Help a Comp/Physics Major Choose!

College Majors Music Major
1

<p>Hi everyone.</p>

<p>I am hoping to major in musical composition and physics next year. Here's where I've been accepted:</p>

<p>Northwestern/Bienen School of Music</p>

<p>Bard College/Conservatory</p>

<p>Yale College</p>

<p>Columbia College - John Jay Scholar (not sure what this even means)</p>

<p>University of Washington</p>

<p>Rice/Shepard School of Music</p>

<p>Oberlin College/Conservatory.</p>

<p>I know UW is out of the picture, and I don't really want to go to Rice just because of its location. Right now, it's between Bard, Northwestern, Yale and Columbia.</p>

<p>Can anybody offer any insight? Composition is what I want to focus on most.</p>

2

<p>Money is no object?</p>

3

<p>Does it matter what degree or degrees you end up with and how long it takes? Bard and Northwestern would give you the BA in Physics plus a BM in Composition, likely taking at least five years. At Yale and Columbia, I believe you would get a single BA with a double major and it may be feasible to do in four years.&lt;/p>

<p>By the way, I have included your acceptances over at the <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/1427644-master-list-music-school-acceptances-fall-2013-a-35.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/1427644-master-list-music-school-acceptances-fall-2013-a-35.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Do you have a primary instrument, or voice? The availability of a good applied teacher may play into your decision.</p>

4

<p>Is Oberlin out? A double degree is possible there in 5 years, too.</p>

<p>Have you gone to websites and figured out how the curricula work, how many distribution requirements, how many courses in each major, and so on? Have you looked at course descriptions?</p>

<p>How easy is it to get pieces played at each school? (Though you can also make your own opportunities, as some have found, it is certainly easier to have musicians and concerts provided.)</p>

<p>Do you want a BM in composition or a BA, or does it matter? Are you open to a 5 year double degree or are you specifically looking for a school where you can double major?</p>

<p>[Double</a> Degrees | Peabody Conservatory](<a href=“http://www.peabody.jhu.edu/conservatory/admissions/tips/doubledegree.html]Double”>http://www.peabody.jhu.edu/conservatory/admissions/tips/doubledegree.html)</p>

<p>Do you want city or rural, east coast or midwest, large university or LAC, what kind of vibe do you want (have you visited?), do you want to play in ensembles or orchestra?</p>

<p>What kind of aesthetic appeals to you in composition, and how much do you know about the composition professors at each school? Have you listened to their music?</p>

<p>I guess we need to know more about you!</p>

5

<p>Great choices. Is the money the same at all of them, or does that matter? Is there a particular kind of physics you’re interested in pursuing? My guess from that list is Columbia University (that’s what you meant, yes - the college there?) is the strongest in physics. Bard’s physics department is very small but you’d get a lot of personal attention. And I’m sure you could create your own tutorials in any subject of interest. (My son is in his fourth year as a composer in the conservatory at Bard.)</p>

<p>What kind of music do you write? I.e. I’ve got to assume you’ve met the composition professors at all these schools or corresponded with them? Columbia is not oriented towards undergrads in their composition department - I’d say that one is strongest for physics weakest for composition (for undergrads.) </p>

<p>How much would you like your undergrad composition program to mimic a grad program, rather than undergrad. I.e. do you want a lot of freedom, or do you want a strict curriculum with series of required music classes? Some of the schools on your list offer one path, others the complete opposite. Do you want to work one on one with a professor your first year, or is a group class ok? (Oberlin.)</p>

<p>These are all good choices - you just get to worry about the details now.</p>

6

<p>Thanks for all the responses thus far.</p>

<p>I like larger cities. Obviously Columbia, Yale, Northwestern are all in close proximity to major ones. Bard is also close enough to NY city to drive there every once in a while on a weekend.</p>

<p>I write pretty experimental and modernist music. Angular rhythms and dissonant harmony is my bag for the most part, but I have also been experimenting with quartal harmony and minimalism in the last year, which isn’t nearly as weird as most other music I’ve written.</p>

<p>I would rather my undergrad program have a stricter curriculum with required classes rather than total independence and freedom. </p>

<p>Having my music played and not having every opportunity taken by grad students is a big, big deal for me. It seems as if Bard is strong here.</p>

<p>I’ll also say this - I thrive in weird environments. I go to an arts school and I do not think I could stand being around a majorly snooty demographic for four years. I know that Bard and Oberlin are known for being experimental and fostering the creativity of extremely interesting and diverse students, but I don’t know whether to buy into the “Ivy Leagues are snooty” stereotype. It seems as if a place like Columbia would inevitably be diverse. Yale, I have no idea about.</p>

<p>Thanks for the replies, keep em coming!</p>

7

<p>Your wants are right in there with Oberlin. While Cleveland is not NYC, it is only a 35 mile drive to downtown Cleveland and a few miles more to the arts district.</p>

8

<p>Again, have you explored the faculty, course listings, distribution requirements, and so on? Are you up for a 5 year degree?</p>

9

<p>Are Ivy League students “snooty”? All the schools you listed will have kids from upper middle class and there will be some “elite-mixing” that goes on. There was a great op-ed piece in the New York times about the Ivy League and marriage this past Sunday. But Ivy League schools also have somewhat larger endowments than smaller liberal arts schools and so they also often become schools of choice for extremely talented and bright kids from less well off backgrounds. Socially it is going to be up to you to find your people where ever you go. I suspect that you will at any of these schools. The hard part is figuring out how important the “Branding” is for you. Also how important is it for you to have mentors. One thing about the ivy league is that advising and mentorship is often quite poor compared to smaller liberal arts schools that are focused more on undergraduates.</p>

<p>BTW, as far as physics, depending on what particular field of physics you are thinking of University of Washington might actually have the strongest faculty and provide the most cutting edge research opportunities. They are a top university when it comes to physics, cosmology, computer science and math. But UofW is a state school and the population will be more diverse. If physics/math is your passion Bard might be limiting. They are probably the weakest of the schools you listed in that field and it might be challenging once you get to taking 300 level courses to find courses that you want to take. Some small liberal arts schools have joint agreements with larger schools that are nearby for students who run into this problem. But often trying to arrange your schedule to do that is tricky because of timing problems. Also if you are interested in going on in the sciences and applying to graduate school one of the most important things is for you to get research experience. The professors at Bard might not be actively researching, and that would be limiting. </p>

<p>I do not know Oberlin’s math, CS, physics faculty but you might want to look into whether they are actively doing research or not. If you are not planning on going on in graduate school in physics then that might not be a problem. If you are and you attend a school like Oberlin or Bard then you will need to be prepared to spend your summer doing something like an NSF REU to get research experience.</p>

10

<p>I can tell you that at Yale there are plenty of opportunities to have your music played, although it helps if you’re entrepreneurial. My son liked the composition faculty very much. A double major will be difficult but doable. Your problem will be that a science major will require labs, which are very time-consuming. At Yale, a music major will consume 12 to 14 of your total 36 credits (depending on whether you place out of some prereqs). You can look up the physics major, but it’s probably similar, if not more.</p>

11

<p>Yes, it goes without saying that Bard’s physics department is going to be smaller and more limited than your other choices. However, if it is anything like other departments at Bard, is most likely to have some exceptional professors,</p>

<p>Regarding composition for conservatory students - I asked a current composition student to reply for me (not my son) and this is what he said:</p>

<p>“If a strict curriculum is the most important thing for you, Bard doesn’t really have it. However, you have all the tools you need to learn everything you want at Bard. In a very real way, the people who thrive the most at Bard are the ones who have ideas, initiative, goals, and the work ethic to chase them. You can learn what you want and have your education your way, but ONLY if you ask. There’s no sort of imperative to conform to some singular artistic vein at Bard — your aesthetic is your own and the faculty will help you ask the right questions of yourself to grow in the terms of your own ideas and profile.”</p>

12

<p>What did you decide? I know dual majors at Northwestern who are very happy, but they are chemistry and voice (not physics and comp). Hope to hear.</p>

13

<p>My S is a double major at Yale, music and computer science. It’s doable, although there is not much room in the schedule for electives. He loves it there. He had a difficult decision when college acceptances rolled in, as you do. In the end, he felt Yale was an experience he didn’t want to turn down. Are you going to Bulldog Days or any accepted student days for any of the other colleges? That might help give you a feel of which is the best fit for you.</p>

14

<p>I think that mentoring at Ivies can be exceptional, especially in a smaller department like music.</p>

<p>It sounds to me like Oberlin and Bard might be out because they are more rural, though Cleveland and NYC are not far away. I do know one student, who graduated two years ago, who went to Bard instead of Columbia for biology and music composition, and she was very happy. While we visited Oberlin, the tour guide surprised us by describing the strength of sciences there. I really hope you will research the details of academics at these schools. </p>

<p>Hunt knows a lot about Yale’s composition because, as mentioned, Hunt’s son goes there. I cannot think of any parent who has been on here with a son or daughter at Columbia for composition, but I do know the grad program is excellent. Manhattan School of Music is right across the street, and Juilliard easy to get to as well. Many students interested in composition go to Yale and, of course, physics would be excellent there. NYC is not too far, but essentially the same kind of trip to a city that Oberlin and Bard would involve to their respective cities.</p>

<p>If you want a really strong “alternative” or artsy vibe, then Oberlin and Bard would certainly appeal. Have you visited? Sometimes just sitting somewhere and observing, whether a green or a dining hall or a bookstore, helps. And attending concerts of student composers if at all possible. Yale is considered an artsy Ivy.</p>

<p>Ivies tend to be very diverse in every way. There is no way they could or should be characterized as “snooty.” They are different than small liberal arts colleges in many ways: for instance, grad students often teach sections that accompany professors’ lectures. Financial aid is strong and brings in some students from less well-off backgrounds but there are also students of wealth. It’s a mixed bag and you can find “your people.” The house system at Yale has a lot of advantages: I don’t know what Columbia does in this regard.</p>

<p>Yale has considerable distribution requirements. I haven’t checked Columbia. Make sure that the two areas of study that you want to do, fit in a 4 year schedule if that is what you want to do. Alternatively, both Bard and Oberlin offer 5 year double degrees.</p>

<p>This is a huge decision. You have done very very well with your acceptances. I am sure you are putting in a lot of time researching these schools and wish you luck with your decision.</p>

<p>My computer is dying or I would look up Columbia to see how it does things for undergrads. Right now I will be lucky if anything happens when I press “submit”! Good luck!</p>

15

<p>Columbia has even more considerable distribution requirements. I looked into both Yale and Columbia during my search; Yale’s undergrads in composition are somewhat sealed off from the School of Music, and you’ll be working with a different set of faculty and will have your pieces on a different set of concerts (on the other hand, undergrads have ensembles hired for them regularly). However, there is an established undergrad composition program. When I looked into Columbia, I got a feeling that their program is in a peculiar state of transition and that it is much more geared towards grad students (though composition lessons are always with faculty, which I can’t say about a certain place I’m considering); I don’t know how performances work though it seems that they’re geared more towards the grad program.</p>