<p>Then she has a lot of growing up to do, if she thinks that simply being at an Ivy means "winner." What matters is what people DO with their education.</p>
<p>Truman, Nixon, Eisenhower, both Clintons, all didn't go to Ivies for their UG. (Plenty more, was trying to think of "important" people who would "write" history ;) )</p>
<p>And if one looks a bit broader, many world leaders went to little known colleges in foreign countries and still were able to shape world history!</p>
<p>Forget about field hockey for admissions purposes, let your D concentrate on what she thinks is interesting to her.</p>
<p>BTW, as a girl, your D might have a slight admission advantage at pure science/engineering schools (such as Harvey Mudd).</p>
<p>However, if field hockey is a fun stress release for your daughter, then that's all the reason she needs to pursue it.</p>
<p>ParentofIvyHope- Kids really are able to ace every test, get A's in every class, etc. Me, along with many of my friends either don't study or hardly do. Only in the hardest 2-3 classes at the school is 'studying' an actual requirement to get an A.</p>
<p>Spearman's G refers to this, intelligence is most likely well spread out, although some favoritism may exist.</p>
<p>But seriously, study skills and other similar things can allow HS A's. But you can do it without those. Conciousness is enough for Ivy type kids to get A's in most(and sometimes all) of their classes. I took AP's because those are the only classes that actually require me to learn new stuff, and being bored actually sucks. The free time after school is nice, but class is painful. I took World History last year(rather than AP Euro) - and was the only kid in the class able to spot Iraq on a map. Trust me when I'm saying that AP's are a relief rather than a burden in most cases(Physics C, an exception).</p>
<p>dsc, seems your school is kind of lacking....if you don't have to study to get As, then you have grade inflation and a mediocre school, sad to say</p>
<p>Try going to another school that makes you actually study, and my instinct tells me when you get to college, you will be in store for a bit of a shock</p>
<p>Grade inflation - no, compared to nearly every other school I've seen on here we have a much harsher curve(a 3.7 is well within the top 10%, vs. many where a 3.95 UW is out of the top 10%).</p>
<p>Lacking - yes, so I have taken community college, online, and other classes. As have some others at my school, expressly for the purpose of a smooth transition to college.</p>
<p>And I was not speaking of a completely widespread thing, but among the very top group of students at my school - it is a truth. And from talking to people at other schools, that is a pretty common truth. Now, if I went to Andover, Deerfield, or the like, it would be different, same as if I went to Birmingham or other top publics in the area. I don't.</p>
<p>So please don't misunderstand, I will find challenges where I can, but the top students at a school generally don't have to study. That is how they can do all the cool EC's and the like. The difference is, the top students at Andover are a much more select group than the top students at my HS.</p>
<p>ParentofIvyHope, let me give some advice, too. I'm a Yale alum, and I'd REALLY like my son to go to Yale, and he'd very much like to go there, and I think he has a good chance. So what am I telling him? I'm telling him how great Brown, Tufts, NYU, Wash U, Vanderbilt, and the honors program at the state flagship are. I'm taking him to visit all those places, and I'm talking them up. I'm urging him to picture himself at each of these places, and not to imagine that his future happiness is based on any one of them. I strongly urge you to do something similar with your daughter.</p>
<p>ParentofIH,
WOW. After reading most of this thread I just have to comment. You need to listen to the advice of the other posters! There is NO guaranteed leverage to get you into an elite university. If there was everyone would be doing it! Appearing to do something to gain leverage, however, will certainly guarantee a rejection!
As far as the sports aspect, I find your lack of knowledge astounding. Kids who are recruited by D1, D2 and even D3 schools have spent countless hours and years playing their sports. Colleges don't even bother recruiting at high school games rather they go to College Showcases where USS Teams, Club Teams, Premier Teams, Futures Teams, Elite Teams (different sports call their elite teams by different names) compete. Even then it is up to the athlete to contact the coach to let them know that they will be there. The fact that your daughter only played for a very short time does not bode will for her chances. If she really likes it she can play club field hockey in college. If she is that good then she can speak to the coach at the college where she is attending. I personally find it very arrogant of you to think that just because you played in college and that you think that your daughter has some talent, that she can bypass all of the other kids who have spent thousands of hours and dollars playing for the love of the sport and not merely as a means to get into an Ivy.
And as far as field hockey being played by women in American universities, it's being going on for at least 30 years when I played in college--Title 9!!</p>
<p>I played field hockey (club) and let me tell you, it didn't seem to carry a lot of weight in my college applications. I was also in the varsity team for cross-country and got some awards, schools didn't bother with that either.
You have to be a "real" star athlete to get noticed, and One Three Hill is an idiotic show (:</p>
<p>^^It depends on the sport. I know D1 rowing teams depend on people who have never rowed before to join their teams. If you were decent at it, you might be able to gain leverage. Of course, at least the first boat of the best places were all recruited, but they need more than just one boat.</p>
<p>I don't know what is the case with field hockey, however. In any case, I would try to find out if her skills are good enough to have a chance at D1. Like other posters said, it's not worth spending the summer to find out. Maybe she can ask an ivy coach to get an assessment. Or maybe ask the coach of a nearby school with a field hockey team to assess her. Even if it's borderline, I do think it could be a tip factor. </p>
<p>Also, the OP is somewhat correct when she says that teams might want an exceptional student to put on their teams. I read an article where it said ivies sometime put people on their bench with high SAT scores but lesser athletic skills just to raise the SAT averages for the teams. I don't know whether this practice still exists after it was exposed.</p>
<p>Frankly, I don't think the OP's D will need a tip factor. I don't think there is that many people genuinely interested in computer engineering, let alone female engineers, that want to go to Yale.</p>
<p>This is ** such ** a minor point in a thread filled with points that other posters have already addressed, but for what it's worth, the SAT average of any college team is not something that gets talked about much (in the vast majority of cases, not at all). No coach anywhere would recruit or spend a tip on an unproven player just because of scores.</p>
<p>If what you're thinking about, collegealum, is scholar/athlete awards and honor rolls and such - which definitely do get celebrated at D1, D2, and D3 levels - players must be starters or "key reserves" to be counted toward the teams' averages or considered for individual awards. A bench-warming star student doesn't do a thing for the coach. </p>
<p>3-2go's assessment is very accurate for almost all college sports and very definitely so for field hockey. Sure, crew operates a little differently - but we're not talking about crew for the OP's daughter.</p>
<p>Seriously, OP, please listen to the very good advice offered in numerous posts in this thread. We understand and empathize with your wish to help your daughter. I happen to think that following Hunt's suggested strategy is a far wiser way to help her, in the long run. As a parent, you are in a wonderful position to help your daughter gain a better, healthier perspective and a more mature understanding of what a winner is. Isn't that what you really want for her?</p>
<p>^^Well, I read an article a few years ago that said the ivies did try to manipulate the SAT averages of their teams in that way. I did not hypothesize it based on individual academic awards reserves have won. Maybe the article was wrong, but that is what I read. About 10 years ago, the ivy league decided that the SAT average of their teams should be within a certain amount away from the SAT average of the school at large. According to the article, the practice of stocking the bench with a few high SAT scorers was designed to boost the team average to within the acceptable number away from the school SAT average.</p>
<p>Most bench warmers are excellent HS and/or club players who have dedicated in the sport for many years. Unfortunately, OP's D is a new field hockey player who is looking to spend a summer in the sport to give her a hook. If it is so easy, the field hockey or any sport camps will be flooded by 100000000 students this summer.</p>
<p>My son played in an elite hockey team when he was very young. Many of his teammates went on to win the young national hockey championship. Will any of those stellar players be recruited to play for D1 hockey? The chance is very slim. Most D1 hockey teams are stocked with Canadian who have played Junior Major two or three years after high schools before the coaches look at them. It help not help at all if the students just win the state HS championships.</p>
<p>It is possible that some sports will take students who have never played the sport before. Crew, or other sports that very few people played in HS, is an example. Any students can join the Crew team. But it will not help in the admission process. Field Hockey is a popular HS sport. There are just so many good players out there.</p>
<p>OP's D is a great student. I am sure that she can get into a very selective school. Nevertheless I think Hunt's suggested strategy is a the way to go. Her D future and happiness really doesn't depend on any Ivy schools.</p>
<p>Oh, ok. I got the feeling that the OP's D was not a new player, but had been playing for years and was at the very least would be a solid varsity high school player (or maybe better.)</p>
<p>I knew field hockey was more popular than crew because it doesn't require water, but I wasn't sure how prevalent it was on high school campuses. My high school didn't have one.</p>
<p>FYI, I walked on a rowing team with no experience and within a few months was as good as guys that were recruited to the ivies. (It's very easy to assess ability by rowing machine times.) So I figured it was possible that someone who had played for years but wasn't on a high school team could be good enough to get a boost in admissions. Of course, again, I realize there is more skill involved in field hockey than rowing, where technique can be picked up in a matter of weeks...</p>
<p>I highly doubt that the Ivies are in dire need to pad their athletic departments' average SAT scores. With so many applicants to pick and choose from, they will always find stellar athlete-scholars for their non-revenue sports, such as swimming, track, field hockey, etc. One example: a national-level swimmer who will be attending a D1 school on a full athletic scholarship (hardly ever happens in this sport, since there are usually twice as many swimmers than full athletic scholarships on D1 swim teams) was passed by the Ivies because she did not make the minimum ACT cut (I think it was 31) in addition to making the athletic cut of national all-state times. Bottom line: to be recruited for a non-revenue Ivy sport, you have to be both a national level athlete and a great student.</p>
<p>My D's HS has some serious field hockey players and DD particpated in varsity FH and also regional programs. There is one girl from her regional group who plays at DDs university, this girl is good, very good, better than DD.</p>
<p>DD figures she could have walked on and maybe made the team at her university, but she is not experienced enough to be recruitable- played 4 years, 2 varsity, her HS was in the top 8 in the "state champs" so she was on a good team.</p>
<p>DD plays another sport and played at a national team level, so she is a serious athlete and that's why she could be strong at FH, but only four years did not provide the innate instinctive ball handling skills you need for D1 recruitment.</p>
<p>Your D should pursue FH if she loves it and it is her passion- it is not just the sport, it is the PASSION for the sport and the way that passion shows up that would get some one into an Ivy type school</p>
<p>
[quote]
I'm just trying to find ways to beat the admission process and I think it can be done.
[/quote]
Not a good idea to approach it that way. It seems as though most of the kids on CC who tried to do this got burned...</p>
<p>
[quote]
dsc, seems your school is kind of lacking....if you don't have to study to get As, then you have grade inflation and a mediocre school, sad to say
[/quote]
That's a but rude. Anyways, you and ParentOfIvyHope should quit assuming so much. I know that you guys think your kids are intelligent, and they probably are, but you cannot ignore the fact that there are probably other students who are more intelligent than they are and have an easier time learning new and challenging material. I did not have to try very hard at all during AP Calculus AB to get an "A" in the class. Moreover, I only took part of a practice exam yet I was able to get a "5" on the exam. In AP US History, I had a similar experience. I took two multiple choice sections and got a "5" on the exam.</p>
<p>OP -- remember that the adcoms at the Ivies (+Stanford, MIT, Caltech, Duke, Amherst, Swarthmore, Williams, Haverford, Carleton, etc.) read literally 1,000 - 2,000 applications each over the course of the year. They are REALLY good at sniffing out applicants who do not have true passion for their studies and ECs. REALLY GOOD! Like lie detectors. Like they have X-ray vision into the inner motivations of the applicants.</p>
<p>I am not saying that adcoms at Big State U can do this, or even at schools other than these top 20, but these adcoms at the highly selective schools (let's just define that as acceptance rate under 15%) do this for a living! They have eyes wired to see passion, creativity, spark, inner drive. Anything other than that just falls to the floor.</p>
<p>What you are suggesting -- the fabrication of a hook at the last minute, is no different from the posts we see here so often about which and how many ECs the applicant should join in Junior year to "beef up my ECs for the application", as though a certain number or type of EC would get the adcom to check the box saying "Exemplary ECs -- 10/10)"</p>
<p>I appreciate your doggedness and desire to help your DD... but YOU CANNOT FAKE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!</p>
<p>Thanks Everyone who posted it; I was away from CC today so couldn't go thru it earlier.</p>
<p>My D won't have time this summer to play in the club team competition as she got acceptance into 'Stanford Medical Research Institute (SIMR)' for an eight week paid internship and she is planning to accept it. This should strengthen her research portfolio and may come handy at the time of admissions.</p>
<p>So I think she will have to say good by to Field Hockey as D1/D2/D3 team but she now knows that she will be able to join club FH at most Universities.</p>