<p>I saw a thread for Berkeley or Penn, and I wanted to get some advice as well.</p>
<p>I was accepted into Cornell University’s ILR school to major in Industrial and Labor relations and to Penn’s CAS to major in International Relations.</p>
<p>I do not live in the mainland United States; I live in Guam. I have no preference for weather or distance from home. Financial aid is important, and I am still waiting for Cornell’s packet. (Penn gave me about $22,500 in grants) I am mainly concerned about which college has the best program for me if I wish to attend law school after my undergrad.</p>
<p>My parents would like me to attend Cornell University because of the campus and because my sister went to Cornell. I just want to get the best education suited for a future career in law.</p>
<p>Will someone please give me some sound advice as to how I should approach my decisions?</p>
<p>Both schools would offer you an equally great education and a solid foundation for Law School. International Relations is more common as a pre-law major than industrial and labor relations, but Law schools accept strong candidates regardless of their major as long as their choice of courses reflects their ability to think critically and to read and write well. You may want to check the websites of the top-law schools and what their admission representatives say about the best preparation (Harvard, Yale, Columbia, Penn, Stanford, NYU and UChicago are currently the top-ranked law schools). Most of these websites also give you a breakdown of the no. of different undergraduate majors represented in each class and some provide lists the different undergrad institutions represented.
You should obviously wait for Cornell's financial aid package before making any kind of decision. I do not know much about Cornell's ILR--can you take a sufficient no. of classes in Cornell's CAS? A broad liberal-arts education is generally the most preferred by Law schools, which you would undoubtedly get at Penn's CAS. Penn's CAS also provides you with the option of submatriculating into their Law school in your junior year if your GPA is good enough and have taken the right combinations of classes.</p>
<p>From the Penn website, about their BA/JD program:
This rigorous program is for the highly qualified and motivated student. Applicants must be committed to the study of law in its theoretical and practical aspects and accept the challenge of combining the broad overview of undergraduate studies with the specific professional focus of law school.</p>
<p>Requirements and Application
Students will apply to the Law School for admission to this program in the fall semester of their junior year. First, they must meet with Dr. Hocine Fetni in the College for a review of their record and academic achievements and their outstanding requirements for the BA. It is expected that prospective applicants to this program will have fulfilled the general requirements for the BA and most---if not all---of the degree requirements by their junior year. Following matriculation to the Law School, four College courses (400-level or above) must be taken and will be counted toward both the BA and the JD. These courses must be approved by a Law School advisor. The College committee in charge of this program will develop a non-exclusive list of sample courses for consideration with advisors. Courses should be chosen carefully in order to contribute to the joint study of liberal arts and sciences and the law.</p>
<p>For those students still needing to fulfill College requirements after matriculating to the Law School, up to four Law School courses could be counted toward the BA, either as free electives (as long as the student has taken a total of sixteen elective College courses) or as major-related courses (as approved by the major advisor).</p>
<p>No more than 8 courses in all can be counted toward both degrees.</p>
<p>A prospective applicant should have a GPA of 3.4 or above to apply. Those who do not meet the GPA requirement and would like the possibility of obtaining a waiver of the GPA requirement, can submit in writing a waiver petition to Mr. Derek Meeker, JD, Dean of Admissions at the Law School. The Law School will make the determination as to whether a waiver from the GPA requirement will be granted. The student who has the required GPA or the waiver of the GPA requirement will be asked to submit an application, including an essay explaining the relationship between his or her experience in the College and the study of law, to a College committee (appointed by the Dean of the College). The Law School Admissions Committee will select candidates once they have been approved by this College committee. The application to the Law School should include a proposed plan of study developed in consultation with the College advisor. LSAT scores are required; therefore, the LSAT should be taken no later than the fall semester of the junior year. Although the Law School makes the final decision about acceptance into the submatriculation program, the student's application must also be approved by the College committee. Inquiries about the JD requirements should be addressed to Mr. Derek Meeker, J.D., Dean of Admissions at the Law School.</p>
<p>The BA degree will be awarded when the requirements of a standard College program are satisfied. Students must satisfy all the requirements for the JD during their fourth, fifth, and sixth years of study.</p>
<p>I am a current student at Penn's CAS, and am also considering the option of Law School later. If you have any questions about Penn in specific feel free to ask me.</p>
<p>Here is the link for the no. of students undergraduate institutions represented at Harvard Law 2006:
<a href="http://www.law.harvard.edu/admissions/jd/colleges.php%5B/url%5D">http://www.law.harvard.edu/admissions/jd/colleges.php</a></p>
<p>Cornell and Penn both faired well.
Cornell 45
Penn 57</p>
<p>Some feeder schools are more equal than others....</p>
<p>Thanks snooker1!</p>
<p>My Penn interview told me about submatriculation, but I didn't know I could do so for Penn Law.</p>
<p>I am still waiting for Cornell's financial aid package, but I am really leaning towards Penn right now.</p>
<p>I'm not sure if I can take classes in CAS at Cornell, but according to the ILR website, "The School of Industrial and Labor Relations (ILR) will provide you with a strong, liberal arts-based education built on a foundation of study in economics, sociology, psychology, history, law, and statistics. From there, you'll develop your special interests in management, law, collective bargaining, dispute resolution, employee relations, labor unions, labor economics, public policy, organizational behavior, and international labor issues or other related fields."</p>
<p>Once again, thank you very much for your help. It is greatly appreciated.</p>
<p>If I decide to attend Penn, I will have to thank you once more for taking the time to inform me more about Penn.</p>
<p>the school's website is the last website you want to trust.</p>
<p>Come to Penn. The IR degree will be a challenge--I do not deny that. But Penn's connections and prestige will make the degree worth it. Period.</p>
<p>No problem! Let me know what you finally decide on, although I'm sure Penn would be great for you!</p>
<p>Just so you know, you asked on the Penn forum. You were bound to get many more people telling you Penn than Cornell here.</p>
<p>Yeah, I figured that people would be trying to convince me to go to Penn. However, I just really wanted more insight on Penn because I know more about Cornell than Penn, mainly because my sister went to Cornell.</p>
<p>Anyway, I just wanted to post that I got my financial aid package from Cornell, and it's $5k more than Penn's. My parents can even afford to pay off on their own, without loans, the rest of the cost to attend Cornell.</p>
<p>Penn=$22k grants, $17k EFC, $10k self-help
Cornell=$27k grants, $16k EFC, $5k self-help (self-help not necessary)</p>
<p>snooker1, I learned that I can also take classes in CAS at Cornell. I also learned that the first few semesters at Cornell are liberal arts based.</p>
<p>Penn's a great university, and I would like to attend, but I would have to take out loans to pay for it. In addition, I would have to take out more loans to attend law school. I don't know if I should politely ask for more aid from Penn because $22k is a large amount, just not as large as Cornell's aid.</p>
<p>Any advice?</p>
<p>aurieme, go for it. tell them exactly what you've written here. that you would really like to come to penn, but that that extra $5000 would make a huge difference for your parents and you, because it means that they wouldn't have to take out loans.</p>
<p>aurieme use your offer of financial aid from cornell as a bargaining chip for Penn.</p>
<p>Last year a kid used his offers of aid from Brown and Dartmouth to get Penn to match, and sure enough he is here now.</p>
<p>Penn works hard to increase their yield, and will likely match your offer. Penn has more money for financial aid than Cornell, after all.</p>
<p>Penn will never lose a child to Cornell. Maybe HYP because they're insanely rich, but never Cornell or all places.</p>
<p>Penn will, but only because people are dumb.</p>
<p>Fine, Penn will never lose a child due to financial issues to Cornell. Penn can't end stupidity in America, but it can try.</p>
<p>So, despite my parents pushing me to just go to Cornell because of the aid and the seclusion and safety of the campus, I am willing to try and ask for $5k more in aid from Penn.</p>
<p>Question: How do I do that? Do I email the financial aid office? Should I mail the financial aid office? Or should I just call them up? (I live in Guam, and I know that unless I spend $14 in express mail, a written letter might not reach Penn within a week.) Oh, and should I say that if I do get an extra $5k in grants I will certainly attend Penn?</p>
<p>I guess this makes Penn my top choice.</p>
<p>Thanks for the help! I really do hope that Penn matches Cornell's offer. It is supposed to be one of the most giving universities, in terrms of financial aid, in the nation.</p>
<p>If a phone call isn't too expensive (I really have no idea about international calls fro Guam) it would probably be best to call them up and talk to a human being and see what you need to do to appeal an aid offer. My dad has called them about my aid and they've been pretty helpful. It's definitely worth trying to have Penn match your Cornell aid. Good luck</p>
<p>Hey guys!It's me, your friend dulce!
I'm going to Cornell. I'm here for Cornell Days and loving it! Cornell is the place for me!~
I hate Penn and I'm glad they rejected me after the deferral!</p>
<p>Cornell must be great if you're spending your time there chatting on collegeconfidential instead of, you know...with people.</p>
<p>To all newcomers and psych majors, I encourage you to search the archives and discover the perfect case study of confirmation bias that is dulce's life.</p>