Hello! Advice needed for an Ivy. [NY resident, 90.65/1560, pre-med]

Applying to College
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You do have a microscopic chance (everyone has a microscopic chance), but in general, your dad is wrong. Since Covid began, the numbers of students submitting test scores has dramatically declined at top colleges. Those who do submit all have very high scores. Frankly, a high test score doesn’t help much these days, and it certainly won’t get you in on its own.

Only 60% of Cornell applicants submitted a score at all. 91% of submitters are high scorers. Those who aren’t are probably hooked: athletes, legacies, First Gen, URM, etc… It dilutes the significance of the score when all the scores are high.

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Does this mean your family has a complicated financial/income picture? Are your parents self employed or do they own a business?

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You are going to school. Not your parents.

If you want to be a doctor, where you go matters less than grades, MCAT, and other things. Bad mcat and Ivy = likely means no med school. Great MCAT and local public school may = med school. Same for gpa and other aspects.

And there are two Ivies in NY but not sure where you are located - but let’s say NYC there are other Ivies closer than that second one. Is two a lot ?

If a school fits you apply. Just because it’s an Ivy means little.

You can’t get in anywhere if you don’t apply but your odds, like others, may be 4-10%.

And are you sure your parents can afford $400k for undergrad plus another for med school.

Finally you say you want to study to be a doctor. That’s great but you won’t be doing so in college. You will extra curricularly but not academically. Pre med is advising, not a major.

Kids major in anything for pre med. there’s a current pre med on here majoring in English. That’s not doctor training.

It is good thinking about a job since most never apply or get into med school. Seems to me zillions of colleges are out there and zillions of kids are getting jobs.

Like all - find schools that interest you and you can afford. Maybe you get into Ivy but the odds are long. Edit seeing your gpa and others have mentioned - really long. Lots of schools out there would love a fine student like you - and pay big $$ to get you. What is your budget ??

Good luck.

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I will look into those, thank you.

Most of the parent-approved SUNYs are at least 1-hr away by car, or in Bing’s case, about four.

I have not yet used the financial aid calculators yet.

Well, my stronger suits are English and Math, not so much subjects like physics and chemistry, which I averaged around 86-87, and those really dragged my grade down.

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And will your med school chances of that continues in college.

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I might go into economics or business/management.

A little, I’m not too talented at anything.

No, these are counselors our schools have designated specially for college advice, but there are about 5 for a total of 1000 students.

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If I am first gen college student, would that help

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My dad said my aunt may be helping to pay for college, but I’m not too sure.

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Your list needs to begin with affordability.

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Yes you need a budget #. Check NPCs but there are schools like a U of Alabama that would bring your cost down to low 20s based on your stats.

But you might find private schools are even less depending on your family financial situation. Or SUNY through TAP.

You have a few mechanisms to affordability - merit aid which looks at your fine academic performance. Need aid which looks at family finances.

For the latter you need to run NPCs. Your parents may want something but it doesn’t mean the schools will concur.

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A 90 average is low for the Ivies, making all of them a reach for you.

(You will most likely get cannibalized or suicided by students from your school with higher GPAs who will be applying to the same schools).

As gen admission to NYU/Stonybrook a 90 Average is low (those averages are usually the threshold for EOP/HEOP students, which you will not be eligible for because of your SAT scores).

If you are truly low-income, I would recommend tossing an application to Questbridge now.

Are you on track to achieve an advanced regents diploma with mastery in mathematics and science? It would definitely help your application at UB, StonyBrook, Geneseo. Don’t sleep on Fredonia, which has a joint degree program

Because of the training that doctors receive in US medical schools, all medical schools are good schools and are hard to gain admission into. Everyone who graduates will be Dr.

You should definitely toss an application into Macauley’s honors program. Also, consider tossing an application to Sophie Davis.

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I am from NYC, but schools like Columbia are way too hard to get into. :smiling_face_with_tear:

My parents continuously press me to apply for schools that I am hesitant about due to the cost, since my parents are weird about paying.

I would like to try for Stony Brook since it’s more affordable.

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Family income is reported to be $40,000 a year. Seems to me that $20,000 per year for college costs could be way too much.

The OP needs to clarify what, if any, their low income family can contribute.

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Brown and Cornell are equally difficult. But there are plenty of colleges where you could be successful…,if affordability is able to be addressed.

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Good suggestion!

And also McCauley and Sophie Davis.

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My parents aren’t confirming whether or not they will help pay, so I would like an affordable college near NY.

I would like apply for SUNYs, since my status as a NY resident would help (I think).

I’m not sure I qualify for any merit aid, after reading all of these comments. My GPA might be too low :smiling_face_with_tear:.

I will try to ask for exact numbers when my parents are more responsive.

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Even with full Tap, the increase in Pell and a full student loan, there will still be some out of pocket money the family will have to come up with to commute at SUNY.

I would also put in a plug for the unspoken gem that is SUNY ESF; they are directly across the street from Upstate Medical Center and right next door to Syracuse (where you can take up to 15 credits there, while having access to their library).
They also have a joing degree premed program
https://www.esf.edu/academics/jointprograms/index.php

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Ahhh. Didn’t see the income.

Lots of meet needs schools out there - maybe an F&M or Denison type are possible but they’ll also factor in how much a student will cost - need aware.

Yes Op Needs SUNY and a few meets need schools on the easier admit spectrum. And perhaps a Hail Mary or two but they are unlikely - a W&L Johnson or SMU presidential.

Oh and good call @thumper1 on QB.

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I suppose that there is bad news and good news.

The bad news is that your GPA does seem low for an Ivy League university. The good news is that if you want to get accepted to a good medical school, as others have said it really doesn’t matter whether you attend an Ivy League university. There are hundreds of universities and colleges in the US that have very good premed programs.

I happen to know a couple of doctors. They have told me that the various students in their MD programs had gotten their bachelor’s degrees “all over the place” (this is an exact quote from one of them). I happen to know someone very well who got a different medical-related graduate degree (actually two master’s degrees) at Columbia, and she also reports that the various students in her program had gotten their bachelor’s degrees at a wide range of universities. My older daughter is currently getting her DVM in a highly ranked program, and again reports the same thing. I listened in (via zoom) to her welcome ceremony while they introduced the incoming students and said where they each had gotten their bachelor’s. Nearly every student had gotten their bachelor’s at a different university (there were a small number of repeats, but not many).

The fact that you already have some medical experience is a good start. You SAT score is also very good.

Premed classes will be quite difficult at any “top 100” and probably more like “top 200” university. The classes will be full of very strong students, there will be tons of homework, and exams will be tough.

Doing well in these tough classes will be important for acceptance to medical school. So will the experience that you get in a medical environment. So will your MCAT score (and if you have been able to get 1560 on the SAT, this suggests that you can do very well on tests). So will your references.

Medical school is expensive. Budgeting for a full 8 years of university is important. Avoiding or minimizing debt for your bachelor’s degree is important. Since you come from New York, you have the good fortune that you have multiple very good in-state public universities which should be relatively affordable for you.

Yes, it is very good and will prepare you very well for medical school. Also since it is in-state for you it might be relatively affordable (although how much aid you might get if you do get accepted to an Ivy League school will depend upon your family’s financial status).

Where you go to medical school and how you do in medical school will be way more important. Again, if you look at the top medical schools, or at any MD program in the US, you will find students who got their bachelor’s degree at a very wide variety of universities.

Educating your parents might be a difficult task. You might want to talk to your guidance counselor at school and see if they can help. However, I have seen many, many, many people attend “pretty good” universities for undergrad and then attend very highly ranked universities for graduate programs. I got my master’s degree at Stanford (which is not Ivy League, but which I think would impress even your parents) and the other students in the same program had gotten their bachelor’s degrees again at many, many different universities. With one exception I never did meet two students in the program who had gotten their bachelor’s at the same university, and the exception is not ranked in the top 50 in the US.

You can apply to a few Ivy League universities for undergrad and see how you do. However, Stonybrook, and the other SUNY’s, are very, very good for premed students and can set you up as a first step to do very well in life. Also, if Stonybrook ends up being less expensive compared to let’s say Brown or Columbia, then you might be better off getting a bachelor’s degree at Stonybrook and saving some money for medical school.

Also, when you go to a hospital, you will see a large number of medical professionals, and many of them will help you or me when we are patients. Most of these medical professionals are not doctors. They are still very important. You will not see some other medical professionals, such as the people who work in labs to analyze whatever samples they take from you, and the people who are doing biotech research which might lead to better treatments in the future. There are many good jobs that do not involve getting an MD, but which nonetheless can both lead to a good career and will help people. My younger daughter is doing biotech research and has been doing very well. If their effort succeeds (a big “if” in biotech research) they will help a LOT of people. There are a lot of options other than medical school. You are likely to get some sense of what some of these are when you are in university.

I think that you are doing very well. You do not need to attend an Ivy League school to continue to do very well.

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I am not sure what an advanced regents diploma is, but I have finished and passed all of my regents (alg1, geo, alg2, earth science, living env, global 1, global 2, us history, chemistry, physics) I was waivered for a lot though.

I will look into Fredonia, thank you.

I have looked into Macaulay’s and Sophie Davis, but the applications are not open and very little information can be found. I have emailed them, to which I have not received a reply, and am planning on visiting the campus in person to ask.

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