalize - in the 90’s percentiles. Not the top but good enough and no retakes (just one SAT sitting). He wrote his essays by himself - I read them and corrected for any grammar mistakes but I did not…repeat DID NOT change the content. I’m sure there are lots of well crafted essays out there but when college admissions read them do they believe they were written by a 17 year old? I read his essays and I thought “yup, this was written by a 17 year old boy.” There were many times I questioned whether that was the right thing to do but in the end I believe in a teen being honest with their application and not be someone they are not…“just to get in”.

So the final piece her was that before applying, I had my son actually go to each campus in his top schools and meet face to face with professors in his prospective major.

Of ALL the things I did - this was truly the best decision. Every professor was MORE than happy to meet with him. But here’s the best part. He had a list of his favorite colleges, ranked. After meeting the PROFESSORS, his last place school became his first place school. I don’t know if any consultant will tell you that.

Lastly, he got into all schools he applied to. Cost of Consultants? zero. Cost of multiple SATs? zero. 2 of the colleges he applied to had >30,000 applicants? Did he have a hook? I don’t know. He did what I told him to do. “be yourself”. And we couldn’t be more thrilled with the outcome.

96

OP: “My thinking is that for public schools seniors counselors do not really offer much of advise or assistance.”

Hmm…so I’ll tell a story. My D goes to a relatively well resourced HS with a more than capable counseling staff. Yet, their jobs are, frankly, impossible. Each one of these counselors has to come up with about 90 compelling paragraphs on the group of kids that they are responsible for this year. How could they possibly do that? They do not really know all that much about these kids. Sure, they could write a paragraph about each one, but not a compelling paragraph. So, they do what every other counseling office does. They send out the “brag sheet,” and the parents fill it in and send it back. Now I wonder how much time and attention parents actually give to their responses. How many treat it like the college application essay that it really is? Because clearly what happens is that the counselor picks and chooses from what the parent has written, and then uses cut and paste to complete their form. Check the boxes and done. Next. The only question is, how hard are you going to make the process for the counselor? Well, I gave her 6 pages of well crafted stories and anecdotes about Kiddo figuring that surely something in there might be of use. And, indeed it was, because I see references to my stories coming back in parenthetical comments on admissions letters. So, parents have a job to do. And, no, you probably will not get a lot of advice from your counselor. But in my case, I sure did get a lot of assistance.

97

I haven’t read all the posts here, so forgive me if I’m repeating advice already given.

Do NOT hire a counselor for the purpose of getting your kid into a “top ten” school. If your kid is “top ten” material one of two things will be true, possibly both: Either they’re going to get in anyway, or they’re going to bloom where they’re planted. Either way, no need to hire a counselor.

That said, I can think of a number of solid reasons to hire a counselor.

  1. You simply don’t have the time to do the legwork online or in person to sort out the various options.
  2. You need someone else to play the heavy and/or guide your kid. (Kid won’t listen to you / too much tension / etc.)
  3. Your kid has very specific needs or requirements.

None of those applied in our case, so no counselor for us (and no SAT/ACT prep either, because kid wasn’t into that). I couldn’t be happier with how my kid’s story turned out. Not top ten, but that was never going to happen. But an excellent, great fit school and a happy, thriving kid.

THAT should be your goal, however you get there from here.

And read Frank Bruni’s piece.
https://nyti.ms/2jAYTIw

98

We did it without a college counselor. My oldest is a senior at Tufts and my middle daughter is a junior at Stanford. We knew that my middle daughter would be competitive for the top schools. She attended a public school and had her English teacher check her essay. Otherwise, she pretty much did everything herself. She applied to Yale EA and was accepted and then applied to Harvard, MIT, Princeton, Stanford and Northwestern (to see about merit money) and was accepted to all. We have no legacies and no ethnic pull. Her stats were exceptional and she showed an interest since 8th grade in math. All of her admit letters mentioned math. I think that if your kid is extremely strong, you don’t need a college counselor. If your child is academically talented and doesn’t have a hook, get a counselor. If your child has taken a practice ACT/SAT and the results could be better, spend the money on test prep. With this daughter, we knew she would score close to perfect on the SAT so we hired a tutor for five sessions and she nailed it with the tips - perfect score.

99

We briefly considered a college counselor, so I got online to start looking – and found College Confidential. The info I got here about navigating FA, when to get the testing out of the way, schools to consider, etc. were extremely valuable. We didn’t hire any test prep services, as we surmised from PSAT scores that S1 would be a one-and-done, and S2 worked with his dad on math and earned excellent scores as well. SAT practice at our house was making sure one could write an essay in 25 minutes (old version w/writing section), a brief review of grammar rules, and analysis of why an answer was incorrect. One of my kids took one practice SAT, then the real thing. The other took two practice tests and additional math sections. Took the SAT twice, only prepared for the first one, but the second score was higher. A college counselor will not work on testing – that’s a different provider and separate expense.

The advice to get the subject exams out of the way as soon as the student takes the corresponding class was very useful – senior year is too crazy a time to have to worry about testing.

My kids spent TONS of time on essays. They went through 10-12 drafts on the major essays. They talked to us a lot about what they wanted to say before they began writing. It was actually really pleasant as we reminisced about experiences they’d had. One of my kids wrote an essay while on a camping trip. 200 words, spontaneously written while he was cooking over a campfire, and he barely changed a word after we got home. It captured so much about him.

My advice is to pay attention to the short essays. Lots of kids blow them off, and they tend to be the very pieces that are most revealing (in both good ways and bad). If your school counselor offers the parents the opportunity to provide written comments about your child, DO IT. Write those things like they are college essays. You can give the counselor a great deal of insight, and they will include some of those comments in their recommendations. My kids were at public schools with overworked counselors, and they really appreciated being able to write helpful letters. It was easier than having to come up with something about a student they didn’t know well.

As for top ten schools…both of my kids got into at least one top ten. Both were waitlisted, and both had rejections. It was a crapshoot then (HS 2008 and 2010), and it’s even more so now. Not even Intel finalists get into every school to which they apply. A perfect SAT and perfect grades do NOT get one into an Ivy. It may make one qualified to attend, but tippy top schools are reaches for ALL applicants.

Talk to your student NOW about what your family can afford. Run the FA estimates on college websites. If you need to establish financial parameters, TELL your student what they are.

Most importantly, there are many fine schools that your student would be happy to attend. A couple reaches are fine, but focus on the target schools where your student has a reasonable shot at acceptance and where he/she would be happy attending. I don’t like to call these schools ‘matches’ or ‘safeties’ – I don’t care for the implied tone, and ‘target’ reinforces the idea that one should apply where one wants to be and where one has a reasonable chance of acceptance. My sons got into all of their targets – they focused their attention on those particular apps and essays, and it was clear they were good fits at those places. (I believe they didn’t get into some of their other schools because the admissions folks looked at their apps and said, “Oh, he belongs at XX, not here.”) Neither of my kids chose the top-ranked school from their list of acceptances – and that was fine. They were able to articulate the factors that went into their thinking, and they both put a lot of time into making the final decision. We were proud of their efforts.

100

It seems to me that there is a negative affect on the student, if he needs $25,000 worth of consulting to get into a college and some large percentage of students, who are first generation, minority, or talented,can get in on their own. I It does have a slight negative effect on some students, to know their parents are paying that much money to “get them in” to a “good” college. Maybe thats the problem. If parents stopped being so vested, and told kids that they can do this on their own, and let the dice fall, kids would not be so underconfident at the Ivy schools. They would not be so ultra competitive and maybe they would value others more.

My sons go to Case Western Reserve U, and Georgia Tech. They got to these schools on their own, no essay coaches helped them, and they took their exams once or twice and it all worked out. We had the younger kid proofread the essay for the older kid, and visa versa. The kid at Case got into all his grad school options and got an NSF three year award. I had nothing to do with that. As it should be.

Kids that get $25,000 worth of help, I feel sorry for them. I feel sorry that they did not have the chance to just try on their own, fail, pick themselves up, dust off and go to Case Western! Its been a great ride for my sons. They feel very confident on their campuses. They got there fair and square, without help from MOM, DAD or an expensive coach.
They know they can do anything, and they can. Younger son landed at a start up at age 18. He is doing great. Older will study theoretical biophysics at Cornell, UIUC or MIchigan next fall. The sky is the limit, and they got there on their own, for better or worse.

Yes, there were many rejects for each. Five total for older and two total, counting all the waitlists as rejects. We ignored all that and focused on ACCEPTANCES.