<p>Title says it all. I just want to know how Duke compares internationally with, say, Dartmouth or other top tier schools. I know in my area of the country the Ivy League is put on this pedestal, but I was wondering if any internationals could share how they think of Duke vs Cornell or Dartmouth or Penn or Columbia or Brown (the lower Ivies). Is there a lot of name recognition for Duke? I say this out of curiosity. I personally feel Duke is a significantly better school then most of the ones listed above but doesn't get the respect it deserves domestically. I just want to know about internationally.</p>
<p>In Europe, Duke is seen as fairly equal to the lower Ivies (Brown, Dartmouth, Cornell, Penn, etc.). Just look at the THES world rankings (a UK publication). [QS</a> Top Universities: Top 100 universities in the THE - QS World University Rankings 2007](<a href=“http://www.topuniversities.com/university_rankings/results/2008/overall_rankings/top_100_universities/]QS”>http://www.topuniversities.com/university_rankings/results/2008/overall_rankings/top_100_universities/) Duke is ranked as the 13th best university in the world. Behind HYP, Columbia, and Penn, but ahead of Brown, Cornell, and Dartmouth. Not saying this ranking is everything, but it gives a general range of the perception. </p>
<p>In Asia, however, I’d say Duke has some gap to fill in. International prestige is something earned over time, and Duke is new to the game. In most of Asia, Ivies + Stanford + Berkeley + MIT + Cal Tech are seen as the creme of the crop. Duke is making in-roads in Singapore and China, but I’d still say it’s behind. According to Shanghai Jiao Tong University in China, Duke is 32nd in the world and 25th in the US. [url=<a href=“http://www.arwu.org/rank2008/ARWU2008_A(EN).htm]ARWU2008[/url”>http://www.arwu.org/rank2008/ARWU2008_A(EN).htm]ARWU2008[/url</a>] Duke is behind all the Ivies except Dartmouth (not in the top 100!) and Brown (71st). This ranking though is mostly research-based, so schools focused on undergrad educations (including LACs) are hugely penalized (hence why Dartmouth isn’t in top 100). I’d say historically Asians favor the strong scientific research universities as opposed to humanity-focused ones as well.</p>
<p>When I studied in London, everybody thought of Duke as one of the premier institutions. People get internships and jobs at Barclays, etc.</p>
<p>Caltech not really, it is actually a pretty new school to the game. But international name doesn’t matter so much. When you apply for job, even internationally, the employer pretty much knows a lot about your school (given that you are applying to a big company). Honestly outside of America, the common people in the other countries only colleges most people know are the HYPSM. Some don’t even know that Dartmouth is a college or even an Ivy. If you go to Asia, and you are in a top university in America, you are seen as great because many universities in the US are better than ones in Asia. UM is seen as better than U of Tokyo in nearly all the fields especially engineering, business, and medical. And Duke is too.</p>
<p>Also saying one school is really better than another doesn’t mean much. A student at UM can be significantly better than one at Duke and one at Duke can be better than one at Stanford. And ranking doesn’t even tell anything really because ranking international schools are pretty much flawed and worse than ranking American colleges (the curriculum are extremely different). If you go to Duke, you will not be viewed down upon at any country. Most country respect the top universities in America and employers world wide know about Duke</p>
<p>i agree with what bluedog says. from europeans (well, the french LOL), they know what duke is. it’s basically duke = penn = columbia, as it is viewed in the states.</p>
<p>in asia on the other hand, … well, to put it simply, asians know good engineer schools. so basically they’ve heard of HY(exceptions to the whole engineering thingy) + Stanford + MIT + Berkeley. Maybe a few ivies, but simply because they have the “Ivy” tag-line.</p>
<p>can i ask why you’re wondering this, btw? i’m just curious.</p>
<p>You guys are delusional if you think Duke is greatly known outside the US, especially in Europe.</p>
<p>Duke is a good school but it is definitely NOT as well known as Harvard. In terms of recognition with the ivies, it is probably better known than Dartmouth or Brown. This has a lot to do with the Duke apparel (Blue Devil tees) being sold/worn overseas rather than anything else. It is absolutely not as well known as Columbia or Cornell. Columbia is always in world news and many professors win nobels (can’t beat that kind of press) and Cornell has a big reputation in scientific circles. Also, you should note that Princeton is hardly known outside the US…</p>
<p>Also who said duke = penn = columbia??? What idiot believes that!? </p>
<p>BTW, I spent many years in London.</p>
<p>Andy, you shouldn’t feel insecure about Duke’s place on the world stage…It is a fine school and there is no need to feel inadequate about going there.</p>
<p>^ Check the world and U.S. rankings for comparing Duke to Penn and Columbia, genius.</p>
<p>Duke is only ranked lower than Harvard, Yale, and Princeton (in terms of Ivies); it’s tied with Columbia, and it’s HIGHER than Penn, Dartmouth, Brown, AND Cornell.</p>
<p>My D has traveled in parts of Asia and Europe. She encountered very few individuals who recognized the name “Duke University.” Many wondered if it was somehow related to a Royal family member. Believe it or not many people in the United States don’t recognize the name either.</p>
<p>The programs DukeEngage, Study Aboard, and Duke-NUS Graduate Medical School in Singapore are designed in part to raise name recognition. President Brodhead even traveled to Asia in 2006 meeting in part to raise awareness of the university.</p>
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<p>Really, it must have taken years for you to figure that one out. For the most part half of the people in the world don’t even know what Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth is. Few people in Asia and Europe even bother with the US colleges except HYP and maybe S and M. Ivies to them are simply HYP to some Columbia, and Cornell. The common people in Asia and Europe don’t really care about US schools other than Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Stanford, and MIT. And half of the people in the world don’t even care about US colleges other than HYPSM. If you go to other countries and ask common people (not people who work in international businesses) to name the Ivies they will say Harvard, Yale, Princeton and if you are lucky they might say UPenn or and others will even say Stanford or MIT. </p>
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<p>Since you seem to have no respect for Duke, I hope that no idiot like you would apply to Duke. So stop ■■■■■■■■ on this thread. I mean honestly a lot of people actually not only believe that Duke = Upenn = Columbia, they believe that Duke > UPenn or Columbia in most fields. So really the “idiot” here is you. Start doing more research on colleges because you are definitely NOT “smart”. Duke education has outperformed UPenn and Columbia in many fields. Oh and since you have no respect for Duke and think that only idiots think that Duke is good as some Ivies, I hope that you never go to Duke. Ivies are too overrated in international countries, some believe that hey are the best in everything, simple not true. Some don’t even know that JHU is better than Columbia Med and Yale Med. People know Ivies because they have been there for a long time but to tell you the truth, the people that will matter to (the employers) will know what Duke. </p>
<p>I think that OP has pretty much gotten the answer he wants: Duke is known by some out of the US by the common people but not a lot. If you are trying to find a job, then Duke is well known out of the United States. Take University of Michigan, it has the biggest Alumni network, simple to say that if you go world wide for a job, they will know the strength of UM education but if you ask regular people, they won’t really know UM.</p>
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<p>LOL SAYS THE COLUMBIA KID. </p>
<p>… do some reserach, you pretentious asswipe.</p>
<p>All right, everyone, INHALE…
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EXHALE…
<em>stops flame war</em></p>
<p>You people are so sensitive! Since some of you feel the need to read my posting history, you should see that I have tremendous respect for DUKE!! The OP seems to have concern that it “doesn’t get the respect” it deserves HERE IN THE U.S. and then poses a question about its international stature? C’mon, get serious. If the OP feels it gets little recognition here, why would ANYONE think that it gets more recognition abroad?<br>
As for some people thinking Duke > Penn or Columbia in some fields, that is truly valid but that could be the case against any school… What’s your point? The OP is talking about name recognition, here. Not which school has the strongest biomedical major. </p>
<p>As for “Duke is only ranked lower than Harvard, Yale, and Princeton (in terms of Ivies); it’s tied with Columbia, and it’s HIGHER than Penn, Dartmouth, Brown, AND Cornell.” Is that the same ranking that had Stanford at 17? You can’t give any credibility with a ranking that obviously comes to that conclusion! </p>
<p>Duke’s a great school, but who’s the last famous alum or nobel winner associated with the school–or when has any world leader spoken there and there was tremendous press? THese are valid questions. Unfortunately, these facts help bring recognition to a university. Look at all the press Notre Dame and ASU got when Obama spoke at their ceremonies. This stuff matters.</p>
<p>^ No, that ranking has Stanford at #4: [National</a> Universities Rankings - Best Colleges - Education - US News and World Report](<a href=“http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/college/national-search]National”>http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/college/national-search)</p>
<p>I was mistaken about UPenn (technically one rank higher), but almost everyone would agree that Penn’s prestige is mostly concentrated in the Wharton School. Every other school/department is Dartmouth level or lower, at best.</p>
<p>P.S. Your last point is ridiculous. First of all, world leaders speak at Duke all the time. You want a celebrity? Oprah gave the graduation speech this year. And just because Obama spoke at those two schools, it has zero bearing on their academic weight. Notre Dame is falling fast, and ASU just plain sucks across the board.</p>
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<p>I agree with that based on the average person in Europe/Asia, but I was answering the question based on the prestige level from other academics and major international employers. If the OP was asking about the common person, then yes, virtually nobody would have heard of Duke. But who cares? Are you going to Duke to impress a rural Chinese farmer and anybody else you might run into? If you are, then, yeah, Duke might not be the best place - but nowhere would be besides HYPSM in that case as cdz512 said above. They call it dropping the “H-bomb” for a reason… Obviously Duke is not as well known as Harvard - nobody said that. If, however, you want to know how Duke places in the minds of employers such as HSBC and Barclays, and universities like Oxford and Cambridge, then I’d say that Duke is fairly equivalent to a lower Ivy. When I studied at Queen Mary, University of London (an okay school, but certainly not even one of the best), everybody had heard of Duke (professors and students). </p>
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<p>Nobody said that. Just comparing its reputation abroad to other universities abroad. I’d agree with you that Cornell and Columbia are more well-known abroad though. And also that Duke somewhat lacks the big name celebrity, nobel laureate, supreme court justice-type alumni more than most of the Ivies. But I don’t think that’s really indicative of the quality of a university, but it certainly can lead to more name recognition. Don’t get me wrong, lots of amazing people have graduated from Duke and had influential lives and careers, it’s just not as many and as well-known as Cornell and Columbia, for example.</p>
<p>In the end, most people abroad wouldn’t have heard of Duke. Most people in the US probably have barely heard of Duke. The average person in the US has no idea what Dartmouth, Penn (people are like “is that Penn St?”), and many other of the most prestigious schools in the country. But employers and academic institutions (i.e. what matters) will hold a Duke degree in high regard, certainly below a segment of schools, but still near the top. And I think it’s generally accepted that the European employers and institutions hold Duke in higher regard than their Asian counterparts.</p>
<p>I still wonder why the OP decided to ask this question…</p>
<p>I was just curious. I have a friend that got into Columbia (that is not nearly as smart or active or involved as me but got in for ridiculous reasons - he is half hispanic tho he looks all white) and he is being treated like god by people who don’t know anything except Ivies. And it is beginning to **** me off when people ignorent of the situation say that he is so great when everyone who goes to my school or is in the community is angry that he was accepted where as the other kids who were way higher then him in rank and SATs and awards and involvement but were white were rejected. Its just really really annoying and I want to know if there are people out there who give the schools equal respect because ik I do. It just seems that people in my community don’t care/know anything about Duke but think of Columbia as so special, so I wanted to know what people around the world thought about it. Thats all.</p>
<p>eh, it’s just college. People won’t give a damn where you got your undergrad degree after you start working or go to med/grad/law/whatever school. All you really need is that piece of paper that says you have a BA/BS/BSE.</p>
<p>Don’t worry, a Duke degree in a most fields are better than Columbia’s degree. He would feel the opposite when your degree gets you a better job. By the way he’s your “friend”? just wondering…</p>
<p>Rankings</p>
<p>In the 2009 U.S. News & World Report ranking of undergraduate programs at doctoral granting institutions, Duke ranked 8th (tied with the University of Chicago and Columbia University). In the past decade, U.S. News & World Report has placed Duke as high as third and as low as eighth. Duke was ranked the 13th-best university in the world in 2007 by the THES - QS World University Rankings. Duke was ranked 32nd best globally and 25th nationally by Shanghai Jiao Tong University in 2008, focusing on quality of scientific research and number of Nobel Prizes.The Wall Street Journal ranked Duke sixth (fifth among universities) in its “feeder” rankings in 2006, analyzing the percentage of undergraduates that enroll in what it considers the top five medical, law, and business schools. A survey by the Journal of Blacks in Higher Education in 2002 ranked Duke as the best university in the country in regard to the integration of African American students and faculty.</p>
<p>Duke has a high profile on the international scene and is building many ties abroad. My son’s two semesters with studies abroad were amazing in terms of the quality of faculty he had abroad and the high standards required of him in his studies.</p>
<p>In U.S. News & World Report 's “America’s Best Graduate Schools 2009,” Duke’s medical school ranked 6th for research and tied for 41st for primary care, while the law school ranked 10th.[76][77][78] In the U.S. News & World Report 's most recent rankings of nursing schools, in 2007, Duke’s nursing school tied for 15th.[79] Among business schools in the United States, the Fuqua School of Business was ranked 12th by U.S. News & World Report in 2009 and 8th by BusinessWeek in 2008.[8</p>
<p>As I suspected I think the OP is a little bitter, which I find misplaced. He assumes his ‘friend’ only got into Columbia bc of Affirmative action-did he the OP read this friend’s application? From what I understand Duke has many development admits who get to go to a great school like Duke bc they come from rich families and there’s an expectation that they will pony up during fundraisers. Also, maybe the people are more impressed about your friend bc it is more difficult to get into Columbia. Who knows…I don’t think it’s just bc it’s any ivy. But back to the original question, I spent my summers primarily in London but traveled throughout Europe. At the end of the day, Duke is one of the top schools in the US so who really cares…</p>
<p>CDZ, Are you seriously saying that a Duke degree will get him a better job? C’mon…</p>