<p>^ “the kind of story that make adcoms wet their diapers” wow.</p>
<p>^ Absolutely nothing against this young person and may she go on to have a life that begins to heal what she endured as a child. It is simply ridiculous however for people to take this anecdote to mean that Harvard is now admitting students with average+ academic credentials.</p>
<p>^ 2nd that</p>
<p>Snowdog, I didn’t mean that you againsted the student. I wowed you for making your point on this matter so well. If you do not have that kind of special story to tell, then…</p>
<p>then,I guess that it will not easy for you to stand out.</p>
<p>You guys are arguing, but I don’t think anyone here has to be wrong–somebody on page 1 hoped that they’d see more of Harvard accounting for students rising from such socioeconomic disadvantage, Snowdog is arguing that a student with average scores still probably hasn’t a prayer. Those don’t have to be mutually contradictory. Given the difficulties she overcame, her scores are world-class.</p>
<p>exultationsy, “Given the difficulties she overcame, her scores are world-class.” - Do you mean you would secure getting admissions if you have world-class scores “in your circumstance”?</p>
<p>Secure? Probably not for anybody. But I don’t think I had ~7 more APs than she did and ~200 points on the SAT because I am one whit smarter. If she’d had my stable home situation and my ability to devote most of my non-school waking time to academics and academic extracurriculars, I’m sure she would have had a more number-heavy resume. </p>
<p>Although, on further thought, I’ll modify my statement to make explicit the floor I’d assumed. Her scores are still more-or-less competitive, which is why that worked. An immigrant who started learning English at age 13 and had to deal with a parent’s drug addiction and intermittent homelessness and still scored a 1650 on her SAT and a 3 on 3 APs would be very impressive, but would have not a prayer of admission to Harvard. This young woman’s SAT score, on the other hand, is competitive, if in or near the bottom quartile of admitted students. Her coursework (and, I’m sure, recommendations) would suggest that, again, had her life situation been more stable, she could have accomplished more than enough to be competitive for admission. I do still think her application was probably world-class, considering etc.</p>
<p>(although as a Harvard student who would not apply “world-class” to her own application, I am not certain “world class” vs. “very, very good and lucky enough to hit the right buttons” is required for admission)</p>
<p>^ You have mentioned “world-class” repeatedly. What’s world-class scores to you? Do you consider kids rejected by Harvard as someone who do not have world-class scores under their own circumstances?</p>
<p>I was copying Snowdog’s language–it would not have been my own choice of words. If I were to define “world-class” as I’ve been using it, it would be the truly exceptional candidates–the top 10% of strongest admitted students. So, about .6% of the applicant pool, the ones who get absolutely clear yesses. I think this girl is one of those. I’m sure a few mistakes are made, but not very many. The two Harvard applicants I’ve known whom I might (maybe) have thought were world-class and didn’t get in were both waitlisted. I have not known a person I would have guessed was in the top ~.5% of the applicant pool to be rejected.</p>
<p>^ “The two Harvard applicants I’ve known whom I might (maybe) have thought were world-class and didn’t get in were both waitlisted. I have not known a person I would have guessed was in the top ~.5% of the applicant pool to be rejected.” - Whatever way you define “world-class”, reality is that Harvard can not hold all those “world-class” kids. They have to pick and choose. You are a world-class does not mean you deserve to request admission for you. I hear IMO kids have been rejected in the past as well. Besides, nowadays, there are plenty of kids who are rejected by all Ivy(or equivalent) schools they applied but saved by just one school, Harvard. You can not predict if you would get in until you actually try it. Such unique story stand out for getting admissions.</p>
<p>Our wires have gotten crossed, and that’s my fault. In my last post, I defined “world-class applicant.” You wanted to know how I was defining “world-class scores.” My definition of a world-class applicant is the stratosphere, the “clear yesses,” within Harvard. That is an exceedingly narrow category. I, for instance, am not and was never “world class.” I was both good and very lucky. Most of Harvard’s student body was likewise very good and very lucky. I believe that there are some truly “world-class” applicants running around out there, but it can be hard to tell who they are from the outside because you’re operating under very limited (rec- and essay- and probably transcript- and full-resume-free) information. You, on the other hand, wanted to know what I meant by “world-class” scores.I was just using “world-class” scores to mean “competitive for Harvard and its peers.” There are definitely many more of those than Harvard can admit, and I never meant to argue otherwise. All I meant to argue was that for Dawn, the threshold of what set of scores are “world-class” dips rather lower than it would have for suburban, sheltered me. Once those scores qualify us, which I think hers clearly do given her background, we are admitted based on recs/essays/resume. She passes the “world-class” scores test because of how difficult her situation has been, while the average suburban white kid requires maybe another hundred points on the SAT and probably a lot more APs to do the same. Passing that numerical minimums alone never has, and never can given how many students pass that test, grant admission to Harvard.</p>
<p>… Yeah I just thought it was a feel-good, inspirational story. No need to start a whole debacle over it, eh?</p>
<p>Yeah, I’ve been trying to extricate myself from some initial unclear phrasing (in an attempt to wade in and quell a debacle! that worked out.) for a while now. Such is the internet. Specifically, such are anonymous internet forums. Oh well.</p>
<p>^ real talk.</p>