<p>the problem isn’t that a school has someone to work on mental health issues… the problem is they have like 500 deans and assistant deans and provosts and vice presidents etc etc etc</p>
<p>I am not. In administration, so I dont have an opinion on how many people it takes to run a university.</p>
<p>My daughters school does a good job with their small budget however, as do many other schools.
[Best</a> Values in Public Colleges, 2013](<a href=“http://www.kiplinger.com/tools/colleges/]Best”>Best College Values, 2019 | Kiplinger)</p>
<p>This is old news, but not unimportant. Here’s a 2011 Washington Monthly story that clearly identifies the trends:</p>
<p>[The</a> Washington Monthly - The Magazine - Administrators Ate My Tuition](<a href=“http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/magazine/septemberoctober_2011/features/administrators_ate_my_tuition031641.php]The”>http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/magazine/septemberoctober_2011/features/administrators_ate_my_tuition031641.php)</p>
<p>Basically, student-faculty ratios have held pretty constant, and faculty salaries have not increased in real terms in recent years. At many universities, the share of teaching done by tenured and tenure-track faculty has actually declined, as the university seeks to shave costs by filling more podiums with low-paid, part-time adjuncts. Meanwhile, salaries for “executive-level” administrators have soared, those positions have become far more numerous, and increasingly they are held by “professionals” other than faculty. At the same time, non-instructional staff-level positions have also proliferated, in part in response to student and parent demands for more and better counseling services, career services, study abroad programs, IT service provision and support, support services for student activities, and on and on. As a result, faculty instruction represents a declining share of college and university budgets, and at many institutions non-faculty payrolls now exceed spending on faculty.</p>
<p>I’m not saying this is necessarily a bad thing, nor am I prepared to say it’s a good thing. But it is a real thing. An ever-increasing share of your tuition dollar is going not to instruction, but to high-priced administrators and various ancillary services. I’m convinced the growth on the student services side is largely consumer-driven; students and their parents want more and better student services, and they’ll spend their tuition dollars where they perceive such services to be the best-funded and most responsive. And to be blunt, it’s much easier to do comparison shopping between schools on the basis of these ancillary services, than it is to compare the quality and depth of instruction. So that becomes the basis for the consumer decision, and colleges know it. From the colleges’ perspective, it certainly doesn’t hurt that many of these expenditures can be categorized as student-related, and therefore count in the expenditures-per-student column that buoys the school’s US News ranking. So we end up with a kind of “arms race” to provide better, fancier, and more expensive services, driven both by the demands of students and their parents, and by the school’s self-interest in boosting its almighty ranking.</p>
<p>And so it goes.</p>
<p>Here we are again, looking for simple reasons, the little head smackers, why don’t they get it?</p>
<p>And, by gummy, there’s the popular media to explain it all. </p>
<p>Wash Monthly refers to the Delta Project up to 2008 (perhaps it goes further, later in the article.) Here’s the Delta update- which I think some will be interested in.</p>
<p>College spending in a turbulent decade <a href=“http://www.deltacostproject.org/pdfs/Delta-Cost-College-Spending-In-A-Turbulent-Decade.pdf[/url]”>http://www.deltacostproject.org/pdfs/Delta-Cost-College-Spending-In-A-Turbulent-Decade.pdf</a></p>
<p>Where does the money go? <a href=“http://www.deltacostproject.org/resources/pdf/Delta-Spending-Trends-Production.pdf[/url]”>http://www.deltacostproject.org/resources/pdf/Delta-Spending-Trends-Production.pdf</a> Incl interesting tables.</p>
<p>Be aware that some of the quotables can’t be taken out of the greater context.</p>
<p>Lookingforward-
Thanks for the link. For those who haven’t checked it out, one of the things it shows across types of institutions is increased spending between 2000 and 2009, then a decrease in spending from 2009 to 2010. In some cases these decreases brought spending to a level lower than it was in 2001. For instance, in 2001 the average per student spending for operations and maintenance at a public bachelor’s institution was $1575. By 2009 it had risen to $1956. In 2010, no doubt due to cut driven by the poor economy, it had dropped to $1555. The problem is that no matter how poor the economy it’s impossible to defer maintenance forever. What many colleges and universities probably thought of as temporary measures in 2009-2010 are unsustainable in the long run and the result is increased spending.</p>
<p>Sue - some of the cuts may be penny wise and pound foolish. If property is not maintained, it can be more expensive to replace. If you do not paint an metal railing, it may rust and be more expensive in the long run. However, hopefully the cuts are some of the large numbers of deans.</p>
<p>I admit I find it painful that administrators are felt to be so important that they can command these salaries, yet in healthcare, providers seem to be looked down upon, as their reimbursement rates just keep getting lower and lower and lower.</p>
<p>OK rant over.</p>
<p>I work at a public university in an administrative position. In my observation, here are a few reasons for the rise of university costs:</p>
<p>1) Decreased state support for public institutions. Budgets keep being cut. Administrative financial staff spend a lot of time analyzing budgets and figuring out how to meet the bottom line.</p>
<p>2) Increased regulation. For example, the federal government keeps passing new regulations for federal financial aid, trying to make sure there is not abuse by those taking subsidized loans, Pell, etc. They want to make sure the schools’ “product” is not a scam, so they impose “gainful employment” reporting requirements. Administrative staff respond by changing their policies to adhere to financial aid regulations. This means re-programming computers and adding steps to financial aid disbursement. Meeting federal reporting requirements also requires administrative staff to collect, analyze, and submit the data.</p>
<p>3) Increased assessment requirements. For re-accreditation, schools must produce data that demonstrates how they are successfully meeting their objectives. Gathering this data requires endless surveys of students, departments and faculty. The survey instruments need to be designed and administered and the results need to be tabulated and analyzed. This requires administrative staff. </p>
<p>4) Increased technological demands. I work in IT. Students (and faculty and staff) want WiFi available everywhere on campus. They don’t just want to be able to do things on the computer, they also want mobile apps available for all the various platforms. They want 24/7 access, which means back-ups need to happen seamlessly without interruption. They want the latest tools available for teaching – smart boards, the ability to upload media to class discussion chats, the ability of students to monitor their grades online. And they want security – they don’t want their personal data compromised. All of this requires administrative staff.</p>
<p>I can’t think of a week where I didn’t work more than 40 hours. I don’t get overtime or extra pay for this time. We keep adding new tools, software, and ways of doing things to make it easier and better for the students and the faculty, and all these tools and software need to be upgraded, maintained, and administered. To make it all work automatically for you requires a whole lot of work on our side. Our service goal is that you don’t notice we are doing our job, because everything always works. If it doesn’t work, you want support 24/7, which also has an administrative cost.</p>
<p>I love my job. It’s intellectually challenging and I enjoy the academic year cycle. I also work with wonderful employees across the university. Most are hard working and dedicated and bright. We accept lower pay than the industry standard because of the benefit of being in an intellectually stimulating environment. During my lunch I will often wander over to our art museum to see the latest exhibit, or watch the marching band practice, or take a walk in the union to see the student groups’ homecoming competition. I feel like what I’m doing is worthwhile.</p>
<p>I know when things don’t get done/aren’t available, people are upset, for example, if we don’t have our computer labs open/campus printers available, or if the trash doesn’t get emptied, or the walk-ways don’t get shoveled or treated for ice, or there isn’t food available for the students, or students can’t go online and submit their paper for a class right before the deadline, or view grades over the break (and they want the grades to be correct and they want an appeal process if they feel a mistake has been made). They want the classes they need to be offered so they can graduate on time. Applicants want to appeal their financial aid award, to see if a school will grant a little more money so a student can attend, or to match a competing school’s offer. When students transfer, they want their previous course work to count and apply toward their graduation requirements. All of these services require administrative planning, supervision and analysis.</p>
<p>I don’t have any answers, but before you lambaste a bunch of anonymous administrative university employees as worthless and overpaid, thought you might want to be aware of the kinds of things we do.</p>
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<p>LOL</p>
<p>Supposedly Conservatives evaluate things along the axis of civilization vs barbarism; Liberals looks at things as Oppressors and Oppressed; Libertarians look at coercion verses free choice. </p>
<p>You seem to view every issue as if someone is being offered cake. </p>
<p>I personally find it non-credible that in these massive budgets that have been growing faster than inflation that there is nothing that be cut, or no cost containment that can be done. You worry that any cut must necessarily come out of vital student services. </p>
<p>To clarify things here is information on the source of the data. "Administrative spending " seems to be defined in a way that doesnt include student-facing services. </p>
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<p>It wasnt an all-inclusive table. </p>
<p>Out of the ones you list there is:
Michigan State University $2,370</p>
<p>I agree with college_query on almost everything. Along with all of that, student and parent expectations are higher.</p>
<p>When you tour campuses, do you get excited about amazing fitness centers and food service? There is an arms race, such that schools feel they have to upgrade these. Unless they received big gifts to build new facilities (and, more important, to maintain them), these increase costs.</p>
<p>Parents also want more support services for their kids, including kids who probably would have gone to school closer to home in previous years, since they need a good deal of emotional support. It’s great that people who would have had more trouble being independent have better support away than they did, but these services cost money.</p>
<p>That said, upper administrators should take a careful look at their cost structure and pare away what’s not needed. There are likely offices that could be combined and costs saved. In some places, the number of administrators continues to grow even when faculty positions are being cut, thus reducing course options and programs of study. That doesn’t serve students well.</p>
<p>I rarely see bloated admin bureaucratic staffing at the undergraduate level. I see it daily at the graduate level. Full time MBA programs for 140 students with 10 staffers to babysit them. Same thing in other professional grad programs.</p>
<p>The Delta info does also reflect lowered admin spending. Breaks out instructional costs versus other categories. Also breaks out U’s by type. Easy read.</p>
<p>In the 2008 downturn, my U notched down thermostats in winter and notched up in summer, reviewed dorm mtc to identify mandatory vs discretionary projects, eliminated excess admin staff (retired some, delayed filling some positions, cut those hours if they did re-post - sometimes, from 40 to 32, then to under haf-time, even in front-end depts only covered by a small number,) in some cases cut back hours some services were offered (incl IT support,) reevaluated food services, suppport for student activities, costs of campus transpo services, reviewed adjunct commitments and salary raises, across the board. AND, increased the pool of finaid, to consider kids whose family had been hit hard and may need a review for both the upcomong 2nd semester and fall. </p>
<p>I am certain someone can find examples to the contrary. Some excess admin somewhere making the big bucks. Some nameable research prof getting a big salary. Prof DH didn’t get a raise for 3+ years. The adjuncts were pared, no replacements possible for profs on leave, some widening of teaching resps to make up the differences for the kids. </p>
<p>Try to take a peek inside, not just look at the common media- they have something to sell you.</p>
<p>Arg, the Delta distinguishes for public research U’s and I’m guessing $2370 is impossibly low.</p>
<p>Let them eat cake is NOT offering anyone cake. It’s a phrase about attitude.</p>
<p>Haystack, there are colleges now which have 5 times the number of employment counselors/placement officers in place than they did even ten years ago. Back in the day, students wandered in some time junior or senior year to figure out what they wanted to do when they graduated. Now there are parents of 17 year olds taking the admissions tour and demanding to see the career services office; wanting to meet the “Dean” who is going to take young Roger and get him an internship at JP Morgan or babysit Susie through the application process for the Rhodes or Fulbright. And another handful of folks to make sure that Jack or Jill don’t get “weeded out” by a pre-med pre-requisite.</p>
<p>Yes, bloated staffing, but what’s a college to do when parents expect other people to spoon feed their child on the way to adulthood???</p>
<p>I suspect argbargy just may not know the colloquial meaning of let them eat cake (though in the spirit of historical accuracy, Marie Antoinette didn’t actually say it).</p>
<p>I much prefer the all-inclusive higher level services my kids receive to what I had 30 years ago.</p>
<p>For the record, the Delta Project homepage, other reports: [The</a> Delta Cost Project on Postsecondary Education Costs, Productivity, and Accountability](<a href=“http://www.deltacostproject.org/]The”>http://www.deltacostproject.org/)</p>
<p>“Notes: Education-related spending includes instruction, research, student services, academic support, operation and maintenance and administrative costs. It excludes the costs of dormitories, dining halls, bookstores, hospitals and other ancillary operations. Administrative spending includes management of the university including human resources, legal, financial, purchasing and marketing operations, among others.
Source: U.S. Department of Education”</p>
<p>This is still a big so-what. Large organizations need HR people, they need lawyers, they need financial managers, they need purchasing people … And yes, they need marketing, as any intelligent organization does. I’m still not sure what the big deal is.</p>
<p>Btw, this “ed related spending” is just one category analyzed by Delta. They reflect E&R (ed & related) and E&G (ed & general) and explain themselves. I don’t want to harp on this org, but it’s a lot more focused than one reporter trying to write something snazzy by deadline.</p>
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<p>Never a big deal when its not your money…</p>
<p>a. we can drop the framing of this in terms of mental health cuts
b. this $4K a year is money that students are going to be financing and paying off over 15 years.</p>
<p>Arg- but what do you propose to do about it? Tell a university in a large metro area to cut back it’s security/police force? Explain to a college that they need to eliminate their bio and zoology departments because it’s too costly to maintain the personnel required to ensure that the animal labs are in compliance with federal and state regulations? Insist that all public U’s drop their med schools because the vast number of people required to monitor clinical regulations cost too much? Or have every student and employee who steps foot on a campus sign a release which states that if someone falls over a cracked sidewalk on campus or gets burned by a faulty electrical switch they waive the right to sue?</p>
<p>That will cut down on the number of non-instructional personnel. While you’re at it, just close the dorms- since most of the health and safety (i.e. non instructional costs) are associated with the risks and costs of housing so many adolescents. Outsource it all to Hyatt and Marriott and make them figure out how much it costs to run a dormitory.</p>