How many schools to apply?

<p>EvoViro,</p>

<p>I also took several years off to narrow down my research interests. Unfortunately, it did the opposite and expanded my research interests vastly. That is why they have umbrella programs. If I waited to apply when I had decided on a specific area of research that I wanted to study for the rest of my life, I could have easily took ten years to start school again. No PI is going to hire you as a technician for 2-3 months so you can test whether you like that research area. The nice part about grad school is that you can do rotations to speed up the process of choosing an area.</p>

<p>Most people with defined research interests within biomedical grad programs switch fields of interests during their first year (seen it with my class and friends). Most people again switch fields for a post doc. A lot of the big shot PIs I know want students/fellows that have tried multiple fields, since it makes the science more interesting. A lot of the PIs themselves have worked in multiple fields, and they claim that this helps them become more creative scientists. </p>

<p>In summary, I disagree that people should have defined interests before entering grad school. Even my old boss, a national academy member, has switched fields ~4 times as a PI. I do agree that people should take time off before grad school. Time off adds a level of scientific maturity that would greatly benefit all entering grad students and it speeds up the time to graduation. I again say that you need to find the school that is the best fit, and this may take 10+ applications for some people.</p>

<p>mtlve,</p>

<p>I don’t disagree that in a case like yours, applying to many umbrella programs is a wise idea. But as you know, there are major differences between your situation and that of the undergrad who doesn’t know what they want because they’ve only ever done cookbook protocols in the lab. I should have been more specific in saying most of my advice is for the undergrads, not someone who has already developed that scientific maturity and taken several years already.</p>

<p>When I urge people to know what they’re looking for, it isn’t just about the specific research. It’s about having a feel for PI mentoring styles they want, the kind of lab environment, program size, collaborativeness, etc. Having solid ideas about those kinds of preferences before applications was critical to me. The better someone knows their best working conditions, the more informed their choices.</p>

<p>When I say people need grounding and confidence, again it isn’t just about the specific research. It is my opinion that applicants really ought to have experienced the “real world” of research before they jump into graduate school. Someone has to have tried their hand to truly be confident in their ability to identify interesting research questions, design the experiments and transform the data into meaningful results. Like I said, the core of my stance is that applicants shouldn’t just be “staying on track,” which certainly isn’t the case with you. </p>

<p>Also, I can easily envision myself pulled in any number of different directions in the future, but it won’t be because I don’t love what I’m doing already. Keeping an open mind is just one more critical part of being a scientist.</p>

<p>Hmmm, I’m a junior and I’m planning to appy to grad school right after college. But this thread has gotten me thinking.</p>

<p>In all honesty, it does seem like a really good idea to take a year or two off before going to grad school. My question is though: You’ve been talking about the “real world” of research. How can I get into this world with a bachelor’s degree? Are there companies out there who would take undergraduates?</p>

<p>Btw I am an international student, so I don’t know if that makes a difference. But I’m definitely interested in hearing more about what I can do after getting a bachelor’s degree to prepare for grad school.</p>

<p>“Real world” research, the way I use it, simply means the opportunity to do true investigative work. As an undergrad, students are often given protocols and projects to do without much need for independent thought, problem-solving skills, or creativity. It can be a huge eye-opener in grad school when someone is then expected to actually propose project ideas, plan out the experiments, interpret the data, and make it something meaningful. </p>

<p>Any research lab will do, provided they are willing to give you that level of independence. Some technician jobs are just as bad as undergrad, while others will allow for much more flexibility. If you don’t have many options, you can still get a lot of that exposure through being involved in the process, even if you don’t have freedom with your lab work. For instance, even if you don’t do your own data analysis, you can still be involved in knowing how and why it’s done certain ways, and really understand how the data gets transformed into results. Talk to your PI about how they come up with project ideas, how they decide on experimental design.</p>

<p>Mostly, it’s about taking initiative to really understand how research is done beginning to end. Being a scientist isn’t about knowing how to do PCR, it’s about seeing the unanswered questions and figuring out the answers, and that’s the “real world” of research.</p>

<p>As EvoViro said, look for a tech position or at the NIH IRTA program. You do need to be careful about picking a lab. Some tech positions allow you to have a project and others you are just stuffing pipette boxes.</p>

<p>I strongly recommend taking time off. I have not met a single person that regretted doing this.</p>

<p>I also recommend that you try to get a relatively safe project that you can get pubs out of. I picked a very risky project, which I thought was fine at my level. The project never worked and the lack of pubs is hurting me in fellowship applications. Some PIs I rotated with are probably worried about this too.</p>

<p>Hmm, interesting. Do you guys mind if I ask you some more questions (I’ll create a new thread, so I don’t hijack this one).</p>

<p>Thanks for all the insightful responses!! It really helped me narrow down some school choices that I want to consider applying. </p>

<p>I do have anotherconcern, for which I will start a new thread, and I would love to get your input on it.</p>

<p>Thanks a lot for helping out!!</p>

<p>In clinical psych, many (most?) applicants apply to 14-16, and very, very few apply to less than 8.</p>