<p>Twins Ds are only sophomore but curious about the FA process. I estimate D1 to have an ACT of 32 and D2 to score a 26. for ease I'll assume an EFC of 10K. If D1 goes to a need based school and D1 and D2 both go to a need based school, does each school get EFC of 5K?<br>
Curious how it has worked for others parts of the process such as, are the FA numbers finalized once both girls decide on their school.<br>
How has it worked for you if you had twins?</p>
<p>I have a couple of international friends who are identical twins. They both applied to the same rolling admissions school, and they had similar academics. They both received a great and exactly equal 35,000.
I remember however both made it clear in their supplements they would not attend the school without the other twin. </p>
<p>I have twins and my understanding is that your total EFC is divided in half. Or in 3rds if you have 3 kids in college and so on. My twins are seniors now, going through it all as I write this.</p>
<p>It works the same way with twins as it does when a family has two in college at the same time. </p>
<p>FAFSA EFC splits.</p>
<p>BUT…FAFSA only schools do not meet need. They tend to give lousy aid, so usually you have to pay a lot more than EFC.</p>
<p>I suggest that you use some Net Price Calculators on each school’s website.</p>
<p>An EFC of $10k suggests an income of about $70k with one kid in college. An income of about $100k has an EFC of $25k.</p>
<p>BUT…EFC is a misnomer. IT IS NOT the real family contribution. It is just to figure Fed aid which isn’t much. The federal gov’t has no authority to require colleges to provide the rest of the money…because most schools don’t have much money.</p>
<p>Usually the schools that give the BEST aid require CSS Profile. And they usually require highish test scores. </p>
<p>Often when a family has two in college at the same time, they find that they don’t really get much/any discount or extra aid because one or both kids doesn’t have the stats to get into a school with great aid.</p>
<p>Run the NPC’s on a variety of schools’ websites. Start with your state flagship, include a few different privates, etc. </p>
<p>Don’t use HYPS as a guideline because those schools give rare SUPER aid. </p>
<p>Twins or not, most schools figure a EFC, and then if there is another child the actual parents’ portion is about 1/2. The EFCs may not be identical because schools figure them differently and the kids may have different assets. I have two kids starting this year and they have a difference of about $400 on their personal assets, so the EFC is not identical but close.</p>
<p>However, it doesn’t matter because neither is getting need based financial aid. There may be some hope of work study, but that’s about it. I think you are asking if D1 goes to a ‘meets need’ school, will the school cut your EFC in half? Probably, but you need to know that they may meet the need by offering loans, not grants, and you’ll still be paying.</p>
<p>D1 may get merit based awards, but they will still expect you to meet the EFC</p>
<p>My twins got similar awards but sometimes, one would get an extra award because she said she interested in majoring in Bio or for volunteering a lot…some schools were more generous with our EFC, others not as much. Nothing was concrete with the same numbers. Some gave more loans, some more awards, some gave Perkins, some said we didn’t qualify.
I had a fafsa only school (Marist) give them great merit and need-based aid…more than others with CSS Profile, which is odd. I learned nothing is written in stone and you never quite have it figured out. ; )
I think the only advantage with twins is they stay in together…having 2 in college but a year or two apart, effects aid when they leave. I had my son in for one year when they started and then it changed when he graduated, but one of my twins schools considered him “in school” because of grad school and living at home but not at the same percentage (at that point anything was appreciated)
They both received work study, but one over 1000, one 900 a semester.
Good luck…it’s a roller coaster ride…fun at times, other times a bit overwhelming.</p>
<p>From what I have read and heard, PROFILE schools will split the parent’s contibution by multiplying it by 60%, not half like the FAFSA EFC is split But I don’t know any FAFSA schools that guarantee to meet full need either. </p>
<p>GW in DC, will used to halve the tuition for a second student at that school at the same time, which makes it a good deal for twins if you don’t qualify for fin aid.</p>
<p>The fact of the matter is that it depends upon the schools and the kids. A school that doesn’t guarantee to meet need can give you whatever package and just gap. The FAFSA EFC might well be the absolute minimum you could be paying, and you may not get close to that number–it’s just a limit.</p>
<p>We had 4 in college at the same time…triplets plus an older brother. As has been mentioned EFC was split 4 ways. Each of their schools handled (state universities) things pretty much the same way.</p>
<p>My twins had nearly identical stats and applied to 10 of the same schools (3 different) - they received identical results from all 10 schools. Accepted at the same ones, wait listed at the same and declined from the same. It was weird. So, the financial aid offers were also identical despite the fact that one was in engineering and one was undeclared. As others have noted, the EFC is just what FAFSA has determined you can pay for total college costs all together then that number is divided by the number of kids in college. My singleton EFC would have been $13k. But since I had 2 in college each of their EFC’s were about $6.5k with a small variance due to their different bank account balances. They ended up attending the same school (a CSS profile school) but got gapped by about $17k each even after the max on allowable student loans, 2k each in work study and each getting 36k in grants! Pretty amazing - so hard to catch a break on the expense. The biggest frustration was actually with schools (the one they now attend and the ones they applied to) frequently mixing up the paperwork for various things through the application process and most recently even misfiling work study checks at school and accidentally giving the wrong checks to the wrong twin. This in a very large school of 35k students! But then if you have identical twins, you already know that these mix ups happen all the time – and so it continues in college too! I am sure that with the very different ACT stats of OP’s twins, the financial aid awards will come back quite different too, but their EFC will not change. That number is calculated by FAFSA based on the parents financial info. It’s what the schools choose to DO with that number that varies widely amongst schools and remains a very mysterious and unregulated process, unfortunately. Strap your boots on-- it’s definitely a crazy ride. </p>
<p>Thanks for the replies. I have fraternal twins and it is very obvious when comparing their academic records. As I stated, I expect D1 to have generally high scores for the SAT and ACT and she wants to be an engineer. D2 will have good scores, 25-28 depending on her preparation with a major in Bio or Chem and will attend a school that is appropriate for her scores.<br>
Beside the FA game, I also have to manage how to distribute my GI bill with the girls which will cover 24 months of study which should be about 3 years of college. </p>
<p>Thanks for all those that input here. Mom2collegekids you did a great job of explaining EFC and what types of schools meet need, etc. It takes a lot of work to find good fit schools for your student(s) and also fits financially bc there are so many variables. My girls applied to 11 of the same and a few different. We have 1 super financial fit but expect we will have to make some tough decisions in April. I think I am just inclined to sit back at this point and stop stressing about it. When the financial info. comes in, we will go from there. Advise always welcome though :)</p>
<p>Since I think the Dad thinks that EFC is the amount that a family pays, it’s important that he note the following:</p>
<p>’**My twins had nearly identical stats ** and applied to 10 of the same schools (3 different) - they received identical results from all 10 schools. </p>
<p>My singleton EFC would have been $13k. **But since I had 2 in college each of their EFC’s were about $6.5k **with a small variance due to their different bank account balances. They ended up attending the same school (a CSS profile school) but got gapped by about $17k each even after the max on allowable student loans,"</p>
<p>The above is NOT unusual. Each twin had an EFC of 6.5k However, their school expected EACH twin to pay over $20k each. So, a family whose total EFC was $13k for two kids, was expected to pay over $40k…even after max student loans!!</p>
<p>Dad…you have to be especially careful because the twin with the likely lower scores will not likely get into a school with great aid. Some schools practice “preferential packaging” which means those with the best scores get the best aid (or merit). GPA is rather irrelevant except it “backs up” the test score for merit awards. </p>
<p>Your D who will likely score much higher has some opportunities to get some large merit at the SCHOOLS that award merit for THOSE stats (not all schools do). </p>
<p>To find large merit, your D’s scores need to be well-within the top 25% of the school. So, you’d need to find schools that give large merit where the upper-quartile test scores are like ACT 29-36.</p>
<p>Also have BOTH girls take the SAT. Some kids do better and maybe the other twin may do better on that. </p>
<p>If after running some NPCs at schools that might accept your Ds, you may find that the ACT 26 D’s likely schools will not provide enough aid. When some families find themselves in this possible situation, to enable both kids to get a similar college experience, the family looks where the high ACT child can get LOTS of merit or aid (maybe a free ride), so that the family can still afford to pay for the lower ACT child. </p>
<p>Since your Ds are only sophs, I suggest signing them both up for the May or June SAT. This will be a baseline and practice for their Junior year PSAT. Your ACT 32 D could score high enough on the PSAT that she’ll make NMSF. IF so, that could mean HUGE scholarships at some schools. </p>
<p>Not twins but kids close in age and in college at the same time. One was a better student and was admitted to a college which purports to meet need. We were lucky and her portion was 60% of our EFC. Other kid was not the student the other was and ended up at a state school. Nothing extra was offered for him. Maybe a VERY small subsided loan but that was it. Nothing, nada for having 2 in school at the same time. </p>
<p>We thought we won the lottery to have one who gained admission to a school which met our FAFSA EFC. </p>
<p>The kid who wasn’t the better student, I think he was admitted to 8 schools and he seriously considered 4 of them. He got merit all of them (high ACT/low GPA) and his offers were within $500 of each other. </p>
<p>Kid who was the better student was admitted to 8 also and her packages were all over the place. I think she was admitted to 2 who said they meet need. The offers were $10,000 apart! She was offered almost full tuition at one school but the school that met our need was the better school for her.</p>
<p>mom2collegekids. both girls took the PSAT as sophomores. Didn’t study for it but I wanted them to see how well they would do and see what they need to study. D1 was 187 and D2 was 134. They both know what they need to study this summer to get ready for test. They both took the PLAN (ACT) test also and D1 had a 26 and D2 a 21.<br>
I know D2 will study since she wants to beat my scores and her score is comparable to what I got as a sophomore. D1 will be more of the issue getting her to get her scores to an ACT over 30 and PSAT over 215, state NMSF score. She doesn’t have to study much and get good grades in her AP test. I believe she studied an hour for her finals this year and got all As. Needs to work on her study habits if she wants to study engineering…
I have one goal. which is to get them into college without breaking us or them with college loans and having them not worry about money. their mother had no help, advice or financial, from her family in preparing for college and spent her two years eating PB&J two meals a day due to finances. Things got better once she got her ROTC scholarship. The sad part about my wife’s side of the family is the prior family history for college. Her great grandfather went to Carneige Mellon and MIT for physics and taught at a couple of college in the early 1900s. Her grandfather, the youngest of the family, became a coal miner. Her dad had no money for college since he was third oldest and did the army, and basically is an EE without the college degree and does Large power generator start ups outside the US.<br>
I was a first gen kid and went to a private college and understand how you have to apply and see what they offer for FA.
I have talked to D2 about college selection. I told she has to be careful if she picks a top school, she will be surrounded by a majority of kids like her sister and two of her childhood friend who had higher scores than D1. She did see how they could make college difficult since she wants a science major. A buddy from high school was a NMSF, went to Rice and flunked out 3 times.She knows she can get into a good university and still have great opportunities during and after college. </p>
<p>With D1’s PSAT, she does have a chance of making NMSF next time. I would have them take the SAT in May or June to see if they’ve improved from Soph PSAT…and to give them more of a heads up as to where they are weak for Jr PSAT. </p>
<p>You need to be clear to both kids exactly how much you can spend on each child. If it’s $10k per child ($20k per year total) then tell them that. If it’s more or less, let them know. Let them know that you wont’ co-sign loans.</p>
<p>Obviously, if you can only contribute $10k per child then they will need at least full tuition in aid/merit so that your $10k and a small student loan can pay for room, board, books, etc. I know that you don’t want them to take out federal student loans, but those loans will likely be packaged in their FA pkgs. To avoid them, you’ll have to pay about $11k more per year for both. </p>
<p>IF D2 wants to be a science major, then she’s best to attend a good reputable school. Frankly, if she does end up with an ACT 26, it is highly doubtful that a “top school” would accept her. Top schools tend to expect an ACT 30+…and those with lower scores are usually athletes or other special admits. That said, that’s ok…Most schools have very good science programs so her flagship or “nice private” will likely have a very good science program. :)</p>
<p>I agree that D1 needs to work on study habits for eng’g. Unless she’s super-naturally brilliant, studying for an hour as an eng’g major will mean flunking out. lol Many smart kids stumble when they get to college because they didn’t have to study much for their A’s. Their first semester grades are a big wake-up call. 
My son graduated with an eng’g degree last March. He was Sal of his class, very high SATs…but he had to study and work hard for his Eng’g grades. He missed many social events because of homework, being in the lab, or studying. </p>
<p>The EFC is generally the lowest amount you can expect to pay, and good for you if you can find a school that will require only that much in payment! The schools that guarantee to meet full need tend to use PROFILE and have their own contribution amounts they calculate and they tend to be more than the EFC. The vast majority of schools in this country do not meet need at all, so the EFC is just a number to see if you qualify for PELL and, as said before, gives you an absolute minimum you can pay before getting government funds in terms of subsidized loans, SEOGH, workstudy funds, etc.</p>
<p>Merit money…well if the school gives you merit, it comes right off your need when their financial aid department looks at your file, so you have to get more than you can get from need before you net out. Outside scholarships tend to be used to reduce awards, though they usually reduce self help such as loans and work study first. So it’s hard to pay just that EFC. </p>
<p>dad of twins</p>
<p>You mention that your kids have post 9/11 GI bill. I was just at a presentation at the engineering school my daughter is going to attend, and some of it went over my head, but the AD was talking about this school being a ‘yellow ribbon’ school and any tuition that isn’t paid by the govt the school makes up as aid . He said there is also a pretty big housing allowance. This school also gives $2500 to each child if siblings attend. </p>
<p>Look for the ‘yellow ribbon’ schools.</p>
<p>" I also have to manage how to distribute my GI bill with the girls which will cover 24 months of study which should be about 3 years of college."</p>
<p>Would a semester be counted as 4 months? </p>
<p>So, the benefits would be split? </p>
<p>Yes, to the above…Yellow Ribbon Schools will contribute some money towards the OOS portion, but that may bite you in the hiney after the GI bill runs out and you have to pay full OOS rate. </p>
<p>The range that a school will contribute can be $1000 up to the full OOS difference…just depends on the school. </p>
<p>Also, some YR schools LIMIT the number of students who’ll they’ll pay the difference for. There is a list, which you probably already know about. </p>
<p><a href=“Yellow Ribbon Program Information 2013 - 2014 School Year - Education and Training”>404 - Page Not Found - Veterans Benefits Administration;
<p>the above is by states.</p>
<p>Have you run any NPCs on various schools’ websites? ( I would do an instate flagship, an OOS public, a mid-tier private, and a top private (not HYPS) to get a range of results). What results are you seeing? </p>
<p>I’d first go to the Fafsa forecaster, to get ballpark on your EFC, then add up a bit. Then go to the NPCs. They’re sophs and things change, so you’ll need to revisit the process, once in a while. The forecaster is just an optional first step, but does save you from thinking up colleges and checking, one by one by one.</p>
<p>The issue of inequalities in finaid is real. Carefully read college FA info on their sites, to understand “how” they offer aid. Some meet full “need” by including loans. </p>
<p>Some say SAT scores will be x points higher than the PSAT. Many kids do better on the ACT than SAT or vice versa. But, know that some colleges will see all test “tries.” </p>
<p>mom2collegekids
I have seen how well the yellow ribbon program works. My wife changed careers and went to year long nursing program. Small private college and I didn’t pay a dime.<br>
My goal is to get D1 a full ride once she gets her scores up. As she wants to be a engineer, I believe she could get decent assistance for an engineering school or university with a strong program. Then I need to worry about the first year of D2 tuition. Of course these are long term goals I need to help guide and influence my daughters, keep grades up and study for PSAT, so they can get a good education at the best possible schools that won’t bankrupt them or us.<br>
I told them it is up to them to pick their school as I have no requirement for a specific named college or university.</p>