<p>So we had a class discussion today in AP English, as we do quite often - and our class discussions are graded... I really do hate discussions, and for the first two discussions of the quarter, I didn't speak, and ended up with a 5/10 for both (and thus this pulled my grade down.)</p>
<p>I told myself that I was going to get over my fear of public speaking as well as my discontent for two individuals who dominate discussions and just speak. So for the third discussion, I spoke four times, and got a 10/10... </p>
<p>...Today we had another discussion... and it was a big one, and the head of the English Department was there watching... I made a few good points in the beginning, and then I made somewhat of a more complicated and muddled remark which contrasted the Soviet Union and Rome (Don't ask how) and well, one of the more aggressive "discussers" decided to respond by tearing apart my argument bit by bit.</p>
<p>Like - I'm just trying to get a good grade man. We aren't graded on how we take down other arguments... its literally just how many times we raise our hand. I feel really embarrassed and ashamed now... and people are trying to console me saying that the guy who did it always does it to everyone... but still... I'm incredibly angry at him, nonetheless.</p>
<p>Your AP English class seems cool, nobody cares about discussion in our class. But honestly, just me, I would DESTROY his next argument, retribution is fun :)</p>
<p>This guy sounds a lot like what I’ve did in my AP Lang class. Just thoroughly tear apart his arguments and point to him why he is wrong. From my experience, teachers love when students get engaged in heated arguments, especially if you’ve researched the topic beforehand and bring out-of-classroom experiences and knowledge in your debate.</p>
<p>That is how my AP Lang class was ran also and we had two people just like that. Due to the fact that they never let anyone else talk other peoples’ grades suffered. I would just try to forget it and remember that everyone else has probably forgotten it.</p>
<p>I HATE it when a couple of people monopolize the discussion like that. Yes, debate is good, but I think in the interest of manners you should be respectful and acknowledge a person’s stronger points when you rebut them. It sounds like this person was just trying to humiliate you to impress the teacher.</p>
<p>There’s really nothing you can do, though. If they had strong points, you just have to let it go and prepare a stronger argument next time.</p>
<p>Yeah, you just have to let that go and keep up your new habit of participation. </p>
<p>It is WAY easier to counter-point than to make a well-constructed argument. A lot of thought goes into building a case, and almost no though goes into seeing a loose thread and pulling at it. If all your teacher is paying attention to is quantity of participation (not quality) then that really sucks. If all he’s doing is tearing you down then he’s getting marks for almost nothing.</p>
<p>If he does this again then maybe see if you can try to turn it around on him. Acknowledge that he’s pointed out and important weak point (even if you don’t think he has) and ask him to explain how he would fix it. If he can’t come up with something good on the spot; yay. If he can, then you still got to look engaged in the discussion for your teacher.</p>
<p>The grading system doesn’t sound like the best method for generating a great discussion, but what can you do… Unfortunately, you’ll encounter this plenty of times in college as well, so might as well get used to it now. </p>
<p>Going into the discussion, have two or three points ready to make that you have already thought out. Posing a question is also a great way to keep the discussion moving, as is reflecting on someone’s comments. </p>
<p>If you’re nervous or uncomfortable, just remember that you are judging yourself WAY more than anyone is judging you. Would you actually think less of a classmate if they didn’t make a perfectly insightful remark on a graded class discussion? Neither would anyone else. </p>
<p>Better get used to this cause it’s how it goes in college. You won’t get points for just blurting things out but for the substance. Responding to what someone says is totally legit, although it should be done respectfully. Then you have a chance to reply “No you’re wrong or misunderstood me because…” Fear of public speaking often makes what we say come across as nonsense. Likewise if you’re not prepared. It may help to think ahead and write some ideas before so you can rely on that. </p>
<p>You get over it however possible and try again next time. I’m guessing anger won’t accomplish that. “In 100 years who’s gonna care” works for me at times. Truthfully no one will care in even 10 days. Or “I’m only with these people 4 hours a week, so it doesn’t matter how foolish i look.”</p>
<p>@kypdurron - I contrasted Rome and the Soviet Union by basically stating that Rome’s collapse was due to the philosophy of Huxley’s Brave New World, where pleasure and irrelevancy are the source of our ultimate decline, while the Soviet Union’s collapse was due to the Orwellian belief of external pressure and what we hate, not what we love, destroying us. - LOL. </p>
<p>UPDATE: We had another discussion today - he wasn’t in my “circle”, so he didn’t actually get the chance to shoot down anything I said. I made about five valid points, which quite a few people voiced agreement with. :)</p>
<p>Orwell’s books directly addressed Soviet-style government, and said nothing close to that they would collapse. His thesis was the opposite: that human nature corrupts liberal governments into tyrannies, not that tyrannies are destroyed by “what we hate.” The kid was right to dispute your argument.</p>
<p>this is how i used to feel in class discussions and debates but honestly, the only way i got over it was by being just as aggressive as some of those kids.</p>
<p>@JimboSteve - LOL, what we hate will destroy us is the Orwellian view, and if you don’t agree with this, then fine - this is literally what was written on the board by my English teacher, but hey, maybe I should believe some random person on the interwebz instead of my teacher… </p>
<p>What we love will destroy us is the Huxleyan view. I understand the cyclical nature of communism - no need to explain it to me. I find it difficult to understand why you’re justifying the kid’s argument when you actually haven’t heard their argument… you’re just assuming it correlates with yours… and it doesn’t. LOL, so hush.</p>
<p>Is this thread about the substance of my argument or the issue of impoliteness and abrasiveness during class discussion? Anyone has the right to dispute any argument, regardless. It’s called having an opinion, congrats, you figured it out. I have an issue when this opinion is said with the intent of being insulting, merely to impress a teacher or to boost a grade. Please stay on topic.</p>
<p>Don’t get up in arms about it. Realize that sometimes, you really just will not be quite as good as someone else, and that sometimes, other people will criticize you. Perhaps harshly.</p>
<p>Getting torn up over it is really not pragmatic. Learn from it. If you’re graded by discussion, then get out there and discuss. Your classmate has clearly done so and deserves the grade that they got. If they weren’t personally attacking you and insulting you, then they were doing the assignment correctly. You were too, but you’re getting unreasonably upset that someone was doing their job.</p>