How to convince my parents

Colleges and Universities A-Z Smith College
1

<p>Hey guys, I've never posted before (I've just read all of the topics), so... hi!</p>

<p>Well, I LOVE Smith! I'll say that right now. It's my safety, but I LOVE LOVE LOVE it more than any other school that I'm applying to. The issue, though, is that it's my safety. My top four favorite schools are Smith, Middlebury, Vassar, and Brown (from favorite to least favorite of my favorites). Obviously, Brown is the hardest to get admitted to. It's a reach, Vassar is a match, Middlebury is a small reach, and Smith is a safety.</p>

<p>My mom is really not excited about the idea of me going to Smith. First of all, it's my safety, and she thinks that I'm too smart to go there (so not true). Second, she's scared that I'll become a radial feminist who hates all men (I'm already a lesbian, so she's not worried about that). Third, she wasn't that impressed by the general state of the campus and its facilities. Fourth, she thought Noho was weird.</p>

<p>Well, okay...
1. There are girls at Smith with my grades-- I'll just be one of the brighter students, and I like being seen as smart!
2. Um. I'm already kind of a feminist, but I'll never hate men because half of my friends are guys.
3. The buildings are all built in the style of the period, and that's why there's not a ton of stone buildings with ivy (my mom went to McGill, aka Hogwarts).
4. Noho is awesome and by far the best college town I've seen out of where I've visited.</p>

<p>My mom is Canadian so she doesn't get this whole finding a fit thing for college. She thinks that you should go to the most prestigious school that you can (aka Brown in my case).</p>

<p>How can I convince my mom (and dad, because he agrees with her) that Smith will give me the best education and that I'll have the best time there?</p>

2

<p>You can't. However, maybe you can convince them to make your own decision, that where you are happiest you will learn best.</p>

<p>Maybe you can show them this.</p>

<p>Special Report
America's Best Colleges
08.13.08, 6:00 PM ET</p>

<p>Rank Name State Cost Freshman Class Size
1 Princeton University NJ 47,975 1,242
2 California Institute of Technology CA 46,560 231
3 Harvard University MA 48,550 1,668
4 Swarthmore College PA 48,215 365
5 Williams College MA 47,140 540
6 United States Military Academy NY NA 1,272
7 Amherst College MA 48,352 NA
8 Wellesley College MA 47,870 590
9 Yale University CT 50,350 1,318
10 Columbia University NY 49,260 1,333
11 Northwestern University IL 49,779 1,981
12 Wabash College IN 35,550 250
13 Centre College KY 37,000 316
14 Massachusetts Institute of Technology MA 48,200 1,067
15 Bowdoin College ME 48,260 476
16 United States Air Force Academy CO 0 1,214
17 Middlebury College VT 50,160 644
18 University of Chicago IL 49,976 1,300
19 Smith College MA 47,976 656
20 Pomona College CA 47,580 375
21 Wesleyan University CT 49,346 733
22 Haverford College PA 48,932 315
23 Stanford University CA 49,227 1,721
24 Hamilton College NY 47,900 468
25 Sarah Lawrence College NY 52,210 363</p>

<pre><code>Brown isn't even on the top 25 list. Neither is Vassar. The next school is Barnard.
</code></pre>

3

<p>That's one of those by-the-students rankings, right?
Just wondering.</p>

<p>That could be helpful. I don't know, I just feel bad telling them that yes, I really do love Smith. My dad made some comment the other day about how i would definitely go to Brown if I got in... right? I don't know, I was all psyched about it until I visited Smith.</p>

4

<p>Nope. This is Forbes Magazine, a top money magazine. I don't hold by rankings, but it might convince your parents.</p>

5

<p>but, the data behind the rankings were based largely on faculty evaluations submitted voluntarily by students. What makes this particular polling result significant is that no one (besides the individual colleges, themselves) was really paying any attention to to these evaluations or had any stake in their outcome until Forbes came along. They're probably the last unbiased version of these faculty evaluations you're ever going to see again.</p>

6

<p>At this point, why worry about it? Unless you're trying to apply early decision to Smith, just apply to all of them and see where you get in. Maybe you'll only get into Smith and then the problem will be solved.</p>

<p>Note: do NOT try to sabotage your other applications! you may find that you prefer a different school a few months down the road, or Smith may not give you enough financial aid or something.</p>

7

<p>@ mythmom
I was talking about what johnwesley said--the students wrote evaluations that determined those rankings.</p>

<p>@ stacy
I'm just a worrywart. I'm looking for ideas for the future, and I definitely won't sabatoge my other applications... I'd be really upset if I did that. I'm a perfectionist.</p>

8

<p>Perhaps with a truly outstanding record you will be offered a STRIDE. There isn't another college in the country that permits first year students to do what Smith does in that arena. D's friend going to Brown this year would cut off his right arm (and probably a few other body parts as well) to have her research spot. I also sincerely doubt that you will find yourself without intellectual peers at Smith- just because they don't value the SAT as highly as some of the other schools (thereby lowering their ranking in some of the ranking service lists) does not mean that the class is inferior. If you come into the school believing that you are heads and above over the rest of the class I think you will find yourself in for quite a surprise.</p>

9

<p>That makes me feel good, because I really love the school and I'd love to be among intellectual peers (which, from everything that I've heard, it seems like I will be). I'm not going into a research field, but I have heard that there are amazing oppurtunities at Smith for those who are.</p>

10

<p>Teliana, STRIDEs aren't limited to science and engineering majors -- there are opportunities in a wide variety of disciplines to work one-on-one with professors. I've known students who had English- and French-based STRIDE scholarships, and I'm sure there are other posters who could give you more detail about them (one poster here has a D whose primary project involved opera, if I remember correctly).</p>

11

<p>Teliana, my D was close to your profile. Dunno if she would have been admitted to Brown...didn't apply...and got turned down by Yale EA...but she was a non-Science & Engineering STRIDE at Smith and had an experience that was spectacular, both academically and non. After being at Smith a year she said, "Yale could call now and I'd tell them no thanks." </p>

<p>While being toward the top of her admit class, she took advantage of a lot at Smith. Note: Smith offers so many opportunities that no one student can take advantage of them all. She spent her junior year split between Washington, D.C., and Budapest; one of her good friends split hers between Rome and Oxford. She did STRIDE research her first two years and had multiple job options for her senior year.</p>

<p>She never felt a lack of challenge at Smith or looked down on any of her classmates. "Dad, there are very few slackers here and while not everyone is going to be my best friend, I respect [the overwhelming majority]."</p>

<p>Btw, I agree heavily about seeking the notion of "fit." For some Smith is it and for others it is not. With my D, you could almost hear an audible click each time she stepped on campus...two visits and then for move-in. Sounds as if you might be the latter.</p>

<p>My D's post-Smith first job is at a place that's littered with degrees from places like Swarthmore, Wellesley, and Harvard...she fits in just fine. Ditto when she was on an abroad program with students from places like Yale.</p>

<p>I agree with you about NoHo. Fortunately, I have a reason [relatives in the area] to visit again sometime. It's spectacular.</p>

12

<p>I second what TheDad has said; you will find many many super bright posters (and parents of) on this thread. STRIDE is a fantastic opportunity. Even though my D worked with an advisor outside her chosen field, she found it immensely rewarding and has a professor of international renown ready to recommend her. If you want to be challenged, don't worry, you will be, I guarantee. Like your parents, I was somewhat doubtful a year ago, but am now totally convinced. Far more omportant, so is my daughter.</p>

13

<p>I don't really know what STRIDE is... maybe I haven't done enough research on Smith? I don't know. I do know that what I've seen, I've loved.</p>

14

<p>LiT...so good to see you again! I hope things are going well. Please drop me a line if you get a chance.</p>

<p>Teliana: Smith has about four merit aid awards. Zollmans, a half-tuition award, about a half dozen a year being given, are aimed at top top students that Smith thinks may be going to an Ivy or equivalent and wants badly to steal. Mini's D (see posts in various threads) was a Zollman. </p>

<p>There are also awards for the Picker Engineering program...someone can provide you info on this, I wasn't in that loop.</p>

<p>STRIDE scholarships...now $10K per year...are given to 35-40 students. Besides the grant, the students are matched up with dozens of possibilities with professors who are looking for help on research. The research does <em>not</em> have to be within the student's major or minor field of study. Some of them are grunt work/slave labor...asking around about a professor's rep can help you sort out which are which. Many are great opportunities and they pay in lieu of work study. My D was credited in a presentation paper based on some work she did beginning her very first semester at Smith. (To be clear, she graduated in May.)</p>

<p>Umm...trying to stay modest with LiT's very kind complement...one of the things that I can say that has impressed the blazes out of me is how great, collectively, the Smithies I've met are, from recent/current students to alums two or three or even six decades out. </p>

<p>At a prospect party we attended when D was first checking out Smith, I was blown away by the students...and I'm a tough critic. After five years of meeting her housemates and classmates, not to mention several who I've read and watched here on CC, I could very well understand D's feeling later about everyone not necessarily being her best friend (though she made many wonderful friendships at Smith) but respected the overwhelming majority. The peer group is outstanding and as a parent I couldn't be happier with my D's experience. Well, yeah I could...when our loans are paid off. Worth every penny though.</p>

15

<p>All Zollman's are also given the opportunity to be STRIDEs. This year, in June, my D (A Zollman/Stride) was sent a list of some 80 projects to look over ranging which projects were in all areas of interest including a new set of international projects. You haven't mentioned your areas of interest, but having looked over the scope of the choices this year I can guarantee there would have been a few that popped out at you. The students were asked to rank their favorites and explain why they wanted to participate in those they chose. In July, the students were matched with the faculty that they would be working with. Although my D plans to be a math major, she chose a cutting edge research project related to molecular genetics. How many first year students get to work in a Genetics lab after receiving private genetics lessons from a full professor? Many of the STRIDES are afforded the opportunity to not only co-author papers with faculty, but to present them at various conferences internationally. While this is a paid position (which is nice) it is the opportunity to work one on one with a full professor in a way unparalleled in any other school that makes this work. These merit positions are something that you cannot apply for- you either get the letter or you don't. But if you do, it is a serious incentive to turn down the ivys (something D hasn't regretted for a second. Even though she has only been a Smithie for a few weeks, I've watched her bubble with happiness every day since she arrived.)</p>

16

<p>I don't think you have to worry about having intellectual peers at Smith. My daughter was a National Merit Finalist and she thinks Smith is very intellectually challenging. She took a class at Amherst and had no trouble getting an A in it. She was surprised at how little the Amherst students contribute to class discussion.</p>

17

<p>Oh, I see what STRIDE is now. That sounds really awesome! I don't want to get my hopes up, though :-P</p>

<p>To be clear, my academic interests are French and music (although I'll definitely want to take Spanish too, and maybe Russian). Since I have plenty of people who are willing to recommend Smith here, does anyone know anything about what the language programs are like?</p>

18

<p>
[quote]
She was surprised at how little the Amherst students contribute to class discussion.

[/quote]
Some Smithies are quiet in class but overall they're a mouthy & contentious lot...and I mean that in a good way. Perhaps "assertive" is a more genteel descriptor. And many Smithies who weren't assertive when they arrive become so by the time they leave...a good thing, I think.</p>

<p>One of the things that caught my D's attention when she was a prospect was a Smithie saying that they weren't intimidated from speaking up in class like some of the young women at Amherst seemed to be...letting the guys do most of the talking.</p>

<p>Synergy, right you are. All Zollman's are STRIDE's but not all STRIDE's are Zollman's. I use the quick-and-dirty distinction for level of award and just how competitive it is to get. Congratulations to your D about her Zollman.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Even though she has only been a Smithie for a few weeks, I've watched her bubble with happiness every day since she arrived.

[/quote]
Amen. I know the feeling. I feel as if my D hit the karmic jackpot by attending Smith.</p>

19

<p>The Picker engineering scholarship is $10,000 a year for four years (my little sister was offered this, but alas, she chose a different school in another state). Based on the letter she received when it was offered to her, it's just a scholarship, with no guaranteed research.</p>

20

<p>Hi telianathegreat! Your mom sounds a lot like me. My fears and concerns about Smith ran along similiar lines. </p>

<p>We just dropped off our beloved first-year daughter at Smith a couple of weeks ago. She has written to tell us that for the first time in her life she feels she has found a place where she belongs -- socially and academically. What more reassuring words to a skeptical mom could there be?</p>

<p>What truly makes a school "best" or even "better" than another? It is not found in the rankings. It is finding that place where your mind and spirit are at home. </p>

<p>Without elaborating her stats, suffice it to say my daughter was top-tier in just about every way you can imagine: academics, athletics, music, service, etc. And I think she is a very fine person, to boot. Smith was not my first choice for her for reasons similar to those of your mother. Today I cannot tell you how glad I am that I let her make this intensely personal decision for herself. She made the right one and I would not have done so. It was folks here on College Confidential that encouraged me to trust my daughter, and believe me, it was an incredibly huge leap of faith. </p>

<p>If you would like to send me a private message, I am happy to talk more to you!</p>