Test optional means exactly that, and there is no disadvantage to applicants in applying that way, except sometimes for merit aid. Here is the best list of schools that don’t require or emphasize standardized tests: https://www.fairtest.org/university/optional Chances are this list will only grow.
Young people who want to go into medicine do not have to major in premed or biology. They can major in anything. Prerequisites for med school have to be done, but there are post-baccalaureate programs for grads for that if those courses aren’t done during undergrad. Random example: https://www.goucher.edu/learn/graduate-programs/post-baccalaureate-premed-program/
One way to deal with grad school costs is to find funded programs, sometimes master’s which are part of a doctoral program (terminal or non-terminal master’s may fit this category). We were told, at least in one field, not to worry so much about grad expenses when deciding on undergrad. Others may feel differently but for us that turned out to be true. Obviously professional schools like med and law are probably exceptions.
Finally, our Guidance Counselor automatically funneled families needing financial aid to public colleges and universities, including community college. This is sometimes too bad. Many top schools are extremely affordable due to generous financial aid (Harvard is usually cheaper than a state college for family incomes under $150k). And merit aid, which takes a lot of research, may also make a private school more affordable.
Two of mine were told to apply to publics but ended up at Ivies for almost no cost. That said, one of mine came home from a full-ride private to do community college and then finish at a small private that is not full-ride but affordable. She also needed to live at home a little longer. Every family situation is different, every kid is different, and sometimes the easiest path- state school- is the easiest path, and the kid is happy. Just wanted to mention that when that seems like the only affordable path, often that isn’t true.
Curious how to help steer this ship…
My DD22 feels pretty certain about a BSN major and going direct admit. Alas, these programs are super competitive, and it definitely restricts the colleges she can look into. Would it be wise to have her also apply to non BSN schools with a Biology or biochemistry major as a plan B? And she can consider an advanced BSN program thereafter if she still feels drawn to nursing?
@tumagmom in my opinion, anyone hoping to gain admission to any competitive program needs plan B schools on their list that will move them in the direction of their goal. So, yes, i would say some schools where you need to apply to nursing after the first year or something like that should be included. In addition some who aspire to be nurses go the ADN from a CC and then get their BSN while working.
Hello,
working on the college list. Any suggestion on how to select colleges based on critical information. what should I be looking mainly in colleges? what are the basic criteria?
@VaADHDmom your daughter’s list seems very reach heavy, even if you are a VA resident. I’m not sure which of your schools are test optional for next year but that SAT 1250 may be a problem. Your GC would know better the chances for VTech (which you are calling a safety)
You may want to look at small schools with pharmacy programs. Presbyterian college is very small but seemed willing to work with all students when we toured. Another not-quite-so-small school with nursing and pharmacy is Regis in Denver.
During the application process, it is probably encouraged for the student (instead of parent) to have most contact with the colleges of interest, but are there certain things that it would be okay for a parent to make contact with the colleges instead? I’m thinking financial aid clarification in particular. Or is it best for the student alone to be reaching out to prospective schools?
The student should be making a list of what they would like to see in a college…the characteristics. These can include anything important to that student in their college search.
Things typically included:
Location (urban, suburban, rural)
Size
Geographic area (distance from home, geographic location)
Potential Majors
ECs offered
Weather (yes, some students have a preference)
Ease of getting to and from the school.
AFFORDABILITY
Public or Private
Religious or not
Size of classes
Career center and job recruiting
Internship potential
%age of commuters
Anything really.
As I noted upstream…my kids made their list.
Kid 1
Urban campus
Proximity to performing arts venues
Excellent private music teacher in his instrument
Excellent student orchestra and conductor
Good public transportation
Kid 2
Strong sciences
Pleasing weather (which meant no snow)
Ability to play in the student orchestra and not major/minor in music
Urban campus
As a family we also had one criteria…
College needed to be within a 3 hour drive from our home or within one hour drive of a close family friend or relative.
These were the things that were important to our kids. Your student needs to make a list of things that are important to them.
Thumper’s post 66 is a reason we started by early visiting a few local colleges, not necessarily contenders. In some cases, a quick look-see. Even with covid, you can take a look, drive through campus and the surrounding area.
Eg, one of mine was instantly turned off by the size of an urban campus about an hour away. (And similarly, the flagship, not urban at all but huge.) For us, it helped to know she (probably) wanted smaller, a more contained campus. Etc. In the beginning, they can’t always pull ideas out of their heads or envision what it might feel like, from a description in a college guide.
For those beginning the college search this year. Look at the virtual tours. Some colleges have great ones with narratives. You can get a good feel at least for what the school and buildings look like.
As @lookingforward noted, even though formal visits and tours might not be happening, you can still drive around many college towns and campuses. When we began our college hunts, our kids really didn’t know what they were looking for (except their areas of interest). Whenever we drove someplace, if there was a college gate, we went through it and drove around or parked and. Walked around (not sure how easy that is to do now). This helped the kids see larger campuses, and smaller ones, and the surrounding towns or cities.
I will add that our kids both applied to quite the variety of size schools from schools under 2000 to schools well above 20,000. They found strengths they liked in each place where they sent applications.
Even with criteria defined by the student, I would still suggest keeping an open mind. Sometimes a school will pop out of nowhere and will become a top contender.
Until you have had the money talk with your parents, none of the other points in the college shopping list matter. You need to know how they expect you to pay for your education. Will they pay it all? Will they pay some of it? Will they pay none of it? How much is available? Are they going to attach any conditions (major, location, college GPA, etc.)? Yes you can go ahead and choose a couple of places to investigate, but sit down with your parents and run the Net Price Calculators at each of those college/university websites. Provide some favored adult beverages and a box of soft tissues along with your moral support for them during those calculations. If your parents are truly horrified by the numbers, point them to the Financial Aid forum here where they can get help from some of our resident experts.
Totally agree with @happymomof1 about finances. You need to be realistic about what your family can and will contribute towards your college costs.
If you can’t pay the costs…you won’t be able to attend.
Adding…it’s very easy to find those reach schools and even match schools. But everyone needs at least one sure thing…a place where they are pretty well guaranteed acceptance, that is affordable and that the student would be happy to attend. Build your list from the bottom up. Find that sure thing first. I always suggest finding two sure things because it’s nice to have choices.
I’ve mentioned my second kid a few times. Four of the colleges she applied to…out of five…were sure things. She really really liked all of these schools. Her initial application list was three schools long…very likely acceptances to all three…and she applied EA or rolling to them and had those three acceptances by Dec 15 at the latest. She then wanted to add a reach (where she did not get accepted) and we asked her to add a parent pick which was any college closer to our home (accepted there too).
But her feeling was that she wanted to apply to schools where her criteria were met, and she would get accepted. With 3000 or so colleges, she found those first three applications with just some queries here and with others who lived near where these schools were located. Honestly, those last two applications, the reach and the parent choice, were a waste of time and money.
As noted at the beginning of this AMA, our daughter went the CC to State U route for her education. As for so many other families, that decision was determined by costs. What we saved the first two years helped make the second two years possible.
She had a great experience at her community college. I did pay attention to her courses so that she was on track to graduate with her AA in two years, and to have the courses needed to guarantee admission at the state U she liked best. That university accepted her AA as fulfilling all of its Gen Ed requirements except for its own junior year writing course. All but one of the courses she had taken at the CC in her major had full equivalency and automatically replaced those specific university courses. She was able to step straight into junior level classes. After taking the university version of the one class that wasn’t considered equivalent, she told me that she was glad she’d been required to do so as it covered certain topics in greater depth than the CC version had.
Her university ran separate orientation sessions by major for the transfer students, so she met the other incoming students for her department before classes began. That meant that none of them had the sense that they were the only new student in a class or in the department. One thing that she and her transfer friends told me was that they felt that the transfers were more focused than their classmates who had been at that U from the beginning. They attributed this to their experiences at their CCs where they had opportunities in their freshman and sophomore years that normally go to juniors and seniors at 4-year institutions.
Just as at her community college, she had a great experience at her university. She’s fiercely loyal to both and wouldn’t trade those four years for anything. Some of her experience is specific to the CC and university that she attended, but much of it would be the same for students at other institutions as well. This pathway is definitely worth keeping in mind.
@thumper1 We also had our D21 apply to a (her choice) local option even though we are 95% sure she will not end up there. She wants warm and that means all but one application was far away. You just never know what might change (health issues/change if family circumstances/sudden desire to stay closer to home). Especially in an application year during a pandemic, I don’t consider the local application to be a waste of money, more like an insurance policy?.
@happymomof1 makes excellent points about the community college option…which is one many students might need to consider for one reason or another. I want to be clear…I’m not saying every student should apply to a community college. What I am saying is this can be an excellent, cost effective way to get a college degree.
Most community colleges have open enrollment. This means anyone can apply to and be accepted as a student. Yes, some states have community college programs that do fill (CA, for example) but most have spots for anyone wishing to attend.
One can take general education courses and even courses (not upper level ones) that will apply towards a four year degree when the student transfers.
Community colleges offer varieties of schedules to meet the needs of their students. Around here (CT) there are many evening classes, and even some Saturday classes. The enables students to work while attending college.
All community colleges have articulation agreements with some four year universities. This means that if you are successful at the CC, you will be guaranteed admission to a four year school and your credits will transfer.
My husband (back in the Stone Age) went to an elite school. Let’s just say…it didn’t work out. He left colleges and pursued work in the arts in NYC for about 7 years. He decided to return to college shortly after we married. We lived two blocks from our local CC. So he enrolled. He took about 1 1/2 years of coursework there…satisfying all of his general education requirements and a couple of required science and mathematics courses for his engineering major. The CC had an articulation agreement with a university with a well regarded engineering program. He enrolled and was successful and graduated.
One thing my husband has said…he had CC professors who were adjuncts who worked in engineering as their day jobs. They knew what these young students needed to know practically because these profs were working in the field. DH felt this was a huge advantage. He never felt short changed. Plus, he was given excellent guidance, and subsequently got his degree for a lot less cost than if he had started at a four year university.
It’s an option that’s a good one…and certainly meets the needs of thousands and thousands of high school grads as well as non traditional students every year.
So…if needed, keep the community college option in mind. It can be the ticket to a fine career and future.
I am a new member on CC. I had wanted to post on parent4parent forum. Not sure if this is the right way to post here. A question about whether Brown should stay on my daughter’s college list.
My senior kid has Brown on her list. She told me one of her classmates has been accepted by Brown as an athletic recruit. Based on past years’ record, Brown only accepts one student from her school. Now my question is: should my kid still apply to Brown knowing her chance of getting in is very slim? She has finished all her essays for Brown. Should i suggest to her to switch to another school to replace Brown? Thanks in advance for your perspective!
Below are some stats: SAT 1540; SAT math II 800 (only took one before COVID); GPA: top 20% of rigorous college prep. private high school; Many leadership roles at school including president of debate team/debate club, swim team captain, premed club president, Peer tutoring club president, nationally ranked debater, attended Yale young global scholar summer camp