There is a problem with AA drivers. They drive too slow. So slow as to make you crazy, sometimes 5-10 mph below the speed limit, but for good reason. Michigan students randomly cross campus streets without looking, at crosswalks against lights, and glare at you if you come too close. They do it regardless of the weather and your ability to stop or see them. It’s like a neighborhood full of 3 year olds. In the old days they read their books while walking, now they stare at their smartphones.
Off campus drivers retain the same driving habits, and you will always be stuck behind them because most roads are 2 lane. The traffic is awful during rush hour too so I just walk, take the bus or ride my bike these days to save time. My wife works at the U and it takes her as much time to commute 3 miles in Ann Arbor as her remote clinic 25 miles away.
Living “off campus” is the norm at many universities including some very famous ones like University of Chicago, NYU, Georgetown, Northwestern, Notre Dame, UVA, University of California etc. The difference at Michigan is that the campus is huge and covers a large area, and 99% of the houses students live in are located within this area. Most are no more than a 10 minute walk to academic buildings (conversely some dorms are much farther away).
Students generally form into groups during their freshman or sophomore years and them move into “group houses”. For those who to prefer to stay on campus, this is generally possible. What makes UM so cool is that there really is no “on campus” vs. “off campus” divide.
@Razzyreb one idea is for your D to join an accepted students Facebook group. They often learn from each other and feel better about it all going in! Good luck!
I can see where after your experience with your first two it would be hard to wrap your mind around a very different housing system. I think what most people on here are trying to tell you is that it is different from what you are used to, but not worse. Be assured that living off-campus in Ann Arbor is in no way like a community college experience! The town and campus of Ann Arbor is ranked as one of the best college towns for a reason! Michigan’s housing system, in which most non-freshman live off campus, is like most other large campuses and has definite benefits as well. Number one, it is often much cheaper than room and board for a dorm. Also, students, who are young adults, often prefer the freedom of a house or apartment over a dorm. And there are so many options that you can always find a living situation that fits your preferences.
It would be impossible for a school the size of Michigan to provide housing for all students, and as noted, many don’t want it. The few larger schools that guarantee housing are usually located in very expensive cities where students could not afford to live otherwise.
It is your decision of course, but I would recommend that you not let this be a deal breaker if she likes Michigan. There is a reason almost 60,000 people applied to Michigan this year!
As others have noted, if a sophomore wants to remain on campus, they almost certainly can. Michigan has a wide range of on campus housing options, including substance free housing and a sophomore only dorm (Stockwell Hall, which is a beautiful dorm).
The reality is that most students look forward to moving off campus because of the freedom and independence that comes with living with friends in a house or apartment. Your daughter may be anxious about it now, but a student’s perspective can change between freshman and junior year. Cornell has a very similar housing “culture”.
A car is completely unnecessary in AA, which is pedestrian friendly. It is a great college town which significantly enhances the student experience at Michigan.
Finally, on the cost question, yes Michigan gives extremely little merit aid…but merit aid is not a reward for a high level of HS achievement. If that were the case, most of the freshman class at Michigan would be getting merit aid. Other state universities use merit aid to entice high achieving OOS students to enroll. Michigan doesn’t have to do that.
Lol @TooOld4School very true on being very aware of students crossing roads anytime, anywhere - that’s how I did it in the day too. Also, I drive slow in AA because of the potholes - horrendous - probably my biggest AA complaint.
I can vouch for that. Almost everyone at Cornell moves “off campus” sophomore year. But off campus is an all-student area, so it doesn’t feel like you are leaving the confines of college life. Like Ann Arbor, Ithaca is a college town. Everywhere you go, everything revolves around the college. You can’t really get away from the college vibe, even "off campus.’ It’s like the entire town is “campus.”
@exlibris “Living “off campus” is the norm at many universities including some very famous ones like University of Chicago, NYU, Georgetown, Northwestern, Notre Dame, UVA, University of California etc.” @brantly “First, is there any chance your daughter will choose Greek life?”
"I can vouch for that. Almost everyone at Cornell moves “off campus” sophomore year. But off campus is an all-student area, so it doesn’t feel like you are leaving the confines of college life. Like Ann Arbor, Ithaca is a college town. Everywhere you go, everything revolves around the college. You can’t really get away from the college vibe, even “off campus.’ It’s like the entire town is “campus.””
Thanks all for your support, but, with the exception of Northwestern and NYU, we are not looking at the other places because they don’t offer what Michigan, Northwestern, or NYU has in terms of what my D is looking for. Greek life is out. We are comparing apples with apples in terms of suitability for a program and all that it entails.
You all really love Michigan and I respect that very much. It must have been a very special experience for you guys.
That’s a bit of a stretch, unless you are fine living in a dorm like Bursley or Northwood Apartments.
Stockwell and North Quad spots, along with non-freshmen rooms in other dorms like Couzens and Alice Lloyd go fast. If you are not in the “first round draft” for picking on-campus housing, you are out of luck.
@brantly Thanks for the congrats, but my point was not to interpret that she got into NU and the other schools. She did get into some great schools, including a few of the ones named, but not NU. On another point, I’ve been doing more research including speaking with the school and learned a few more details. Unfortunately, due to my working hours, I was only able to reach the campus police. The school’s housing office has regular business hours, so I’ve been unable to reach them during the day. I’ll try again tomorrow.
@dtrain1027 “Finally, on the cost question, yes Michigan gives extremely little merit aid…but merit aid is not a reward for a high level of HS achievement. If that were the case, most of the freshman class at Michigan would be getting merit aid. Other state universities use merit aid to entice high achieving OOS students to enroll. Michigan doesn’t have to do that.”
I don’t know if I would agree with you on these points. I know quite a few hard working and high achieving students and their parents, and I’ve never had any of them say that merit money is not a reward for their level of achievement. In fact, of the ones I know, they would jump at merit aid from a high ranking reputable school. I can name a few students who chose lower costs schools instead of Ivies and other costly prestigious schools so that they would have a chance to enter the work force and/or graduate school debt free. A hard working high achieving student already knows what it takes to succeed in life, so they really don’t need a name brand school to make it in life.
They do, however, need to be in a good program for their life’s interest. Based on its retention and graduation rate, I would argue that Michigan is doing something else right in order to attract these students – they are investing their money into great academic resources. Otherwise, I think these OOS high achieving students might look elsewhere. Just because OOS students apply to costly schools, it doesn’t mean their pockets are deeper than those students who apply in-state.
@Razzyreb Actually Umich has always had a high presence of out of state students and University of Michigan was recently ranked the #1 public university with the wealthiest students in the United States. So yes, most OOS students at Umich are pretty wealthy.
@Razzyreb Michigan’s Regents and Administration have been very clear: merit aid is a very low priority. In-state tuition is still a bargain, and with Go Blue and other initiatives, the vast majority of in-state students can attend regardless of their finances. The University is now focusing on improving OOS financial aid. It’s committed to meeting the full need of OOS with family incomes under $90k (as mentioned on their website), but need-based FA is a major priority. Their fund raising campaigns are highlighting this.
For most students, Michigan remains very affordable. Perhaps we should make more financial aid available across the board. But that’s another topic. And the proposed cuts to Pell Grants, CWS and SEOGs makes this seem unlikely.
@Razzyreb most kids want to go off campus sophomore year. so if your D does not, and is detail oriented about jumping right on the housing emails, it should be fine for her to stay on campus. Esp if she does a LLC. And oncampus R&R is actually not terribly priced at Mich, so it’s a good choice.
@dtrain1027 simply means that while some publics “court” good students w/merit aid, UM has so many of that quality of student, they typically do not bother. They have a small number of merit scholarships. So yes, they are for a job well done. But since half of the freshman class are perfect students, it’s not really for that there.
If your daughter doesn’t mind all-female residence halls, she will have some great options. Martha Cook, Betsy Barbara and Newberry (next to the Michigan Union) are all very conveniently located. Martha Cook is mostly sophomore and upperclassmen. I know a student who lived in Betsy Barbour for three, if not all four years.
Merit awards at Michigan for OOS are limited to a small number of engineering, nursing and Musical Theater students. Engineering merit $ almost always for extremely high stats applicants (34-36 composite ACT).
@HRSMom, yes many if not most publics, including flagships, will discount tuition for academically strong OOS applicants. Alabama offers free tuition to any OOS applicant with a 3.5 and a 32 or better on the ACT. Alabama also offers a 2/3 tuition discount if you have a 30 or better on the ACT. Ohio State offers $12,500 in discount for OOS students with over 29 on the ACT and in the top 25% of their HS class. Michigan is one of a handful (also UVa, William and Mary, UNC, Cal and UCLA) that have a surplus of OOS applicants ready and willing to pay full OOS tuition. Those families see value in paying more to go to Michigan and other public elites.
That is an inaccurate statement. First, there are scholarships in LSA also which is $10k-$20k per year for OOS just as those for CoE. Second, for a school like UMich with very high admission stat, the top few percent of admitted students that may get merit scholarship must have very high stat which is higher than than the 75th percentile (34 in ACT was just the 75th percentile for UMich overall last year). Indeed, 34 would not be considered “extremely high stats” in CoE but just above admission average, while most students with ACT 35 still do not get much, if at all, merit scholarship. Test scores and GPA are not the only consideration in their merit scholarships although they are typically required. For Music school, the criteria for merit scholarships are totally different. For any school, pure merit scholarships would be limited to “a small number” of students anyway.
@billcsho, I’ll take your word for it that merit scholarships are available for OOS LSA students as well, but they are few and far between. My broader point is that Michigan does not engage in widespread tuition discounts off of sticker price in the way that most other flagships do to entice top students.