Here’s a Yahoo Answers post about that. Look at the second answer:
An online poster said it. Hence, transfer students never have to show high school records. Now that that’s settled…
Also, I didn’t mention the Atlanta schools originally, that was another poster. I hadn’t heard anything about that. And have you actually heard of a purported home schooler fabricating things? You say that you aren’t pointing fingers at true home schoolers, but if you don’t have a solid example of a fabricated home school student, that’s what it seems like you’re doing.
@albert69 You’re seriously using Yahoo Answers as a source? No one is even mentioning which STATE they’re in! Anyway, none of the answers on there even mention highschool equivalence at all, and they all contradict each other!
You just want to win. I’m not replying to you anymore…But if anything, you should see this as trying to help the homeschooling image…Wanting to make sure that there is at least LESS of a chance for someone to commit fraud; you would think that all of you would be happy that someone was mentioning this, and not get so defensive.
Lol, you’re the one who is basing this whole argument off of CC posts (an equally unreliable online forum.) It seems that you believe what is posted online as a valid source. I figured Yahoo Answers should be enough to convince you, considering how you arrived at your conclusion that there is no confirmation process.
OP wrote:
FORUM POSTS
As for helping the home schooling image - colleges seem to have a pretty good view of it already, wouldn’t you say? They welcome home schoolers with open arms, from what you say. “A love without question…”
@albert69 You’re actuallly pretty good at debating, so I have to say one last thing: No one commenting here, has been able to prove that someone couldn’t lie about being a homeschooler if they wanted to. If I were wrong about anything, then it would easy for anyone to point that out…But not one single person has, including you. And no, your YA link didn’t convince me, because every single answer on that page directly contradicts the others. The online posts I’ve seen from homeschoolers on here about their transcripts and how colleges respond to them have been consistent…and so have mine.
@TsunadePrimroses - in your responses to me, you have only re-stated your premise. You never responded to the points I made. It’s ok, though. I think I’m finished here.
@We2BeHome Yes, because you essentially agreed with me on almost everything! I was only trying to make it clear, that cheating using home printed transcripts could be much easier than how you described it. I could link to forum posts on here where the homeschooling parents said that the colleges didn’t ask for any proof of the homeschooling…And I also mentioned CC, because I was trying to say that it could be very easy to use a fabricated transcript or diploma, in the place of a GED for a University transfer. Otherwise, Why would I respond with anything else, when we agree with each other?
@Tsunadeprimroses, I’m still waiting for you to cite state homeschooling regulations. Have you found any yet or are you still quoting random blog posts, random websites, and creating your own improbable scenarios?
@Tsunadeprimroses, You’ve been told several times that students who graduate from a cc don’t NEED a high school transcript OR the TASC to transfer to a 4-year school.
@TsunadePrimroses - if your perception of my posts is that I “essentially agreed with you on almost everything”, you are not reading my posts very well or being the T word which shall not be mentioned in these forums.
Just officially going on the record as NOT agreeing with you and taking note that this is your first thread (at least under this name).
I will let the rhetorical fallacies in your argument pass, but moving on…,
You have yet to prove to us that a liar could get into a college. You don’t even have anecdotal evidence of it happening. The examples you gave of this “flawed” system were using (presumably) honest home schoolers, so that’s why you’ve rubbed so many people wrong. The last thing a home schooler wants to hear is that they are cheating the system or are somehow outside the law, or that they are somehow “beneath” the public education system. Intent or not, that is the way it has come off, at least to me.
I can’t prove that it couldn’t happen, but you cannot prove it can. I doubt that a student could go straight into a regular 4-year university without some valid education under their belt and not get caught. Community college then transfer, maybe, but from everything I know, there would be no reason to even make a transcript since I don’t believe that one would be needed with enough credits. Now, I’m not talking Harvard here, just low-ranked state universities with more or less open enrolment. As selectivity goes up, I would imagine more things are needed.
@austimshauri: How is linking to the Homeschooling Legal Defense Association that lists the exact state regulations for homeschooling across the USA a random website? And no, for some states they may not need to show high school equivalence, but for the majority of states, no one has been able to prove that they don’t need a diploma or GED. The only proof came from YA, which is a random website LOL, and every post contradicts the others.
You actually said before that for NYS to issue college degrees, there needs to be highschool equivalence, so you agreed with me to an extent. And in my state of Georgia, that can be true for many colleges too, even CCs…I’d be happy to link even some community colleges that require the GED or highschool equivalence if you want me to.
@We2BeHome: You said: " As others have said, anyone can print up any sort of transcript and claim anything. " and “Yes, you’re right. Someone COULD do what you say.” How did you disagree with me?
@albert69 and everyone: My ENTIRE point, is that it would be impossible to prove if someone was lying, because of how easy pretending to be a homeschooler and using a homemade transcript/diploma could make it! You can’t prove anything from a homeschooling diploma or transcripts. Also, in my state Georgia, you do actually need a GED or highschool equivalence to even just attend many CCs; I could link to places if you want me to…And on the HSLDA map, Georgia is only a low regulation state, so it’s not like there are extreme regulations.
I’m shocked at how much the homeschoolers are panicking on this thread!!! You’re all panicking so much so that you either agree with me and don’t realize it, or you still don’t understand what I’ve typed 20-30 times by now. I’ve never experienced this before with people, ever.
Also, I want to say that the GED and highschool diploma is usually only required for traditional students; homeschoolers can submit alternative work, which is my ENTIRE point. If someone didn’t have a GED or a highschool diploma, but didn’t want to go the traditional route, and so lied and pretended to be a homeschooler so they could submit alternative work instead…Do all of you not seriously see what a huge potential issue that could be? That’s actually the core issue I’ve been repeating over and over: Many times, homeschoolers don’t need to prove much at all, that’s why this entire thing is a problem, because anyone could exploit that. I don’t need to prove anything either though; since so far no one has been able to list one thing that would seriously stop someone from doing that.
@TsunadePrimroses You said: “no one has been able to list one thing that would seriously stop someone from doing that.”
No one could stop them from making up a transcript but THEY WOULDN’T GET INTO COLLEGE ON IT. That’s why no one is taking this scenario too seriously, beyond those feeling a bit slandered even though they worked very very hard to get a good high school education.
Hmmm…I don’t see anyone “panicking” on this thread. If your attempt with your first post as a member of College Confidential was to stir up some controversy, you failed miserably.
Also, homeschooled students are issued diplomas. Homeschoolers do not have to submit “alternative work” to gain acceptance to college - they submit outside validation like every other applicant in the form of SAT/ACT, SAT II’s, AMC/AIME, and AP scores along with their official high school transcripts.
OP, I wonder if you would happen to know the poster who joined another homeschooling forum last month and posted some bizarre comments. That person also had “roses” in her username.
@mdcmom and @shuttlebus Here, I’ll quote myself again: “If someone started off at CC first, they wouldn’t necessarily need the SAT or ACT (once they graduated) if they wanted to attend University later. But, they could still pretend to be a homeschooled student, and so skip taking the GED or make up a transcript, which would be committing fraud if they hadn’t graduated Highschool.”
And @shuttlebus, no I’ve never heard of that lol. But then, my comments have been very consistent logically…The comments from the homeschoolers haven’t, so the only bizarre comments I’ve seen on here have come from many of them. What’s also bizarre, is that I’ve had to repeat myself 30+ times now.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/30/education/30dropouts.html?pagewanted=all Here’s an article about the subject. It seems that you may not need any kind of diploma or transcript, fake or real, to get into many colleges. That’s my point - if people are just trying to get into college without high school (aka the dropouts), there is no need to make a home school transcript. There are much easier ways. Some of them can even get financial aid without a diploma, it seems. Sure, nobody could stop them from trying with a home school transcript, but who would bother if you don’t need one? Besides, it seems that in NY (according to this) someone can get your much savored “high school equivalency” after 24 credits at a cc.
http://classroom.synonym.com/can-college-high-school-diploma-ged-3275.html Here, once again, it says you can attend cc in CA without a high school diploma. For financial aid, you may need a diploma or GED or “completing a high school education in a homeschool setting approved under STATE LAW.” Check that HSLDA map you showed us - CA requires parental notification of home school status. So, a student could not just appear from the mist and claim to be home schooled and get financial aid. Without notification, they would quickly be found out. Since we are assuming here that we aren’t talking about actual home schoolers, who would have notified the state, then a dropout couldn’t just claim to be home schooled and get financial aid. But they wouldn’t need to claim anything to get admitted.
The point is, YOU DON’T NEED A HIGH SCHOOL DIPLOMA OF ANY KIND TO ATTEND COLLEGE. Why would someone want to lie about being a home schooler if it would gain them NOTHING? It probably wouldn’t even work to get financial aid, and that’s not what we’re talking about anyway. PEOPLE CAN ATTEND COLLEGES, maybe not all, but SOME, WITHOUT HIGH SCHOOL EQUIVALENCY.
And before you say, but that doesn’t mean that it couldn’t work for any colleges because I didn’t go through the requirements at each and every college, so there’s nothing to stop someone from trying, remember that you haven’t proved that ALL colleges don’t “verify” home school transcripts. Do you even know what colleges you are talking about?
Short answer? No, I don’t see where that would be any huge potential issue.
If the student can do the work - or at least the college thinks they can based upon alternative work or test scores submitted - I see no problem with it at all.
I see far more problems by googling graduation rates from public schools, finding them to be relatively high in most places, but then seeing stats at how many (very significant numbers) often need remedial work when they get to college. They have their transcripts showing they took courses, but what in the world was in those courses and how did they get decent grades without truly knowing the material? Aren’t some of their transcripts fraudulent?
Give a college a choice between a person claiming to be a homeschooler who can do the work however they got the background for it vs one who has a transcript from a school showing a decent grade, but who can’t do the work, I suspect the college wants the former. This is quite likely why they don’t care too much about “proving” any transcripts.
I expect that this thread is bull, because there are so many schools that give grades based on politics, for want of a better word, and also schools that will tutor the heck out of your kid by hook or by crook.
IMHO, both the OP’s point and that of various private schools and public schools inflating grades of their “favorites” or due to administration pressure, is only combated by colleges understanding this and looking at test scores - yes, the dreaded test scores.
Short of actually cheating, which of course is possible (but you need someone either with the answers, very difficult and illegal, or smart enough to get that 2300 on the SAT or a 5 on that AP test - um, more difficult?!?!), standardized tests are the salvation of students who are not the pride of the school or the apple of their parent’s eye.
It does come down to the fact that going to college is a self-correcting process - kids WILL drop out if they are not able to get by, or again, they’ll get special treatment, and then, again, they get special treatment in the work world. A la Bushes and various and sundried Kennedy cousins and second-cousins etc.