@cornycollins18, what would the current HS seniors at your daughter’s school say about their HS drama experiences? It sucks to be a freshman in HS drama and sometimes sucks even worse to be an actually talented HS freshman female that will be feared at every move. Dues must be paid in that environment until you are actually the one sitting on top of the catbird seat because finally, it is your turn. There is actually some real life training experience from dealing with that might be worth sticking around for. Not that your daughter will think so but I encourage you as the parent to think about it and weigh your next move.
I’d not be as quick as others to abandon ship. Your daughter is just a HS freshman. In most drama programs, regardless of talent, freshman girls will be lucky even to be cast. I could tell you stories of my daughter’s HS musical audition. She got a “holy sh_t” award (literally a certificate that says that) at the midnight cast party her freshman year at Denny’s from the senior girl that was lurking outside the door during her audition and was prepared to go all Tanya Harding on her thinking she had just lost the role she wanted. The senior got the lead and should have even though she could not sing - at all. (Great actor though and that made her work for the part.) It’s a process and high schools need to let people go through it and it isn’t just a playing field for the star athletes. It’s a right of passage. It’s not always a bad thing to learn patience and that sometimes life isn’t fair.
halflokum, what you wrote is true in high schools that cast based on seniority. At our high school, it is not done by seniority. It is more talent based. I’m grateful they did it that way. My D was a lead in the high school plays and musicals starting in 7th grade (high school is just grades 9-12, but middle school students were allowed to audition for the HS productions, even though the middle school had their own musical…my D never tried for the middle school ones). Anyway, when I look back on it, I’m grateful for lots of reasons but I just realized upon reading this that if our school cast based on seniority…my D would have really lost out because in 11th grade, while cast as Ado Annie in Oklahoma, she was so severely injured in a car crash, that she was out of the show and her part was taken over by her best friend and so she never did the show. She also graduated after 11th grade and so never did the musical in senior year as she was in college instead. So, had they cast by seniority, she was out of 11th and 12th grade shows, but luckily had played leads in 7th, 8th, 9th, and 10th grades at our HS.
I think there is merit to valuing BOTH seniority and “pure talent” in school productions- especially for regular schools (as opposed to PA schools) And with NO disrespect to soozie’s D and her experiences, I am also not a big fan of the same kid having the lead every year- IMHO that’s not what school shows are about. And disclaimer, I have been involved directing shows for my public school district’s (where I teach history, not drama- there is no drama class at my school) middle school and high school for the last 10 years, so I have seen a LOT of kids come through the room.
D’s casting results so far at hs have been: tiny ensemble roles in 2 plays, then all out rejection from talent show. I had been told to expect casting to be done by seniority& favoritism, so the results were what I expected. D has had plenty of experience with a range of roles from ensemble to lead, so she’s very capable of drying her tears quickly and moving on. Ensemble roles in a quality learning environment would be fine with her, especially during her freshman year where “paying your dues” is expected. What has prompted this move is the fact that she’s NOT in a quality learning environment. She has literally not gotten a shred of training from the school program. She’s fortunately has continued vocal & instrument lessons so has (hopefully) improved.
My OP was not at all intended as a complaint about casting decisions at her hs. I have read many CC threads about casting/does my child have talent? As a supremely biased parent, I’d say of course she does! Objectively speaking (if such a thing is possible) she is the only student at her hs who has done any outside shows or has had any outside acting training. Very few aside from D have voice or private instrument lessons. As an 8th grader, D beat all the drama students from the high school at a community theater audition. During her show over the past summer, in which she was the lead, the pros who managed the stage & lighting dragged family members in just to hear D sing. They said in 25+ years they’d never felt compelled to do that.
If D is not finding the new theater to be a big improvement over her high school department, I suppose she can give the hs a try again and tough it out.
A student at my D’s school has almost exclusively performed in community and regional theater in our area. Their HS has a great theatre program, but very dominated by favorites and the same few being selected for lead roles (or any roles). She is an extremely talented MT kid and has done well with her college auditions. Her letters of rec came from her vocal coach and a director she’s worked with multiple times in shows. She has a bright future for sure.
As a High School teacher, I want to respond to some of what is perceived here.
Many High School theatre teachers are woefully unqualified. Depending on your state/school they may be teaching out of their discipline altogether (the English teacher running the plays, for instance).
High School is no different than the professional world in a lot of ways. My eye for talent is different than the next guys.
Parents are the single most difficult part of teaching High School theatre. Many think their child is the best. Many think I am short changing their child. Most hate it when one or two students get a lot of leads. I have only had one or two parents ever ask me, “What can I do to help my child improve? What does she need to do to get leads?” etc.
I always cast talent first. Seniority is the tiebreaker. Our productions are representations of me as a professional. The basketball coach doesn’t start the five seniors, he starts the five best players. My current musical is ensemble-based, but last year my leads were One Senior, Two Sophomores, and a Freshman.
I can not stress enough - talk to your child’s theatre teacher. Don’t be a “Drama Mama” or a “Dance Mom”, be a supportive voice. Sell tickets. Sell concessions. Let your child find their voice, with their friends, in a safe environment.
I want to put out an idea that might be beneficial to some of you with kids in high school. However, this also holds true in college and as a professional.
Your child can create his/her own opportunities to perform or even to play a lead. While casting was NOT the impetus for the endeavor my child undertook that I am about to describe (she was cast well in our school every year), this is an idea that might provide an opportunity to those kids who perhaps need more opportunity. My child’s motivation was more to create. Anyhow, in tenth and eleventh grades, my kid created something never before done at our high school and if I must say so, it was quite a success for all who were involved. She created/wrote, produced, cast, musically directed, directed, and choreographed an original student run revue (two different ones). She performed in it as well. The kids who participated were very into it and proud of all they achieved. The proceeds went to charities. The level of the shows were very high and in many ways, each of the kids got to shine in ways they may not have gotten to in the regular school musical (though they all participated in that too). It was very well received in the community. In any case, there is no need to wait to be cast in something. Go out and create your own opportunities to perform.
My S performed in his HS productions but supplemented with outside productions. In fact, the vast majority of his training came from non-HS productions. I agree with @TheaterHiringCo that many HS theater directors are woefully unqualified so many of the kids end up looking elsewhere for training. A packed resume is nice but, as others have pointed out, not very important to the college auditors. They are looking for “coachable” talent, not year after year of HS experience.
I often wonder about correlations between sports and arts. Meaning - would kids who hope to pursue a sport at the college or professional level be saying the same thing about HS coaches. At my high school, coaches are teachers (of English, math, social studies and everything I between) They don’t have “degrees” in soccer or baseball - rather like an English teacher directing shows as theaterhiringco mentions. I think the vast majority of high school athletes are happy with their coaches, and I would imagine that the vast majority of students who do HS theater feel the same way about their drama programs. Now a kid who hopes to pursue a BFA may need/want more- but most of the kids I know who have gone on to play sports at the college level also have outside training in their area. It isn’t a reflection on the school program - or the effort and dedication put in by those “unqualified” teachers. Btw- migrant workers make better money than the advisor for most school’s drama programs (or coaches for that matter)
At my kids’ rural public high school, there was no drama program, but the school did put on a play and a musical each year. Those who directed those shows were not on the regular faculty of the HS. The person who directed the musicals had been an actor on Broadway and on TV. The person who directed the plays had a degree in theater.
I don’t think auditors care much about where students have been performing as long as the talent and skills are there. unless it is a prestigious or well known school or theater. Honestly, unless you are blessed to be in an area that has well known theaters, most likely the auditors are not going to have an opinion one way or the other about where you have been performing. They could not possibly know the reputations of most high schools and most local community theaters.
If you have been in shows, they would like to see that you have been performing, the types of roles in which you’ve been cast, recommendations from directors you’ve worked with, etc… But they will also consider whatever training you’ve had whether you to go a summer intensive or work with a local voice teacher. So find the best opportunities where you are to get the best training you can. And if your high school program is not good, by all means look for better alternatives. Don’t be miserable. But as another poster said, also realize a lot of good life lessons can be learned by participating in that high school program. There will always be politics. The most talented will not always get the part. Sometimes you’ll even be outright rejected. Some directors will be difficult to work with. Some actors will be difficult to work with. Some people may not like you. But by participating in a challenging environment in high school, you can learn how to handle these challenges. Good practice as they will probable be challenges you face later in life too.
In the end, your audition is going to be far more important than your resume. Sometimes there can be someone with a loaded resume - who just isn’t that talented. That will show up in the audition room. And sometimes, an undiscovered talent with not much of a resume will surprise everyone and be discovered. Be the one that shines in that audition room!
Skill/training trumps large amounts of “wasted” rehearsal time - no matter where you get it. Performances are great, but not if it comes at the expense of hours standing around watching other actors learn their marks, or listening to the director yell at the leads for not knowing their lines. Hours spent: sweating in dance studios; working on songs that truly show off YOUR voice/type; with a good coach who can help you learn real acting skills; or practicing an instrument will have a much bigger payoff. And if you can get that while also working on a production - wherever it may be, terrific. Otherwise, if this skill set is what you truly want to focus on, go for the training. Looking at top athletes, how many of them leave behind the “home” team to get the coaching/skills they the need to make them competitive? When it comes to the “drama” found in drama programs, get used to it. This will be ever present in your future career. Learning how to deal with - or walk away from it when it becomes necessary - will be a valuable lifeskill.
I agree with mom4bwayboy. Being in shows is good experience, certainly. But it’s not the same as learning proper vocal technique and breathing and placement…or taking acting classes and learning how to break down a scene or “live truthfully in the moment”…or taking dance classes and training your body to do a perfect pirouette. I remember reading a post somewhere on these boards from a mom who said she had thought her daughter would do great in college auditions because all her life she’d been in show after show after show, for years and years, both school shows and community theater. But when it came time to audition, they realized too late that she’d never gotten any actual TRAINING, and it put her at a disadvantage.
Reading literary texts, learning history, understanding visual art, getting a grasp of psychology and so on. These are the high school activities that could most promote the growth of a young actor. Single-minded focus on technique for the purpose of auditions (whether for college or later in life) is a soulless endeavor. By contrast, rigorous reading and writing and discussion on a wide variety of topics will enrich your child’s mind and increase the likelihood that he will be sought out for groundbreaking new work, musicals in development at New York Theater workshop and the like.
There is nothing wrong with acting in some shows and taking dance classes but intense audition prep through the high school years consumes a lot of time and energy your child might devote toward other goals. Take a step beck and really encourage your child to let go of measuring himself in terms of how he stacks up against others in order to explore what success would mean to him in the here and now.
Getting jobs and getting into schools are not the same thing as making art. These kids differ from athletes in a profound way; Their intelligence and imagination will be crucial in this career; Without engaging those faculties there is little likelihood that an actor will be of much value. Their development is not best served by repeatedly executing skills drills. The teen years are a time for young actors to discover themselves.
Son is a drummer, and like many others, began with private lessons on the drum set. There came a point where he needed opportunities to play with others, so even though he had visions of being a death metal drummer, he auditioned for the HS Jazz Band. The requirement to be a Jazz Band member was also to be in the Concert Band and Pep Band. He didn’t like it at first, but it was a great learning experience, so much so, that he was the 1st chair in Senior year, which means he was in charge of the other 12 percussionists, instrument prep, ect. This is a long winded attempt to say that balance in training and performing worked well for him.
Who said anything about “to the exclusion of”? For our kids, isn’t it always “on top of”? All I meant was, those 10,000 hours of practice for ANY mastery of an art/sport/scientific endeavor/written expression/etc. have to begin sometime. Standing on a stage watching others mark a scene during a 3-hour rehearsal will not further that goal. The competition will be there - whether we like it or not.