<p>" I have also never understood these guys obsession with Musical Theater, because those degrees cost beaucoup $ and when you graduate you are lucky to make $15,000 a year."</p>
<p>joev, I don't think Soozie is misguided. And she teaches people like me a lot of valuable lessons that are eye-openers for me, an immigrant to this country. The lessons she teaches me are precisely what you are talking about (making $15,000 a year etc being worth it etc).</p>
<p>joev-
also, folks don't always end up in their own fields. I would imagine that musical theater would be an excellent introduction to many careers involving people, communications and presentation. Some of us (like me) have had to compromise our passions in order to make a living. That's fine - but what a dull world it would be if everyone was so sensible.</p>
<p>Yeah, I guess we did get a bit OT, but I wanted to give a very personal example of why someone would apply to so many schools, and tried to give a few other situations where it occurs as well. Also, a caution NOT to do this when the schools are ones that need demonstrated interest. When you have a "hook" or are going for a special program, by taking the time needed to apply for such programs, you don't need to necessarily toe the line on things that kids ordinarily do. Though S has a few of those schools as well and will have to be sure to show his interest in them as they do not have an audition. </p>
<p>I misstated a stat--S's school last year had about 30% of their kids just applying to one school. Another 30% applied to 2-4 schools and about 37% applying to 5-20 schools. Alot of kids applying to multiple EA/ED/rolling combos it seems. Most kids keep a bunch of their apps on hold until they get the answer from the early schools and then decide which ones if any should go out. Most kids did get into an early school that satisfied them enough not to let loose the rest of the apps. We are unusual in that we do not have any apps on hold; they are all out, but I'll bet that there are kids with that many on their list.</p>
<p>On another thread for this forum, a mom was asking about kids with checkered pasts. That is another reason for lots of apps. Any mixed bag of grades, scores, behavior, etc, any highly selective school or program necessitates a larger number of schools unless there is a good safety in there. Though we have our state schools as a safety--he has already been accepted there; it is not a choice he wants. None of his schools other than the state schools are within 2 hours of where we live. </p>
<p>And, yes, Ohio_mom, there can be a number of other fields of work other than MT directly. Most of us end up doing work that we did not specifically plan or train for. The way I look at it, they are in college to grow up a little bit, and unless they are in a pragmatic field with jobs galore, it's not going to be easy finding a job. I am seeing engineering and comp sci majors having to work temp these days. And pre meds and prelaws have quite a few more years to go before they start making any money. Better they spend the undergraduate years studying something they really like. If nothing else, they can carry an interesting conversation about the subject. And there is a better chance they'll get through school if they are studying something they like. Not too many kids are self supporting right after college from what I am seeing regardless of major.</p>
<p>Joe, I am not so intelligent and pale in comparison to the majority of parents I have met on this forum but thanks for making my day anyway! </p>
<p>I don't think the main reason to go to college is to get a job and even if it were, to strive for the highest paying fields. I believe one goes to college to become educated and also focus on an area of interest and perhaps that person goes on to a career related to that interest. And if so, not everyone is choosing careers based on incomes that may be obtained. My own field is Education and believe me, it is not a high paying field and I never considered the income when choosing my field but went with my interests (which I had heald since I was a little girl). </p>
<p>My own kid who is pursuing musical theater is extremely interested and passionate about this field and has been since preschool. She is also a very good student who could get into a selective college. I would say she is a gifted student academically and in fact, is an extremely strong writer and there are MANY fields she could go into with her strengths and intelligence. But her interest lies in musical theater and I would say her identity itself is tied to being a theater performer. It is WHO she is. It is her life's passion and she hopes it to be her life's work. I will quote her: "...musical theater is inextricable to the core of my being, my chosen major, and doubtlessly my raison d'etre."</p>
<p>Further, though I am her mom of course and am biased, she truly is talented in this area and has a natural gift, if you will. (of course so are a zillion other people out there) There is no way I would ever want to stop someone like this in her tracks. She will be getting a college education and degree (always something to have that benefits you down the line), as well as this degree will involve some liberal arts along with the professional training. In fact, her two first choice schools are selective colleges academically (she must pass academic admissions there as well as her artistic review in the audition) and both of them value a liberal arts component to her degree, even though she will also get conservatory training. </p>
<p>The world needs the arts. Musical theater is ONE of the performing arts. A musical theater performer must be skillled in three disciplines...acting, singing, and dance. Such a performer must be a learned individual who can draw upon knowledge to hone their portrayal of a character. Theater is a field where it is very difficult to make it, no doubt about that, and one in which the pay can be low and a performer has no job security and is always job hunting or going for the next audition. That is a way of life in this field. </p>
<p>Now, I hope she does make it as a performer and I think she should go for it. I also know, as does she, that even IF she does not make it (after trying) as a musical theater performer, it is not like that is the only thing she can do in her life. There are many related skills she has. For instance, she has written shows, directed them, musical directed (is an excellent pianist and has a significant music background), choregraphed (a lifetime of dance training and now has been a choreographer for a few shows), and is currently doing such a show at the moment. I can readily see her as someone who writes a musical, directs, musical directs, or choreographs. And that is just WITHIN her field. She surely could go on to do other things, just like anyone who has a major in college might take on a job that is not the same topic as their major. </p>
<p>In my view, her situation is not that different than another students' in that she is going to get an education, is going to focus on a specialty area, and then try to make it in that area, albeit not a lucrative field. Surely we can't expect all people to be striving to go to college just to make it in a high paying field. Frankly, I think the fact that she has passion, direction, and talent in something will be beneficial in the long run. </p>
<p>Not only do I not wish to stop her and we support her TOTALLY in her mission, I could not stop her if I tried because she is DRIVEN, as well as this is part of her identity, not a passing interest. I think when people look at her, they see her synonymous with the girl who sings, dances and acts on stage. It is who she is. Now, you would not want anyone to take away who you are, would you? That is what we are talking about here....not WHAT field she is interested in, let alone potential earnings, but WHO she is as a person. I can't explain it more than that....if you knew her or someone like her, you would know what I mean. I happen to know numerous kids like her as she spends her summers at an intensive theater program out of state with kids who share this passion and talent and they are ALL like this. And they are applying to the same programs and in fact, MANY of them are TOP students in their schools academically as well. </p>
<p>Susan</p>
<p>PS, while theater is overall not a high paying field, sometimes there is good money to be made, though getting those jobs is difficult. For instance, once my child got paid $2000, plus airfare, hotels, limos, for a one hour performance. Not bad for a 12 year old.</p>
<p>i applied to two :P got into my first choice (which had a free application fee) and the back up, so i was very happy :)</p>
<p>happy for you, Fendergirl...so where are you headed? I can't imagine it all being done by Nov...you lucky girl! We are still in the app phase!</p>
<p>Soozie,
Fendergirl is already at college in PA.</p>
<p>Oh, nevermind then, lol. I thought, wow, she has already heard and is done this process, whoa. Then of course, Backhandgrip's son seems to be all done with it all too but that does seem unusual. I wish....</p>
<p>DD will be applying next year. We hope she will apply to 5 schools...1 reach, 3 matches, 1 safety. So far she has a LOT of safeties on her list and one reach. She happens to like 3 schools for which she would be a strong candidate.</p>
<p>haha! sorry for not clarifying that soozie :) I graduate this May. Best four years ever (so far anyway) :)</p>
<p>I'm applying to 14</p>
<p>ED Penn</p>
<p>Columbia
Duke
Dartmouth
Johns Hopkins
Rice
U Chicago</p>
<p>Vanderbilt
Cornell
Emory
WUSTL</p>
<p>U-Texas (Plan II)
U Rochester
Case Western</p>
<p>My daughter applied to 2 & a half. (After a visit to college #3, she did not complete part two of their application.) She got an early answer on one application, so was able to keep her list short.</p>
<p>Parents: this is a naive question so I thought I'd throw it out to you for feedback. Since the odds of acceptance at the top LAC's are slim, why not apply to 8+ reach schools (particularly if they use common app), while making sure we have the 2-3 matches and 2-3 safeties?</p>
<p>Comments would be appreciated.</p>
<p>Bluebayou- not all reach schools are equal fits. For example, we couldn't find 8 reach schools that our S would be equally happy at and that we would pay full freight for. There are major differences in schools that students should consider before making blanket applications to the top 10 or 12 or 20 whatever. For many families (hopefully) it's not just about getting into a top school.</p>
<p>i'm a current college freshman
I applied to 20:
-one ED to a LAC, deferred (and i'm really glad i didn't end up there afterall)
-All the UCs except Irvine (didn't have my major). Since it was all one app, there was no reason not to apply to all the UCs.
-6 CSUs basically because there were 6 that had all 3 majors i was interested in at the time. that was overkill.
-7 private colleges, all but one was on the common app.</p>
<p>so i did 4 applications for 20 schools. i now attend UC Santa Cruz and love it.</p>
<p>Momof2inca,</p>
<p>Great post. It sometimes boggles my mind at how people apply to 10.15 20 schools most which have nothing in common . When students list that they have applied to all of the Ivies I wonder can all of them really be the best place for you ir iare you merely chasing a name.
My daughter's H.S. allowed for 8 applications and after an exhaustive search she could not find 8 schools based on the philisophy of if this were the only school that you were accepted to would you truly be happy attedning there. In the end she only applied to 7</p>
<p>Excellent points, thank you, momof2inca</p>
<p>I'm starting to believe that applying to 20 schools (or even more than 10) is an indicator of someone who has not done the proper research (i.e. matched their specific interests, desires and eligibility criteria to schools' specific offerings and acceptance realities). It's like buying lottery tickets, I guess... hoping they'll get lucky. But even if a student got accepted to all 20 schools, they can only attend one. Why not go through the selection process before applying, thus saving money and time, not to mention the time of all those admissions staffs? </p>
<p>And while it is, in fact, easy to apply to many UCs and Cal States with the click of the mouse and a credit card, there are real differences among the campuses that have little to do with majors offered. Last year we visited UC Santa Barbara and UCBerkeley in the same day and the feel of those two campuses (including the types of students we met) was marked. I'm not sure a student would be equally happy at both. Additionally, I've seen students on this board list the schools they're applying to and when I see Chicago and Georgetown on the same list, it boggles my mind. The two schools appeared to us to be very, very different in personality and mission. Both excellent, but different. How could one student see themselves as happy at either school? Are some kids just more flexible than our S? Or is it all about prestige?</p>
<p>I agree 20 is excessive. I do know many kids who are applying to both Berkeley and Santa Barbara. They would love to go to Berkeley or UCLA but know that they are a longshot so SB is more of a match and if they end up there they will be happy. </p>
<p>My d is still wrangling with a list but so far will apply to 3 schools with specialized programs with one each being a safety, match and a reach. She applied to another mid sized safety with rolling admissions(advice that I picked up on CC) that she has not visited but sounds promising and has already received an acceptance. She has 2 UC's that one is a safety and one is local (in case she decides at the last minute that she is not ready to leave home). She will probably apply to a few more common app schools that she can get a solid liberal arts education at as well as she is not 100% committed to a specialized program.
So for sure 6 schools and possibly 8 or 9.</p>
<p>Bluebayou, for those students applying to selective liberal arts colleges, my experience has been that the adcoms scrutinize the apps and seriously consider the match for the school, contribution to the college community and interest in the school including probability of attending the school if accepted. Unless the application process was started early and much of the "courting" of the school done by the fall of senior year, it is going to be difficult to give such schools and applications the attention they merit if you are going to optimize your chances of getting into the school. There comes a point of diminishing returns as you add more schools of that sort. There is no magic number for this as it differs from person to person. </p>
<p>Though my son is applying to many schools, this would be seriously discouraged if he were applying to different schools. As it is, he is neglecting some schools he should showing more interest. For some of the schools, it is not necessary, but there are some on his list where this interest is a strong factor in the admissions process. Don't spread yourself too thin. When I posted the high number, I was afraid that it would cause a panic of sorts, and encourage copy cats. There are a few situations where so many colleges are justified; I do believe in our case it is overdoing it. But for some kids it can truly jeopardize their chances in those colleges where they could pay more attention to the app, and LACs are the colleges where this situation particularly exists.</p>