<p>So I've recently been taken off the waitlist (self-congratulatory "yay") and I submitted my deposit at UPenn. The thing I really loved about UPenn was the flexibility of the program, and the fact that so many people were able to pursue minors. Does anyone know how that situation works at Columbia SEAS?</p>
<p>Oh, and if anyone can help me out with this too: my major is biomedical engineering at Columbia, and bioengineering at UPenn. My understanding is that UPenn is ranked higher than Columbia, and I'd like to know why. Like, are the reasons stupid, or are they legitimate reasons that I should consider? A general comparison of the two programs would be very helpful! </p>
<p>^bme at penn might be better, but columbia seas is better overall i'd say. Columbia bme is still good, and really popular and really tough, it is one of the toughest majors in the whole school, if not the toughest. almost everyone at columbia seas minors in something, some people do 2 minors, a small % manage to double major, but you probably won't be able to double major if you're doing bme.</p>
<p>I honestly wouldn't worry too much about the rankings, they're an indicator but still pretty imperfect. I don't see columbia's bme lacking in any way. what are you your long term goals: med-school, law-school, wall street, scientific research...?</p>
<p>My long term goals aren't all that clear, but I'd say that med school and wall street are definitely two options that I'm interested in. Actually, come to think of it, law school seems cool too because I like PoliSci. Probably not scientific research though--I've heard too many horror stories about aspirations being crushed. </p>
<p>if this is the case, the rankings are meaningless, because they deal with the purer engineering aspect of the programs. for both med school and wall street columbia seas at least matches penn. At penn you aren't going to wharton, which i would say places better on wall street than columbia seas, penn seas - i'd say not just because columbia has the proximity. for law school i'd say columbia has the edge, pre-med they're equivalent. they're just very comparable in many ways, the prestige, quality of education and job placements all make a negligible difference. Choose based on atmosphere, location and curriculum (or any other soft factors which are important to you).</p>
<p>Ahh, I'm torn then, if I base it on atmosphere, location and curriculum! I just loved, loved Penn's campus (all those cherry blossoms, the open grass areas, the size, just beautiful!). Columbia's campus was impressive for sure, but it was too small for my taste. I went on a Friday (and b/c they don't have school on that day apparently), it was SO crowded and chaotic. There wasn't a single grassy spot on campus that was quiet. Personally, I hated that. OTOH, I can't deny the lure of NYC, and the fact that Philadelphia has a murder rate of 1 person/day is certainly not encouraging. Also, I liked the quirkiness of Columbia's student body. Penn was a bit too preppy.</p>
<p>Oh my. Well, I guess it rests on the financial aid I get from Columbia.</p>
<p>That's a tough decision, to be sure. Just a note about the size of Columbia's campus and the amount of "quiet space": what time of year did you visit? Because aside from the warm-weather visits I've made, I've strolled around Columbia's campus many times and found it wonderfully calm (almost too calm--I wish I had experienced more of the "chaos" you saw so I could be reassured that campus life actually exists). It's been the one or two times I've gone on a warm, sunny day that I've seen lots of campus activity, and I think that's a nice change from the quiet I saw on other visits. My point, basically, is that the busy campus feeling seems to be seasonal, and it shouldn't be too hard to find peaceful space to yourself at other times of the week or of the year.</p>
<p>NightOwl, I went mid April, I think, and on a Friday. There were rows of girls tanning on the lawn in swimsuits, there were a group playing football, and tons of people on the Lowe steps. It was just so overwhelming. Thanks so much for clarifying!</p>
<p>second nightowl, you came at the right time of year, on the right day, right time of day also and probably with the right weather. It's usually more serene, calm and quite, especially at night there a lot of space to walk around and talk to someone without anyone being in the proximity. on the weekends too campus is quite with people playing on the grass.</p>
<p>the frisbees and bikinis of april sure are rejuvenating though.</p>
<p>yeah, i'd say if the energy of a campus doesn't appeal to you, or at least the idea of being a part of it doesn't appeal to you, an intense urban school like both Penn AND Columbia should be questioned for you.</p>
<p>But part of your misgivings might be based around just seeing hundreds of people having fun while not feeling like you're a part of them, or that you belong there, and that can be awkward and uncomfortable. Just re-imagine that scene where you (A) enjoy playing football, or, you know, watching college-aged girls lying around in swimsuits, (B) see dozens of your friends as you walk around the central campus area, chat with some of them, hang out, etc, and (C) have the option to head to riverside park or something if you really need more peace and quiet.</p>
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[quote]
Penn and Columbia are very similar in terms of prestige, location etc...</p>
<p>I think that Penn is a far more flexible school though.
<p>More seriously, cawcaw90, if you actually want someone to "Advise you", I'd be happy to talk on the phone for a little bit and tell you a bit more about campus life. Most of the current students are busting their derrieres for papers and theses and finals right now. But I'm a recent grad, I'm on the road on a business trip, and between 10-12 ET tonight I'll be sitting in my hotel room doing little besides watching baseball. So let me know (by private message) if you're really that hung up about all this.</p>
<p>Denzera, thanks for the lengthy reply! I'll PM you for sure!</p>
<p>I think part of it was I was totally shocked since all the previous colleges I had visited were much calmer. It almost felt like I was at a beach...except in the middle of NY. But it seems that other posters have confirmed that it's not always like that. </p>
<p>And you have a point about the not being part of the crowd. If I recall, I was not in a particularly good mood and probably being immersed in a totally unexpected rowdy environment probably didn't help. Now, if I was PART of that rowdiness, I wouldn't mind as much.</p>