Help with a college list for my son, a challenging case?

Parents Forum
1

<p>He doesn’t have strict criteria for what he wants in a college. He says he’ll know it when he sees it and his current favorites are Columbia, Rice and George Washington University. He’s a laid-back type.</p>

<p>He has high test scores and relatively low grades.</p>

<p>He’s willing to go almost anywhere in the country, but he prefers to be either in or within one hour of a major city. We’re in NY. He has not chosen a major, but is interested in international studies, history, geography, economics and several other areas. Hasn’t completely ruled out a science major.</p>

<p>I’m interested in colleges that offer merit aid possibilities, not necessarily full tuition but something to offset costs. (I realize that some schools on his list will not offer any merit.) We will not qualify for FA. Also, I think 2,000-10,000 students would be a good size for him.</p>

<p>His GC says he would probably fit into many types of colleges, something with which I tend to agree.</p>

<p>ACT: 34
NMSF & NHRP Scholar
SAT: 1440/1600, will retake in November and I expect a higher score
SAT subject: 800 World History, 680 Chem (plans to take 3 this month, US History, Math 2 & retake Chem)
AP Scholar with Honor: 5’s in APUSH, Chem, Env Sci, 4 in World History
GPA: 3.3 UW & 3.7 W (yeah, we know this is a weak area)</p>

<p>Taking 5 AP courses this year: Physics, Calc AB, US Gov, Lit & Comp, Span. Hoping to pull grades up for first semester.</p>

<p>Eagle Scout – lots of service hours
Quiz Bowl Club President
Performs in two punk bands, including gigs in NYC
High school band
Plays piano, guitar, sax, trumpet
Volunteered with local hospital for 2 summers
A few other minor activities</p>

<p>Spanish National Honor Society</p>

<p>URM, Hispanic</p>

<p>Here’s his long list, with too many reaches. We really need to cut it down, but I don’t want to miss out on merit possibilities. Big problem is he doesn’t have a safety he loves.</p>

<p>Reaches
Boston College<br>
Brown<br>
Columbia ----- One of his favorites, loves NYC location
Cornell ----- Don’t know why it’s on his list
Emory ----- A merit reach
New York U<br>
Rice ----- One of his favorites, likes the laid back, friendly vibe, merit possibility
University of Chicago<br>
Washington Univ, SL ----- Intrigued by merit possibility</p>

<p>Matches
Denison U. ----- Merit possibility
Franklin & Marshall ----- Merit possibility
George Washington U. ----- One of his favorites, loves the location in the heart of DC
SUNY Binghamton ----- In-state financial safety
Tulane ----- Added to list because app fee waived, merit possibility</p>

<p>Safeties
American U ----- Doesn’t really like much after visiting
Clark U. ----- On list for merit possibility, hasn’t visited yet
Fordham ----- Added to list because app fee waived, merit possibility
Santa Clara U. ----- On list for merit possibility, intrigued by location
University of Vermont ----- Location too remote, kept on list for merit possibility</p>

<p>Any suggestions for additions or deletions?</p>

2

<p>

</p>

<p>Delete this one; if he doesn’t like it, he won’t want to go there, and a safety that a kid won’t go to is no safety at all.</p>

3

<p>I would look at the University of Pittsburgh. If he applies within the next week or too, he would have an acceptance in hand by the end of the month. Great city, comprehensive course offerings, lots of accomplished students, and many academic, internship, and social opportunities. Pitt students seem to love their school.</p>

4

<p>It seems to me the schools that have appealed to him are more urban than many on your list. How about something like Syracuse for a safety? Or Boston University? Did you look at Rochester U? (It’s more sciency than international relationsy, but is a comprehensive university.) Might be more of a match than a safety.</p>

5

<p>I am confused. I know that some of those schools do not offer merit money. So is that just one of many criteria you are using?</p>

<p>It is also possible that schools would be more likely to offer merit aid to students with higher grades and lower scores (showing effort) than students with high scores and lower grades, but I could be wrong.</p>

<p>I know that at Clark U., just as one example, the merit aid tends to go to students who have started something like a peer counseling program, or initiated an effective program for community teen health, that kind of thing.</p>

<p>I am just throwing these comments in without any pretense of knowing a lot about the merit aid scene, but to make sure your hopes are realistic.</p>

6

<p>Rose123 - your son reminds me a lot of my younger son. I won’t go into his college list, but I do want to share with you that he is quite taken in by Dickinson College. Its worth a look… [Dickinson</a> College](<a href=“http://dickinson.edu/]Dickinson”>http://dickinson.edu/)</p>

7

<p>A few years ago a friend of mine’s son got perfect SAT scores but had pretty lousy grades. He got a full ride to SUNY Binghamton.</p>

8

<p>Your son reminds me a lot of my younger S, a high scoring, low grade URM, who knew he wanted to go to college, but hadn’t a clue what he wanted to major in or what kind of college he wanted to attend. He benefited greatly by doing a post high school gap year living at home and being an Americorps volunteer. That experience taught him a lot about himself, and he applied to college during his gap year, and is now a junior with high grades and productive ECs who’s happy in his major, an area that I never would have guessed he’d choose.</p>

9

<p>My concern is that he likes schools that are intense when he is laid back and has low grades. Perhaps a gap year would be the best so he can decide what he really wants.</p>

10

<p>If you are looking as far as Santa Clara, consider the University of San Diego. It is more accessible to an urban center and offers better merit aid.</p>

11

<p>owlice –
You’re absolutely right about deleting American. Here are the schools that are likely to be deleted soon, for general lack of interest:</p>

<p>Brown
Cornell
Washu
American
Univ. Vermont</p>

12

<p>Pittsburgh, Syracuse, Rochester – Thank you, I’ll take a look.</p>

<p>I hate to admit this, but my unfamiliarity with those cities probably led me to disregard these schools before. Neither S nor I have ever traveled to those cities and we have preconceived notions of what they’re like. Shame on me! (Actually, I was in Syracuse years ago but cannot remember what it was like.)</p>

13

<p>compmom, thank you for your comments on merit aid, and yes, it is only one criterion of many. For example, if he happened to get into Columbia we would do some serious thinking about paying full tuition for that school. I am a little fearful of getting my son’s hopes up unrealistically about this. We’ve had several in-depth discussions about our reluctance to pay full freight for an expensive school, especially in light of his grades. However, he may still end up disappointed.</p>

<p>Really, I think trying to get a realistic idea of his chances for merit aid is hard. High scores, URM, so-so grades, interesting mix of ECs – it could go either way, I think.</p>

14

<p>

</p>

<p>I had no idea that Binghamton might offer merit. Things have changed a lot over the last few years, and it’s become more competitive. In any case, their $17k cost sure looks attractive compared to $30-50k at every other school we’ve considered.</p>

15

<p>What kind of Hispanic is he? The most desired are those who are Puerto Rican or Mexican-Americans because those make up the bulk of the U.S. Hispanic population and are very underrepresented in colleges because of low high school graduation rates and low numbers with college-prep courses and good grades.</p>

<p>I believe that you need to be very clear with your son about what you’re willing to provide for his college education. Give him a specific amount that you’re willing to provide each year. Tell him now so he knows that he’ll have to select his college based on that.</p>

<p>A 3.3 unweighted is not a horrible gpa. It’s low for places like Ivies and for most students posting here, but compared to what most students get in high school, it’s a good gpa and would gain a high-scoring student like your son entrance into most colleges in the country. </p>

<p>Drop-out rates from places like Ivies are very low because only students who clearly have the background that means they can succeed are accepted. (Bottom gpa for Ivies is unweighted 3.0, and very few students are accepted at that level, probably mostly recruited athletes). Also, the culture of Ivies is that peers appreciate and admire academic success, something that isn’t as much the case at many lower ranked schools where one may be admired by peers despite getting failing grades.</p>

<p>His ACT of 34 is excellent, no reason for him to retake the SAT.</p>

<p>I do think your son would benefit by taking a gap year doing something productive like working a fulltime job or doing fulltime volunteer work like Americorps so he can learn more about himself and what he wants out of college. A productive gap year also would boost his chances of getting into reach schools.</p>

16

<p>A gap year. Wow, let me catch my breath.</p>

<p>You’re making me think outside the box, that’s for sure.</p>

17

<p>^^ He’s Mexican-American, so that’s something in his favor.</p>

<p>The honest truth is that we’re flexible about how much we’re willing to pay. We want him to pay about $40k (loans &/or jobs) for his college and we know for certain we’d be willing to pay a certain minimum amount, but that would still leave a gap for those schools that cost over $30-35k per year. That’s why I’m interested in merit aid. However, we are open to reconsidering this depending on our financial situation and on his maturity development.</p>

18

<p>I had suggested a gap year with Americorps to son when at the beginning of senior year, he said he didn’t know what kind of college he wanted to attend, and he didn’t know what he wanted to major in. His interests were all over the place from engineering to psychology to music. He also has strong talents/scores across the board.</p>

<p>With my older S, I had stood over him to make sure that he got apps into colleges that interested him. I also did all of the work of researching colleges that fit his needs. I’d suggest colleges to him, and he’d say yea or nay. He was a very high scoring, mediocre grade URM who said he wanted to go to college. He happily went with virtually full merit aid to his second choice college, a second tier public (He had gotten into 2 top 25 schools, including his first choice, but it didn’t give him any money), and had a great time in that college but flunked out due to lack of attending classes. </p>

<p>So… with younger son, I didn’t monitor his college apps. I had taken S around to college beforehand, and given him books about applying, and had provided him with lots of other info. He also got a free fly-in to a top 10 college. I had made sure he had taken the tests he would need to apply to any college in the country.</p>

<p>S somehow never got around to applying anywhere although he stared at his computer and said he was working on apps. After he missed the deadlines for all colleges that interested him, within 2 weeks, he had been promised an Americorps job at a place where he had been happily and intensely volunteering since being a h.s. freshman.</p>

<p>He claimed he preferred to do Americorps in a distant state so he could be more independent, but he never applied to such programs. After he accepted the local Americorps job, he claimed to want to live away from home. I showed him the classifieds and offered to help him find an apartment. He never followed up on that.</p>

<p>So… he spent his Americorps year living at home and paying rent (house rules for any offspring who’s not a fulltime student). We treated him like an adult . He learned what it’s like to be in the real world: you have to, for instance, write reports and supervisors tolerate procrastination far less than do high school teachers.</p>

<p>During his gap year, on his own, he applied to colleges. He had figured out what atmosphere he likes and what kind of fields he was likely to major in. </p>

<p>In college, he has fully taken advantage of academic and EC opportunities including opportunities to stretch himself academically and in terms of leadership. Despite having an irritating partying freshman year roommate and having the bad fortune of being assigned to the partying dorm, S rose above that challenge by, for instance, studying in the library and hanging out with friends who are academically-focused.</p>

<p>Meanwhile, older S never returned to college, but to his credit does support himself and has gotten 3 promotions in the past 2 years on his job, but his road to getting to this point after flunking out of college was rocky. He would have matured faster if he had had a productive gap year instead of going straight to college when he lacked the self knowledge and life knowledge to take advantage of that opportunity.</p>

<p>And, he would have done better if his mother had known to screen out colleges with low graduation rates.</p>

19

<p>

</p>

<p>He wasn’t planning to, but then last week after speaking with his GC he agreed to retake. This is on the off chance it would help in advancing to NMF and maybe add another data point that could possibly help in the admissions process. Since he does no test prep, the cost is a few hours on a Saturday morning and $42. Even if it doesn’t help, it cannot hurt.</p>

20

<p>“We want him to pay about $40k (loans &/or jobs)”</p>

<p>The average college student takes out about a total of $17 k to pay for their college. I think that what you’re expecting your son to pay is too high even when one doesn’t consider the current problems with the economy.</p>