<p>I've taken the SAT II Chinese test with listening and got a 790. but many of my friends say that over a half people got 800 because most people who take it are actually born in China and speak Chinese well (me too, I am just wonder how I got 10 points off with 15 ten years living in China and actually studying Chinese and speaking Chinese) I donno how colleges see about this sort of test. any idea?</p>
<p>From what I've heard, the common opinion is don't take Chinese if you're Chinese. 44% of everyone taking the test I believe get 800s. I was wondering how much colleges look at French though. Anyone know?</p>
<p>Then what's the point of taking any other lang tests? it should be same condition. my money~~~~its 2X dollars~~~~~~~</p>
<p>There are alot of Spanish(or born here but can speak Spanish quite well) in our school are taking Spanish course......</p>
<p>Yeah, the chinese SATII has a horrible percentile lol but hey its better than getting like a 600 in bio</p>
<p>But you don't see native Spanish people getting 800s....that shows you something.</p>
<p>of course it need somehow concentrate on SCHOOL. any native foreign who wants to go to the college can ace these tests. so what's the point?
I think I should work at collegeboard Foreign Lang office and make some tests that only AP students who can get A+++(over 100%,and 5 in AP test) can pass so that these sort of tests can really show a person is good at it and not just only use it. For example I studied ancient Chinese language in China and most C students in my class cannot pass the final even they say chinese and use chinese everyday.</p>
<p>Ancient Chinese language is extremely hard to understand, its TOTALLY different from the language that Chinese are using today.</p>
<p>"But you don't see native Spanish people getting 800s....that shows you something."</p>
<p>I'm not sure what that "something" could be? </p>
<p>As far as the Chinese test, earlier reports on CC explained that the test is more or less a second grade or third grade test. Some of the hard questions had this format</p>
<p>The mouse likes to eat:</p>
<p>A. meatballs
B. cat
C. cheese
D. hamburger
E. dog</p>
<p>If you were to compare the Chinese SATII and the French SATII, it'd be pretty obvious which one is harder, which is the reason for so many 800s on the Chinese one, making it not look as well on college apps.</p>
<p>"I'm not sure what that "something" could be?"</p>
<p>Meaning that they don't just test basic knowledge of a language, like they do in the Chinese SAT II, but rather proficiency, like that in SAT II Spanish.</p>
<p>Xiggi:
Just as there are easy, medium and hard questions on the SAT I tests, so are there various levels of grammar difficulty and vocabulary breadth in the Chinese w/ listenting test. I don't believe these SAT II language with listening tests were designed to gauge native or near-native speakers' abilities, despite the fact that mostly natives take these tests. Perhaps if you 'judge' the test from the perspective of non-native Chinese language learners, you might appreciate their accomplishment more. Perhaps you should be seeking their input specifically to reflect a broader perspective. Just a suggestion.</p>
<p>Addendum to my post above:</p>
<p>There is something comparatively unique about Mandarin you might not be aware of. One can learn to "speak" Mandarin without learning how to read or write it. One can also learn to 'read' Mandarin without learning how to write it or speak it. One can learn to write it without learning how to speak it. The three faculties of speaking, reading and writing all contribute to the complexity of learning Mandarin. Although one could point to such similarities viz-a-viz French and Spanish, the distinction between speaking, reading and writing in Mandarin is far far greater.</p>
<p>The SAT II Chinese with listening test does not test writing ability, however it does test speaking and reading ability (and of course, as with all of them, listening comprehension). Nonetheless the distinction between speaking and reading remains great, as evidenced by the posts by native Chinese who speak but don't read/write Chinese even here on CC.</p>
<p>1988, true that. but you have got to admit that the SAT 2 chinese is drop dead easy.</p>
<p>"Perhaps if you 'judge' the test from the perspective of non-native Chinese language learners, you might appreciate their accomplishment more. Perhaps you should be seeking their input specifically to reflect a broader perspective. Just a suggestion."</p>
<p>Thank you for the suggestion. However, I am not sure how I would seeking the specific input of non chinese speakers on this issue. Since you seem to speak about this subject with authority, why don't you provide us this input. I do not speak Chinese, and this does not allow me to ascertain the level of the test without reading the input from people on this board. Thus far, the test has been described as ridiculously easy for native speakers. The few english parts on the test and the extremely difficult curve seems to confirm the fact that the test is indeed very easy. </p>
<p>No matter how you look at it, this test has become an ABSOLUTE joke and strayed away from its objective. The SAT2 is supposed to be a test of what students learn in HIGH SCHOOL, not through independent study. How many schools in the country do you know that have Chinese programs? Just as the the SAT2 Korean and the recent AP Chinese the presence of this test is the result of politics and corporate bribing. </p>
<p>Were you to remove the blatant, glaring, and abject loophole in the admission policies of the uc system, you would eliminate the "reason" to even have the test in the first place. Its number one purpose is to boost the scores for standardized tests. It is not the fault of the students to game the system as much as it the UC system that shows a terrible lack of integrity by not closing this loophole. </p>
<p>The sad part is that non-native speakers who are making a tremendous effort to learn such a difficult language would be OUT OF THEIR MIND to take the test under the existing scenario. If you believe that a 600 on the Chinese exam will look good as a SAT2 score in a selective process, I'd tell you to rethink. </p>
<p>So, here you have it: most of the people interested in this test ARE native speakers. The unfortunate remaining students are simply screwed. </p>
<p>Lastly, there is no comparison between the SAT French or Spanish with the aberration which is called Chinese SAT2.</p>
<p>SAT 2 Chinese is extremely easy for any native speakers. Like Seraphthrone, I lived in Mainland China for 15 years. I took this test and got a 800. </p>
<p>Since now I live in CA, I will just concentrate on what I know aobut the UC System. For any student who wants to be admitted by any UC campus (except those be enrolled through "examination alone"), he or she has to study one language other than English in high school for at least two years.</p>
<p>There are a lot of Chinese immigrant students in CA who come to this country during their middle school or even high school. They want to go a UC campus, but most of them are unwilling to take another language. Sometimes, the high school also doesn't want to put those students into foreign language class, California high school has the policy that if a student lived in a foreign country for 6 years or more, the foreign language requirement for high school graduation (1 yr) is automatically waivered. Then what's the point to 'waste' some educational source (a lot of high schools in CA are experiencing buget crisis and have to lay off some teachers)</p>
<p>I know sometimes the counselor would just recommend such students to take SAT II Chinese to waiver the language requirement as long as they can score above 530. And at the same time, they would get a SAT II good score (> 750). The same thing happened to native Spanish and Korean speakers. And that's why the mean scores for SAT II Chinese, Korean and Spanish are exceptionally high. </p>
<p>I was told that for the UC system, you should turn in those two SAT Suject Tests (for Class of 2006 and beyond) in which you scored the highest, since UC will calculate each applicant's standardized test score using a special formula. Not sure about other colleges.</p>
<p>To Seraphthrone: I think you should take other SAT Subject Tests besides Chinese, and thoese scores will be more credible in the eye of college admission officer. Again, what's point to take an SAT Subject Tests in your native language? Personally, I also take Biology E, Chemistry, US History and Math IIC. Even though people may think Asians tend to do well on Science and Math, I guess even my 710 for Biology E (the lowest score among the four) is better than my 800 for Chinese.</p>
<p>Sorry that my idea may be regionally biased.</p>
<p>Some ppl take the Mandarin Proficiency Test which is a LOT harder than the SATIIs. I looked at the SATII Chinese and was appalled at how easy it was. Whats the point then if i can just guarantee myself a 800 on it...and colleges know that grade is bs? It comes down to didnt want to cheapen myself by taking this test when on my college resume i put that i studied classic chinese language.</p>
<br>
<blockquote> <blockquote> <blockquote> <blockquote> <p>The sad part is that non-native speakers who are making a tremendous effort to learn such a difficult language would be OUT OF THEIR MIND to take the test under the existing scenario. If you believe that a 600 on the Chinese exam will look good as a SAT2 score in a selective process, I'd tell you to rethink. </p> </blockquote> </blockquote> </blockquote> </blockquote>
<br>
<p>So, here you have it: most of the people interested in this test ARE native speakers. The unfortunate remaining students are simply screwed. <<<<<</p>
<p>For the first time I find myself disappointed in your response, particularly because it is so uninformed as you stated at the outcome, yet, you persist in passing an opinion based on heresay, and, particularly, based on what heritage speakers and native speakers inform you. I do know Mandarin as a non-native, non-heritage speaker. My offspring has studied as such the same. I'll be happy to share the SAT II results of a non-native, non-heritage speaker once they are in after this November's testing.</p>
<p>In the meantime, are you aware that at most colleges that offer Chinese language, there are two "types" of Chinese offered, i.e., one for heritage/native speakers and one for those people that learn it from scratch?</p>
<p>I used to be impressed by you Xiggi, but I frankly, I think you have gotten a bit ahead of yourself on this one -- speaking out of both sides of your mouth without really knowing diddly squat. I am truly disappointed. Why don't you simply stay away from topics about which you really know nothing about other than "heresay" from only one perspective?</p>
<p>P.S.: "HEREsay" vs. "Hearsay" is intentional.</p>
<p>Imo Xiggi's post was more relevant to this thread's topic</p>
<p>but thats just me</p>