<p>Consolation (and others): So what would you recommend as financial/admissions safeties for an intellectual student in the humanities who greatly values high-level class discussion?</p>
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So what would you recommend as financial/admissions safeties for an intellectual student in the humanities who greatly values high-level class discussion?
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<p>I would recommend an honors program at a large state university that also has a graduate program in the student's major and will allow advanced undergraduates to take graduate courses. The honors program and/or acceleration should provide opportunities for high-level discussion during the first part of college, and graduate-level courses should provide it during the later years.</p>
<p>^^absolutely agree with Marian -- and these opportunities ARE available at some honors programs. It's incredibly important to do due diligence and research when considering honors programs and how they will fit (or not) with a particular student's needs and goals.</p>
<p>While one person's safety is another person's reach, I agree that Marian's strategy is a good one. BUT one must bear in mind that an OOS student at a place such as the University of Michigan--which would seem likely to have the kind of program she describes--will probably pay at least as much and likely more than s/he might have to pay at a private LAC or university with need-based and/or merit aid. So it is a complicated picture.</p>
<p>The ideal situation is to get into a school with deep pockets and good FA, such as some of the Ivies and elite LACs. But of course, they aren't safeties. If your in-state flagship fits the bill, great. If you can get a big scholarship at a flagship available to OOS students, great. (Although the likelihood is that if you can get that you can also get into one of the deep pockets schools.)</p>
<p>As orchestramom says, doing due diligence about the specifics of a program is essential. I would add that doing the same thing about the FA situation is also key.</p>
<p>Keilexandra, it is a difficult position to be in. Our financial situation right now is so bad that our S had to get almost a full ride to avoid crushing debt. So he <em>had</em> to get into at least one of those deep pocket schools. Luckily, he did. His safety school actually gave him the <em>least</em> amount of FA overall.</p>
<p>^ Hey, not only U of M would be extremely expensive for OOS. Many others less known and much lower ranked schools will be also very expensive for OOS. Stick to your in-state Honors, if $$ is important consideration.</p>
<p>Ill put in my own situation about this as well. Being from Canada and moving to the USA is going to be stressful enough but now the school has approached my D to be in the honors program and she is afraid that it will segregate her from a lot of students. Yes she would get seperate dorms, private computer labs, priority scheduling of courses, etc. She is already a bit afraid that she will be looked at as an outsider by some because of being an International student and she does not want the honors label to make it worse. We are trying to tell her that being an honors student can open a lot of extra doors for her later but on the other hand we completely understand her feeling.</p>
<p>Percussiondad, It would help to know the name of the school, but...</p>
<p>My advice to your daughter would be to opt for the honors program. Remind her that if she doesn't, she might not get into the courses she wants, especially first year. Remind her too that if she has the stats to be offered honors, most of the kids with the same sorts of stats will too and she is going to have a harder time meeting "her people" if they are all in honors and she isn't. </p>
<p>Stress the fact that if she joins the honors program and finds that she dislikes it, she can always quit it. If she doesn't join it and figures out later that she wishes she had, it will probably be a lot harder to change her decision.</p>
<p>I'm a Canadian living in the U.S. and I can tell you with assurance tht 99% of people assume I'm from the U.S. My being Canadian rarely comes up in any context since I speak the language fluently and cultural cues are similar. I don't think being Canadian will separate your daughter from others.</p>
<p>I don't think that most Americans think of English-speaking Canadians as international students. Many of us have trouble even remembering that you are foreign (yes, I know this is offensive, but it's true for a lot of Americans). I cannot imagine that being Canadian would make your daughter an outsider on any U.S. campus. It just means that her passport is a different color than most other people's.</p>
<p>percussiondad, I think your daughter ought to consider the possibility that NOT being in the honors program would segregate her from students of comparable ability, most of whom will opt to live in the honors dorms.</p>
<p>It is not offensive to say that you forget we are foreign. It actually makes me feel good to hear that. The school is SUNY Potsdam and you are right that she needs to look at the big picture of what it means in the long run. She just let me know (10 minutes ago) that she called the Prof in charge and is going down to speak to them in April and to have the whole honors program explained to her before making her decision. I think that is a good move and will clear the air for her and will help her make the right choice</p>
<p>Definitely encourage your D to go with the Honors program- she’ll want to be with her academic peers, especially if they segregate them in the dorms (not all schools do). Not all college students are equally intellectual and finding those she can be on a same wavelength is good.</p>
<p>OP- definitely consider the peer group at a small less selective college- go for the one where more students have stats comparable to your child’s, likely the more selective one.</p>
<p>My son is a freshman at a large OOS state flagship that he chose because of its strength in his intended major. He’s in the honors program and has taken a couple of honors classes so far that he has enjoyed. I am more and more convinced as the year goes by that he’s happy and successful in large part because of his personality and learning style. He is a very smart kid with deep intellectual curiosity, and he’s told me that he’s found intellectual peers that he did not have in HS. People sometimes ask me if he is challenged, and I say yes. He is the kind of person who finds his own challenge–from inside himself, by seeking out others who share his interests, and just because he loves learning stuff. And yes, also from his professors and fellow students. Being in an honors dorm has made a difference. These friends are likely to be his friends through college, though I’m sure he’ll continue to make more. For us, the main consideration in college choice was cost. He could not have gone to a big-name private college without incurring lifelong debt (we are older parents, don’t qualify for need-based aid, and have other restricting issues). And he didn’t want to.</p>
<p>So a smart kid at a state university might have to rub shoulders with people who are not as smart as he/she is. Is that a bad thing? I realize that this is a common point of view on CC, and there are probably people here who would start posting data that say it is detrimental to one’s intellectual health. What about the learning that goes on independently, outside of class? What about those “average” students whose intellect blossoms in college? Don’t let anyone tell you that you are shortchanging your child if an honors program at a state university is what works out best for your family.</p>
<p>One thing I hadn’t realized about the honors college at a large state university is that it opens up opportunities for many areas of study that are just unavailable at most smaller schools. If the honors college staff is proactive, and your child is too, there are a lot of research and advanced study programs that could make a real difference. </p>
<p>There are pluses and minuses to every choice, of course, and a lot of state universities have honors colleges that don’t actually provide much more than the designation, but some do provide really remarkable opportunities, and at what can be a very low cost.</p>