<p>I visited Wesleyan recently, and despite its reputation, i found the students to be very much not involved in their studies and so blindly left wing that it made the student population appear very closed minded. Furthermore, the clear presence of drugs at the school and the widespread uniform domination of the "hipster" mentality really threw me off.</p>
<p>Are students at Oberlin more open minded? Is there more lifestyle/intellectual diversity than there is at Wesleyan? Is there more political tolerance?</p>
<p>I find that most Obies are closer to libertarian than standard leftists. Obies don’t really like… rules. A fourth of the school eats in dining co-operatives where they run their own dining hall (a multi-million dollar organization). Obies want to do practical things with their education – it’s a very active campus. A lot of politics classes focus on policy, and ways to specifically create change.</p>
<p>I’ve had some raucous political arguments at Oberlin – on abortion and gun control especially. There are very few social conservatives, and few absolute rightist or libertarians. We have a lot of incredibly passionate advocates for social justice and environmental rights. They keep campus lively. (There were debates on banning the sale of plastic water bottles and banning cigarettes that absorbed nearly all of campus. We get feisty.) We’ve had speakers like Newt Gingrich, William Kristol, and a Ronald Reagan lecture series of well-known conservative speakers, who give their take on affirmative action, climate change, and the media. </p>
<p>Yeah, we’ve got some hipsters, but they’re not beloved by the campus. There are some really awesome people who dress like total hipsters but are fantastic, free-thinking geniuses. Can’t judge a person by the tightness of their jeans.</p>
<p>I visited Wesleyan when I was choosing colleges – I liked their academics, but I thought their closeness to NYC gave the school a competitive feel I didn’t like as much.</p>
<p>FWIW, I never heard D1 complain that her fellow students (at Oberlin) were not involved in their studies.</p>
<p>D1 didn’t like Wesleyan when she visited, nevertheless it seems to me that these two schools have a large overlap in applicants. If that’s the case, how different can the matriculants be?</p>
<p>I guess the answer might be somewhat, perhaps, due to location if nothing else. D1 much preferred the “Midwest wing” to the “Political wing”, from what I understood.</p>
<p>ardentiststate: may I ask when exactly you visited? your view seems a bit extreme and not quite reality… I can tell you that there isn’t a “widespread uniform domination of the ‘hipster’ mentality” by any means.</p>
<p>Both Oberlin and Wesleyan appear prominently on the Top 10 Hipster Colleges list, and among the “limosine liberals” list, fairly or unfairly, and as others have pointed out, there is significant overlap in the applicant pool. But I also agree with the comments that the location of each school changes the campus “environment” somewhat, in fact significantly for some people. </p>
<p>The other important difference is the presence at Oberlin of a world -class music conservatory, and now a Jazz conservatory, to go along with a world class liberal arts college. Wesleyan does not have that extra flavor shaping the environment and tone on campus. </p>
<p>But in terms of left of center political perspectives, the two schools are basically sympatico. But the same could be said for a majority of LACs north of the Mason Dixon line.</p>
<p>That doesn’t mean music isn’t an important component of the Wesleyan experience, just not conservatory-style music. Rock bands, dance bands, hip-hop performers of all kinds, abound. This, more than anything, probably accounts for the overall illusion that hipsters rule the roost. The #1 hipster band of the moment, MGMT, graduated from Wesleyan.</p>
<p>The OP is entitled to their opinion; I’m not knocking it – it’s their experience. But, as Smartalic34 alluded, if one were to walk by the Wesleyan football field on a typical Fall afternoon, one would be equally justified in thinking Wesleyan was “under the widespread domination” of jocks and fraternity brothers (and, people have jumped to that conclusion!) when, obviously, nothing could be further from the truth.</p>
<p>^
That may be another difference. Oberlin has no frats or sororities. I don’t know if that makes Oberlin more or less liberal than Wesleyan, but it is definitely a difference.</p>
<p>I imagine the frat stuff at Wesleyan is a relatively marginal presence. Maybe more of a difference is the reference to walking by the football field. Wesleyan plays in a real sports league, with other schools that are serious about it, hence a commensurate proportion of the class, to play in that league, must be actual athletes. Of sorts, anyway. To walk by the Oberlin football field, might one have to first ask for directions to it?</p>
<p>^
LOL, Mndydad. Talk about contrasts with football and school spirit. Forget Wesleyan. I have a kid at Penn State (and another at Oberlin). Talk about enshrinement of a sport. Have you seen the stadium in University Park, PA? OMG!!</p>
<p>ardentiststate, many of the ills that you mention are present at Oberlin. I would never pretend that Oberlin is perfect, or entertain the whitewashed lies that it is a totally open-minded place. I have many problems with the institution itself, and with the atmosphere of student life here. But, that said, I absolutely love Oberlin, and would have to emphasize that no matter your proclivities, worldview, ambitions, or interests, there is a place for everyone.</p>
<p>Politically, conservatives will be marginal, if attempting to tackle political issues vocally. The Ronald Reagan Lectureship series does exist, but it’s something of a mystery as to who runs it, the College Republicans aren’t exactly visible. And while Newt Gingrich did come and speak, it is people like Michael Pollan who are rock stars who are political and social rock stars on this campus. </p>
<p>There is a great deal of superficiality at Oberlin. In my first year, it troubled me, and I came close to transferring. But it takes some time to settle in, and to start seeing the nuances to the place, to understand what is important. Visiting Oberlin, whether getting the sanitized Admissions vision of it, or staying in the dorms and seeing a snapshot of life, cannot suffice in showing you the essence of Oberlin. </p>
<p>If you want to know more specific details, feel free to shoot me a PM.</p>
<p>Ardentistate-- I am an alum of Wesleyan (some years now…) and my D is going to go to Oberlin starting this Fall. She may be the one to answer your questions about her chosing Oberlin; however, my impression as a parent visiting both campuses (during the whole search process this past year) was that the schools are similar in the academic and intellectual challenge. The atmosphere at both schools differs in ways that only you will be able to sense is “the right fit”. My D really wanted to be able to take full advantage of both the Intellectual challenges and the Music challenges that went along with the Conservatory programs. I am very pleased with her choice!</p>
<p>ardentiststate, you’ve stated your impression of Wesleyan based on a visit, and you’ve admitted to having visited Oberlin. But you haven’t shared your own opinion about Oberlin based on your visit. What do you think of Oberlin? How do you feel Wesleyan and Oberlin are similar or different? Forget what the rest of us think. What was your impression of Oberlin?</p>
<p>Aredentistate–visiting colleges can be really time consuming and expensive; however, we found that the schools my D really found engaging, were the ones she visited (some she liked, some she knew pretty quickly were not for her). Our plan was to find several schools she could “see herself going to” if something out of her control occurred and “it” (whatever school named) was the only one left standing. If you take that approach, you will have several schools you will be happy about attending when the acceptances and/or denial letters arrive. I would encourage you to visit Oberlin, if you are at all interested in a fine, small Liberal Arts College. If you are really unable to visit, than finding some students from your local area who have attended Oberlin, would also help you with your understanding. Although, I know from my D’s experience, her own experience about Oberlin was what sold her on the school. All schools really do have their own “feel”.</p>
<p>Ardentiststate - judging from your posts (all thirteen of them as of today) you should probably be looking at places more along the Chicago, Swarthmore, Columbia continuum rather than the Brown, Wesleyan, Oberlin, Vassar, etc. continuum. Less reachey but equally impeccable places might be Sewanee, Davidson, maybe Emory and Rice – southern schools more known for their academics than their party atmospheres. Another suggestion might be tiny Claremont McKenna College in California which has a more focused emphasis on finance and political science, though beware that the overall hipster/straight-edge balance might be upset by the presence of nearby Pitzer, Pomona, Scripps, and even Harvey Mudd to a certain extent.</p>
<p>You may also want to stick to bigger universities; the caveat with LACs is that they are so small that if you make a mess of things socially, you could wind up paying for it all four years. There are plenty of people at Williams, Swarthmore and Wesleyan with crappy social lives who become VERY involved with their studies, and graduate with all kinds of honors for that very reason. :D</p>
<p>Kid’s list of favorite schools for Fall 2010 admission had Oberlin 6th or 7th (out of 8) . . . until the visit, when it jumped up to the one of the Top 2. Interested in Math and Music, kid found a better balance of the 2 at Oberlin compared to either Wesleyan or Vassar (McGill ended up being too large for kid’s tastes.) The strength of the music was a key factor (The Conservatory is Top 5 in the country) , and I think the kid found the social scene at Oberlin to be more authentic and accepting of Quirkiness than Wesleyan. Not that Wesleyan is full of posers, but it felt somewhat heavier than Oberlin. In other words, the “feel” fit well. </p>
<p>On the other hand, a classmate of the kid’s who has a more socially serious bent is going to Swarthmore and he probably would have found the social atmosphere at Oberlin too twee . . . so it gets back to “fit” with you, academically; and socially.</p>
<p>In general, hard to do better academically than Oberlin, although that depends in part on what you’re interested in studying.</p>