I do not agree that shadowing is “not terribly useful.” Besides being a requirement, it helps students decide if they really do want to become a doctor.
My daughter had medical school intentions and was a strong applicant on paper. Then she had phlebotomy training at work (after graduation) and continued shadowing. She became anxious drawing blood and realized she didn’t enjoy primary care. She spent a lot of time shadowing primary care physicians, speaking with them, learning about their day-to-day job (which is not very glamorous or exciting).
Shadowing absolutely has value (besides being a requirement) and will help students decide if this is really the path that is right for them.
My daughter never shadowed a physician. She volunteered, then worked, in a vet’s office in high school. She worked in a lab at her university, learning and equipment and lab procedures. She volunteered/worked in a Diabetes clinic sponsored by her university.
I think “shadowing” will help your daughter to learn about what the job entails. But honestly, this is something that is done during high school and early college. If your daughter is absolutely serious about med school, then she needs to independently seek out her own experiences, with patients, BEFORE she even attempts to apply to a med school program.
Also, your daughter needs you. You aren’t’ just there to write checks. She will need a STRONG support system through all of this. Both my husband and I had daily texts or calls about struggles, patients, lack of sleep, rotations, etc.
If she isn’t aware or doesn’t recognize that she will need and needs you, then she’s not ready to go through this process. This is a HARD career on your emotions. You can’t be a good physician in a vacuum. She needs to recognize that physicians recommend good support systems when someone is healing. Physicians/healers need strength and they get that from their loved ones.
Most DO schools require a LOR from a DO. The best way to get that is to develop a relationship by shadowing a DO. In my opinion.
My opinion…whether required or not…how does a student know what a doctor does on a day to day basis without some shadowing. It can’t just be conversation…because, in my opinion, that does not give the whole story.
I was trying to be funny . Yes, we are supporting our daughter but are not actively involved with her schooling or extracurriculars like when she was in HS.
It seems there is a rush to apply. Many (most?) do not apply right from college. They take the time to strengthen their application. Your D doesn’t want to do this? Completing her volunteering after the mcats seems rushed to me.
They need us. ALWAYS. Sometimes, our daughter just wanted to vent at 2 am. I realized she was shouting at us because she just needed to vent and I was too sleepy/tired to respond. But we knew that the next day, she’d be texting us. Covid “did a number” on her mental health and that of her classmates (hazmat wear, body bags, fatigue, etc.).
I think currently she has no plan to apply until she takes the MCAT and get the results. She also working with pre-health advisors for planning and eventually they will help her with her applications. The only advice I always give her is that she needs to focus primarily on her GPA. She can take GAP year(s) to prepare for MCAT and ECs but it’s hard to fix GPA.
She also needs to volunteer with patients, and unless I misunderstood it seems as though she is planning to start this after the mcats. This doesn’t give her much time or experience, given she is in school all day. Maybe I am missing something? Her advisor will help sort all of this out.
And of course, I would shadow (if she hasn’t) even if it isn’t required. Has she worked in underserved communities (seems she has ? and seems she also shadowed). How long did she volunteer?
Shadowing allows a med school applicant hopeful to see what the day to day of medicine behind the scenes. Not just how a physician interacts with patients, but the paperwork, the phone calls with insurance companies, the emails from patients, etc.
Some experiences may be able to be substituted for shadowing. Some adcomms feel that working as medical scribe gives sufficient exposure to the day-to-day that additional shadowing isn’t needed and suggest that scribes subtract some hours from their scribing experience and call them shadowing.
With the increasing use of AI to screen applications, not having any shadowing hours listed on an app can lead to the app being rejected during initial screening.
I think you/your daughter is rather expecting too much from the health professions committee.
If she’s lucky the HP advisor will review her PS and maybe do a mock interview with her. Her school may or may not provide a committee letter, depending on their policies.
Also if your daughter plans to apply as an alumni rather than a current student, she will be at the bottom of the list for getting HP committee time/attention. (Ask me how I know!)
OP has your daughter spoken with current medical students? My daughter found that to be very helpful during college and in the years following.
Also, I will chime in again and agree that volunteer experiences spread out over several years will be more meaningful than those crammed into a short period of time.
The reason longitudinal experiences are more valued is because it allows a student to deeply reflect on their experiences and have their attitudes/opinions evolve over time at different points of maturity and experience.
Younger D actually attended a couple of days of med school classes with her older sister and talked with several of her HS friends who were already in med school before she applied. It was a valuable experience for her to see the volume material covered in a single class and hear about the intensely pressured atmosphere of med school. She knew what she was getting into well before she applied.
I totally vibed with your joke! My daughter is the same way, feels she is at a point in her life when she can run things on her own, and is in contact to chat, connect, reflect but not to seek advice. In fact, if I were to insert myself into things by asking her what she is doing to prepare for applications, or suggest things in any but the most oblique way, she would feel like we didn’t trust her to run her life. Of course, I do know lots of things she doesn’t yet, but she wants to find them out herself. Realistically, this could prolong her path to where she wants to go, but it will increase her sense of ownership of the path, which is very important. So yeah, we’re here as an emotional support, a cheerleading section, and a sounding board (and we send money), in much the same way that my parents were there for us (except they didn’t have money to send!)
For non-clinical, she has been volunteered with food pantry and food recovery network in campus since freshman year along with other volunteers. As for clinical, she volunteered some weekend hours here and there for " Hearts for the Homeless International" and HIV screening volunteer. She also did a a few MA hours during winter/summer break but need to get more hours for clinical, I think. For research, I believe she has enough hours with 1 summer working full time internship and 1 semester research with credit.
I’m sure she will not have thousand hours of volunteering like many applicants who take GAP years to complete their apps. She will need to make the decision to apply in June 2024 or take a gap year but personally, I don’t see any down side to apply as traditional applicant, except for time and money but she may get accept or worst case, learn about the process for the next application .
. Yes, we are supporting our daughter but are not actively involved with her schooling or extracurriculars like when she was in HS.