Help my son make a college list

College Search & Selection
1

I’ve been reading the CC forums for a couple years, and finally my son is a rising senior and we have to make a college list!

His stats:

GPA: 4.0 unweighted
AP: 7 completed, 4 more in senior year
ACT: 34
SAT subject: just took Math 2 and Biology, no scores yet
EC: two varsity sports, executive positions on NHS, NMHS, NSHS, FBLA, Computer Club,
Volunteering: 100+ hours on youth sports coaching, community, relay for life, etc.

He hasn’t decided on a major, but definitely wants something in the STEM fields, probably Computer Science or Computer Engineering. Big disadvantage point: Asian Male who wants to major in STEM :frowning:

We probably won’t qualify for financial aid, so merit scholarship is the only way he can get any tuition discount.

We live in Washington State, so University of Washington is the default option. UW has great reputation in STEM fields, especially CSE, and in-state tuition is hard to beat. So all other colleges will be compared to UW for feasibility. He also prefers west coast to east coast or Midwest due to proximity to home.

Current list:

Reach schools:
UC Berkeley, MIT, CMU, Stanford, Cornell (the big 5 for Computer Science)
Rice
U Southern California

Match schools:
UW
Case Western?
RPI?

Safety + potential Merit
Santa Clara
Cal Poly
UT Dallas?
IIT?
WPI?

Is there any LAC with good CS programs and offer merit aid?

Any help to expand or narrow down the selections are appreciated!

2

Might want to add/consider:

Reach: Carnegie Mellon (SCS)

Match: University of Texas Austin (Turing Scholar program)

My son had a very similar list this time last year. Good luck!

3

Did he take the PSAT and does he have a chance for National Merit?

4

So you are OK without merit at your reaches and matches? You would full pay at UCB? CWR?

5

Have you considered UBC in Vancouver? With the current exchange rate, even full pay may be worth considering. I’m not sure about merit options for international students.

6

@Rivet2000 Does UT Austin give merit to OOS? Where did your son get admitted and ultimately decide to attend?

@Dolemite He took PSAT but didn’t do very well, so probably no chance for National Merit.

@Sybylla For the reaches, probably full pay … is it worth it? For CWR and RPI, hopefully they can give merit to lower tuition to in-state UW level. Is that realistic?

@ShrimpBurrito Good idea. I’ll check into UBC.

7

Cal Poly SLO or Cal Poly Pomona. Cal Poly Pomona would be a safety school but SLO would be a Reach with an 8% acceptance rate for CS majors. Also both Cal Poly’s give no merit aid.

8

Couple of thoughts:

Harvey Mudd College should be considered; it is an LAC with a stellar CS program and offers merit aid

Keep in mind that an elite-caliber college is not necessary to get a great CS education. A question to consider is to think about what the goals are after graduation.

  • Do your son see himself as an employee…working as a software engineer at a Fortune 500 company? Great - get a CS education as inexpensively as you can…zero debt if possible.
  • Does your son want to create the next instagram/facebook/twitter? Then you may want to consider a school where you’ll interact with a higher density of like-minded students, entrepreneurial professors, and venture capital firms (e.g. Stanford, Harvard, Carnegie Mellon, et. al.). Example: https://www.entrepreneur.com/article/236912

Finally, you might find this thread interesting as a starting point for more exhaustive analysis: http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/math-computer-science-majors/1814245-computer-science-at-some-smaller-schools-including-liberal-arts-colleges-p1.html

Good luck!

9

Cal Poly does not offer merit awards. If he is concerned about proximity and time getting to and from school, be sure to check the flights going to San Luis Obispo. I’m almost certain he’d have to change planes at least once.

Rice offers some large, very competitive merit awards. Flights from Houston are easy with two major airports.

UT Dallas has lots of new classrooms and housing. Some people complain though that the worst part about the school is dealing with all of the construction. There are plenty of non-stop flights from DFW airport to Washington state, and there is one non-stop at Love Field (Southwest Airlines) going to and from Seattle per day.

10

Harvey Mudd is a reachy reach.

Trying to stay as west as possible, Minnesota has a good CS program and a solid match. IU, MSU, Iowa all possibilities with good CS programs for UG.

11

University of Washington should be considered a reach for direct admission to the CS major. Most CS applicants are admitted as undeclared, and must face another competitive admission process to get into the CS major based on college grades and application essays.

https://www.cs.washington.edu/prospective_students/undergrad/admissions
https://www.engr.washington.edu/current/admissions/admitstats

12

UT Austin consumes most of its admission spots with automatic admission for top 7% rank Texas applicants. So it should be considered a reach for everyone else who must compete for the few remaining spots. In addition, CS is an additionally competitive major, and Turing Scholars is presumably more competitive than just the CS major.

13

UCB has two ways to study CS:

  • EECS in the College of Engineering: would be direct admit, but is one of the most competitive majors to get admitted to.
  • CS in the College of Letters and Science (L&S CS): apply to L&S, but if enrolled will be undeclared, and must earn a 3.3 GPA in CS prerequisites to enter the L&S CS major.
14

Would other Washington public universities (e.g. WWU, WSU) be suitable as possible match or safety schools?

15

Northeastern would be a good option - he would be up for 20-30K merit possibly, good CS and engineering.

16

Sounds like Cal Poly should be kicked out – no merit, hard to get in, no brand name, hard to travel to, and OOS tuition.

Aren’t all state flagships, such as UT Austin, UIUC, and Georgia Tech, easy to get in as in-state but hard to get in as OOS? Also, the experience is probably similar too – huge classes, no professor interaction, hard to register class, etc. I hesitate to add any of these.

Harvey Mudd is a reach, but two people of his HS seniors got admitted, which means at least Harvey Mudd knows about his school.

Northeastern sounds interesting and we should take a look.

17

Some state flagships, like UCB, are hard to get in for both resident and non-resident applicants. Others, like Mississippi, are quite easy to get in for resident applicants and only marginally less easy to get in for non-resident applicants.

As noted above, the CS major may be more difficult to get into than the school generally.

Northeastern is one of the schools where the curriculum is built around co-ops (others are Drexel and Cincinnati). A typical co-op plan at these schools involves four academic years’ worth of course work distributed over five years, with co-op employment for periods longer than a summer interspersed.

Formalized co-ops are often optional at other schools, particularly for engineering or CS majors. Even in the absence of a formalized co-op program, many schools do have relatively easy withdrawal and readmission processes so that a student can take a semester or quarter off (plus the summer) for an employment period longer than a summer.

18

UW sets a high bar. However, if he does not get direct admit for CS, maybe consider the following?

ASU/Barrett Honors. With his stats, he should get some merit, maybe bringing it to in state rates.

U of New Mexico as a safety? Not sure about CS acceptance rates but his stats would get him in-state tuition at a minimum and possibly a full tuition merit scholarship. There is a full ride scholarship (Regents) through separate application; it is highly competitive.

Case Western as a match/low reach - my D applied last year and the top merit award was around 31K, I believe. That would bring the COA to the low 30s. We were really impressed with the school - it ended up being her #2 choice. There are also some full tuition awards by separate application. Demonstrated interest is important.

Have you looked at the schools on the WUE (Western Undergraduate Exchange) list? There are few (none?) of the caliber of UW but some of the better Colorado schools are represented there.

Finally, Colorado School of Mines offers merit awards. I believe there is an earlier deadline to apply for them; check the website.

19

The UW Allen School of CSE website states:



“Students who are not directly admitted to one of our majors as freshmen can complete the prerequisites and apply through our regular admission program. This takes most students approximately one year to complete and includes three academic quarters of calculus, our introductory programming courses, English composition, and an approved science course. Our regular admission acceptance rate in the most recent year was 40%. Regular admission candidates are evaluated based on a combination of college grades and personal statements; Washington state residency may also be a factor in admissions as we strive to fulfill our mission as the state’s flagship public university.”



The website also notes that direct admits “had an average unweighted GPA of 3.97; average test scores of ACT 34, SAT Math 764, and SAT Verbal 758; took a rigorous high school curriculum; provided evidence of meaningful extracurricular activities; submitted strong personal statements; and were mostly Washington residents.”



A few months ago, the Seattle Times reported:



"This year, direct admission will be offered to 150 students. All but five of them are Washington residents.

**

"Although computer science and engineering is a tough program to get into, the picture is getting better. In 2016, 43 percent of bachelor’s applicants were admitted to the program. In previous years, the admission rate was lower.



“[The CSE Department] is now enrolling about 370 new undergraduate students each year, double the number it was able to accommodate in 2012… This year, it is asking for $6 million from the Legislature to increase the number of students it graduates by 120 degrees per year. Most of that increase would be in bachelors degrees, Lazowska said.”



The UW’s 2016 ASEE online profile shows a middle 50% ACT range of 27-33 for enrolled students in the College of Engineering (this included all enrolled pre-engineering and direct admit students in engineering and CS).



This student is on track for direct admission to UW’s CS major. However, if he is not directly admitted, his outstanding academic record indicates that it should not be difficult for him to remain in the top 40-45% of students who are admitted to the CS major by regular admission.

20

How about Reed, Northwestern and Caltech. Obviously, Caltech is the same as MIT, but you can replace it with MIT on the reach list as he is more interested in the West Coast.

I will also shamelessly plug U of Chicago. Chicago has been a raising star in the recent years, it has a small CS department, but increased its enrollment 3 folds (to about 80) recently. I haven’t seen any one graduated from that department not got into the major companies. Many went to Amazon in Seattle.