<p>I find it rather ironic that someone who is contemplating a career in the foreign service is worried about the weather in a college town.</p>
<p>Maybe I’m mistaken, but I was under the impression that foreign service employees are expected to go wherever they are posted?</p>
<p>So this really got me curious and I just checked U Wyoming course schedule, started browsing. In Math, all the classes are taught in size 40 or less except calc3 which for some reason has over 100. History is running 2 classes a bit over 100 and a couple 50-60. The rest are 30 or less. Philosophy similar. And the courses with 40-60 frequently have smaller discussion groups. Wat are these huge classes she is talking about? Even basic Western Civ is only size 60. </p>
<p>The winter weather in Laramie could be worse that in any other college town in America except Fairbanks.</p>
<p>I think the bigger question you are getting at is if my D is truly ambitious, passionate and determined couldn’t she kick butt at any school including the University of Wyoming. I’d like to think of her more as a Navy Seal dropped into a war zone ready to handle anything than as some sort of delicate flower that will immediately wilt if conditions aren’t perfect.</p>
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<p>This whole notion of going to off to an elite college at considerable expense thousands of miles from home is a very American idea. When my daughter was attending high school in Russia, her host sister lived at home and commuted by bus to the Russian state U. (equivalent of our public regional colleges) about an hour away. Lovely little college town, my daughter loved the students she met there and would go every chance she got --but had some interesting stories about waiting for an unheated bus to arrive in the snow. She was living in a small town about 90 miles from Moscow. </p>
<p>I do think that particularly for anyone who thinks they want a foreign service career - it’s pretty important be aware of how the rest of the world lives. </p>
<p>I was kind of kidding about the weather, and kind of not. I know. We used to live in Iowa and it was pretty windy winters, big drifts. Wisconsin where we live now is a much milder climate in terms of wind anyway. I know some people are desperate to get to a warm climate in college after spending their whole lives in the north. I don’t think it means she’s spoiled or coddled. Just that when the conversation is so serious about cost and college’s ability to provide the appropriate resources, that seems like a silly distraction that should be brushed aside, unless you grew up far south and are contemplating Minnesota, say. It’s just another thing to pile on the list of reasons not to go to Wyoming. I doubt she’d let it keep her from a college she really liked, or even bring it up as a negative.</p>
<p>Aw, c’mon, let’s give the OP the benefit of the doubt. I think that most of us have wonderful kids who sometimes, especially when under the stress of a huge decision, act like spoiled, entitled brats. The OP was open enough to talk about these moments here. That doesn’t make his/her kid a spoiled, entitled brat previously or hereinafter. It’s tough to let go of what a kid perceives as the perfect dream of college, regardless of the facts and regardless of how s/he was parented. Once the decision is made, I am sure s/he is a good kid.</p>
<p>Of course she’s a good kid. That’s a given. </p>
<p>My son is a Foreign Service officer, so I can offer a few data points.</p>
<p>In his A100 class–the initial training in DC for new FSOs–the best represented ug school was Brigham Young. Not Georgetown, not Princeton, not GW. The State Dept has tons of people who can do policy. What it need in its entering classes are men and women who like living abroad, speak at least one foreign language well, and are capable of learning new languages as an adult. Mormons who have done missions abroad often fit this, along with Peace Corps volunteers, and former military officers. </p>
<p>The Foreign Service is organized into “cones.” Political and economic officers may help craft policy, but officers in Consular, Management, and Public Diplomacy cones have different responsibilities. For them, a legal, business, or English/journalism degree may be more relevant. More than 50% of the initial assignments will be Consular jobs, no matter what cone you were hired in, because that’s where the need for junior officers is greatest. The two main areas of Consular work are Visas (immigrant and non-immigrant) and American Citizens Services (helping Americans abroad, adoptions, prison visits, etc.)</p>
<p>Being an FSO is not a cushy job anymore. These days, while not yet mandatory, if you want to advance you have to serve in one of the most dangerous unaccompanied posts. My son had the choice of Afghanistan, Iraq, or Pakistan. ( He chose Iraq.) Recently Yemen and Somalia were added to that list. </p>
<p>Pleasant European posts are highly competitive. No one should enter the Foreign Service imagining spending their days in London and Paris. So far my son has been posted to Russia, Iraq, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia. Worth noting is that there have been single and marrried woman serving at all these posts as well. So tough-minded young women can and do flourish in today’s Foreign Service, but it’s a career that can bring danger and hardship along with accomplishment.</p>
<p>You don’t need an IR degree to take the Foreign Service exam. But you will definitely enhance your chances of being hired by getting a high score on one of the critical languages. I second the advice above of checking the language offerings of the schools being considered to see how far DD can go in the language(s) she’s interested in.<br>
As for the written exam, reading the Economist every week for four years would go a long way. </p>
<p>From wikipedia: "The 13 critical languages include Arabic, Azerbaijani, Bengali, Chinese, Hindi, Indonesian, Japanese, Korean, Persian, Punjabi, Russian, Turkish and Urdu. "</p>
<p>U of Wyoming offers majors in Chinese, Japanese, & Russian – as well as a number of European languages not on the critical list (Spanish, French, German). Goucher offers Arabic. </p>
<p>Although janesmith’s post make it clear that new FSO postings are far from glamorous, I would guess that a person who had proficiency in a critical or less-common language might be more likely to be posted in countries where that language is spoken. In other words, it might not be such a bad idea to become fluent in Japanese. </p>
<p>I think this is probably a good time to think about the difference between “dream job” (along with “dream college”) and focus what really needs to be done if the student is truly dedicated to that career goal. </p>
<p>UWyoming also offers a over half dozen courses in Arabic as part of their int studies program and is looking to put in place several more over the next 2 years They look to be small but well-attended classes. Two sections of 2nd semester Arabic this spring.</p>
<p>MYOS, I’m not so prejudice for Wyoming as I am about thinking that Goucher is an answer. I used to drive by Goucher twice a day on my way to and from my job. Nice school (all women back then) but many very rich women. Near Towson U , and a world away in the type of students at each. Hopkins down the street also different. It is NOT near DC or even Annapolis for internships. It takes 2 hours to get to DC if you leave before 6 am, and can take 3 hours during the day. Nice school, just not magical.</p>
<p>I agree with OP’s daughter that the weather in Laramie is not ideal, and that alone may be a good reason to get out of there, but that doesn’t mean the school is no good, substandard, or that it doesn’t offer the same opportunities that Rhodes or Goucher (two school which people may not have heard of in Wyoming and I can assure you no one has heard of here) offer. If OP’s daughter thinks Laramie is a small town, wait till she goes to a small college. I get wanting to go away to school, but OP has indicated they can’t afford it without major loans. I’m absolutely against major loans for ANY school, but especially for an ‘it’s a step up, but not really what I want’ school.</p>
<p>My second daughter is going to a small, one-trick pony school for engineering. If she decides she doesn’t like engineering, she’ll probably have to transfer. For her, I think it is okay. For a student who thinks she wants foreign service, but has shown no passion for getting to that goal besides pouting that her parents won’t sign for a PLUS loan, I think it’s likely she’ll change her major and be limited at a smaller school. She’s in model UN. And? Any languages? Any other major steps to her career?</p>
<p>If they can afford it, great. If they can’t, she has a good alternative. They aren’t going to spoon feed her at Wyoming. She’ll have to chose her classes wisely, take a lot of classics and art history to pass the foreign service exam, but it can be done.</p>
<p>What “people in general” know and what specific schools/services know is different.
By “near” I didn’t mean “close by” but “within the sphere of influence” (although DC is accessible, including bus/train service). In other terms, lots of MD, NOVA and DC-job families at Goucher (plus Main Line), and lots of alumni in DC. Internships would be summer or semester-in-DC not during the week (unlike American).
It’s changed A LOT since the times it was women only. 
I actually think that Rhodes is stronger academically but for OP’s daughter’s professional choice Goucher has a better location and outlook (international study is required and funded, for instance; languages are quite strong). Rhodes has a great program in Russian.
Anyway if she doesn’t want to go, this is immaterial…</p>
<p>I think an advantage to an LAC for D is that she may not end up pursuing foreign service. She’s 17 and I would expect that there will be some twists and turns in the road as she explores different subjects and learns more about different career paths. An LAC might give her a more careful introduction to a variety of subjects. She does have some extensive experience abroad having spent 10 months in India with AFS. That was tough duty for her - very different culture and challenging host family situation - but she emerged with her passion for travel undaunted. She gained some experience with Hindi there, and suggested the other day that that is the language she wishes to pursue in college. I did some research and discovered that Goucher is the only one of her schools that could offer her Hindi (through Johns Hopkins), so that gives Goucher a unique advantage. Now whether it’s a good idea to pursue Hindi or better to continue on with the French she learned in high school is probably fodder for another thread at a latter date.</p>
<p>Wow, my hat’s off to your daughter. AFS is tough, but in India it’s extra tough.
Hindi is a critical language and would give her an advantage, while French would be more general but would especially open to Western Africa and Canada opportunities. It’d be a good idea to keep up with both. Both would be appreciated in the Peace Corps, too, but an edge to Hindi since it’s less common than French.
If she takes a gap year, you may want to look at UT Austin’s flagship in HIndi/Urdu
<a href=“http://hindiurduflagship.org/”>http://hindiurduflagship.org/</a>
but I think it’s 52K without any financial aid available so … the same as GWU. :(</p>
<p>Goucher students a have similar profile to UWyoming students in many respects. A bit higher SAT reading distribution, but lower GPA, a bit higher 6 year graduation rate. Overall a wash I think. Rhodes is higher in everything. In case intellectual peer group is a big concern.
75th %ile ACT Comp.: 31 Rhodes/27 Wyoming/28 Goucher
75th %ile SAT math/reading: 680-690Rhodes/620-620Wyoming/620-660 Goucher.
6-year graduation rates: 80% Rhodes/55% Wyoming/66% Goucher.
GPA 3.75%+: 58% Rhodes/35% Wyoming/15% Goucher </p>
<p>Rhodes offers a Washington semester at American with the opportunity for an internship. My daughter did a similar program from her similar LAC, and was able to spend a semester interning at the Department of State. She got credit for the semester and her merit money traveled with her. She actually went abroad fall of her junior year, then was in DC on the internship in the spring that year. If your D goes abroad on a school sponsored program, her merit money likely will travel as well.</p>
<p>My understanding is that merit money would travel with her if she goes abroad through Rhodes or Goucher, but not for DC semester at AU through Rhodes, and that Goucher no longer participates in that program. </p>
<p>Yes, I see you are right, Rhodes doesn’t transfer aid to the American program. Too bad…my daughter’s college did, but it was a different DC semester program (not through American). My D also spent a summer in DC interning (unpaid, and I made her cover her own expenses, which she did). So that is also an option. At some schools IR students have to spend a full year abroad anyway as part of the major, so if that is the case a DC semester might not even make sense.</p>
<p>My son spent a semester in DC as an intern in a program that was fully funded – paid the full tuition for the semester, provided airfare and housing, and included a monthly stipend as well as a full semester’s credit… That was through a program open only to CSU (Cal State) students. I see that U. of Wyoming has a very similar program - <a href=“http://www.uwyo.edu/pols/internships/dc.html”>http://www.uwyo.edu/pols/internships/dc.html</a> - </p>
<p>That’s a program that would tend to appeal more to students interested in politics and government than in international affairs, as it is a Congressional internship – but the point is that a student does not have to attend an elite university in order to have various internship opportunities. </p>
<p>@grossjh - Ideally your daughter would try to develop fluency in both Hindi and French. Certainly if she is interested in other career paths beyond Foreign Service – such was working with a UN agency or another NGO the combination would be helpful. </p>